How bad is the grind for exp and gear in this game?

[SirRagesAlot]

I played vindictus for a short time before, but then GW2 came out and I haven't been able to come back till now. I loved the gameplay, but even at around level 20 it was kinda getting slow.

I'm just curious at how bad the grind gets at the later levels. I've heard horror stories about how hard it is to gear up later on, but I just want clarification.

[Lunar Templar]

yeah, the jump feature realy only benifits Lann due to it being a smash attack and his relieance on crits.

none of the new bosses ae fun, most are border line cheap really

[Apperus]

naw naw jump is very useful in the game like fighting the pirate capt by playing jump rope with him for 10-15 mins. it was a very good thought out idea fron han jae ho.(sarcasm)

[Crunktanium]

Publicado originalmente por Lunar Templar:

i'm going to say no, you haven't, 'pay to win' vai merc pots and graces only works up to a point, having an over powered weapon and armor, only gets you so far. and that point, is far as raid bosses go Irukul, normal bosses, eh, can probably skate by up to one of the troll bosses before your lack of skill catches up and you start going through graces and merc pots hand over fist

I have been in the mid level raids with capped players fully decked and watched them fall like even the lowest levels. So easy as you claim these bosses to be would not explain why practically entire raids often wipe. More often then not it's also the capped players who seem to use graces more so then lower levels.I've yet to see more then a player or three at the most not die even once in mid level fights. Plus there is no direction or leadership whatsoever in raids and this simply leads to chaos more often then not.

There is simply no time between fights to give guidance and it's not like you can easily learn every boss in a session or two. I don't know very many who would want to sit doing the same fights over and over for 6-8 months just to reach cap and gear up. Maybe you enjoy that crap but i'd rather explore the content and move on to the next game until the next update. There are to many games some of which make Vindictus look pretty amateur and i want to play as many as possible.

I'm the one who keeps money flowing and rewards developers so they can produce new games and continue creating better content. Maybe some people don't like the idea of Play to Win but that's what most MMO's (esp Korean games) have become. I enjoyed farming my tail off in some other games because it's far more rewarding then Vindictus. And you think i need to spend money but i can already buy almost anything in Vindictus gear wise simply buying and selling certain items. Every piece of gear i bought or made was flipped at profit because i only invested in the best bits. Also because i spent a few minutes in the dye shop to make a matching set before selling.

Now you may dislike my play methods (which are totally within the rules) but many others complimented me for having the gear i had even as a new player. Even some mid level players seemed to think it was extremely hard to make money in the game. I found that many had no clue they could make more money by trading smart rather then vendoring every bit of loot. That or by crafting rather then selling certain mats for next to nothing. I invested a good chunk into crafting but the average new player can't afford to even consider that aspect early on (which is stupid) because of the randomness of drops and expense of rarer items that are required to level up.

Your right i don't know or even want to know about the higher level bosses. But your also wrong about players like me being bad for the game. Eventually when all the players like me have moved on there will be no income source to keep the servers running. So the players like you will be forced to get a job and come to understand that the rest of us don't care about the haters. It's just to bad that money has so little value to a company that would be flat broke at this point if not for it's Pay to Win customers.

[Apperus]

dying in the game is part of the learning process of understanding the bosses move and how to learn not to make the same mistake continuously during raids and normal boss runs, aside from lag/bugs. it just shows how most people who spend 2 win gimps them selves and relying on NX items (like u stated above) to play the game instead of learning how to poperly play the game. hell ive even met lvl 60-70 fionas that dont even know how to properly HSC and CA because they would use thier NX
to crutch themselves through the game without even learning all the basics and Do's/dont's.

the only real worth while thing to buy on cash shop is storage and occasionally feathers ,outfits.

i also have a question, what is your main character that you are playing as? if u dont mind answering.

[Crunktanium]

I don't play anymore because the support in the game is non existant. No point in wasting my time or money with a company that closes a ticket months later without even responding. This game is headed down the exact same path of Global Agenda which died as the direction of the game became a grind. Both games are on life support and only have players because of the F2P aspect. If they ever tried to sell Vindictus as a monthly sub the chargeback rate would be through the roof.

The only thing they really put effort into with this game was the sex appeal and skimpy outfits which are of course cash shop items. Also the PVP aspect is a total joke and totally one sided as whichever side has the most Fionas wins everytime. You mention Fionas which has to be the biggest joke of a class in the game. Not to mention certain classes have a much bigger advantage in various instances.

I'm not here to flex my wallet or my epeen just trying to save others from wasting time and money on this game.

[Apperus]

very true, that is the sole reason they created the character Vella. they made her jsut to attract new players.thats the only reason the servers arnt dead she amoung all other characters had a lot of work done on her 'flash'. She is the flashiest character doing things that don't even make sense (like gravitating enemies toward her. Who is she, evie?)

The fact remains that Vella was made to sell more money.that's why she was made. she's a badley made character majority of all her combos are recycled from lann, being able to counter from fiona, gravitating enemy from evie etc,

the game is going down hill the moment the new director took over vindictus.he is also nortorious for nearly destroying maple story and the origional mabinobi they also ruined other games like sudden attack and combat arms.they just leeching off players much as possable before the game just dies.

i have a slight hope since nexon is geting new management but even so the the damage has been done and is unfixable.

[Mordtziel]

Before I get started on this conversation that has sparked...

@OP The gear grind was pretty "bad" before in the sense that it aligned with your leveling(by the time you finished your set, your level was ready to enter the next area if you grinded for it all). Since I last played(prior to ignition and season 2 update), a lot of the gear crafting has become dramatically easier, not to mention the bosses now straight up drop gear if it doesn't contain the word "exquisite". Hell I just got a Swift Mail to drop today(worth 5 mil, turned it into Exquisite Black Hammer Mail and sold it for 9 mil). As long as you're using the marketplace to sell just about everything you get, you shouldn't have money problems until you reach the latest and greatest content(like when 44 was the cap, even blood prince was pricey, and when depths was new shining will costed a few million and is now only a couple hundred k, and teardrops right now from the current endgame are multiple hundreds of millions due to rarity and farming limits). So the gear grind is fine until you're at late game(as it is with most mmos).

As to this current conversation. Just because a player is high level and has good gear, doesn't mean they have any inkling of skill. You said you saw max level all decked out players dying to irukul? Rofl. I solo'd Irukul back when he was new and exciting without using graces. What's that tell you about them? That tells you that they're bad players. Gear in this game is not required outside of beating out the timer and to do that you don't need +10 gear, hell you don't even need +6 gear. Enchants? Unnecessary. AP? Necessary to a degree, that degree is based on the character you chose. Levels? Unnecessary outside of needing to be a certain level to enter. I'm level 70 right now, just finished crafting my 3 BH for the BH/Swift mix gear(yay now I get to make millions to make real gear xP). I have solo'd everything storyline wise up until Larken(haven't even attempted it yet, calm down). That includes: Irukul, Black Belly, Klaus, Blood Lord, and Hero White/Red Tyrant. Outside of story, I've solo'd Ancient Elchulus from the 40 minute mark until he died at the 2 minute mark(yea you heard me), as well as having solo'd Ahglan. Again, no graces, no support from other players.

Honestly, if you haven't seen anything beyond Klaus(final raid boss of Hilder Forest, level 56), you don't even know what the true difficulty of this game is. The game very quickly picks up in difficulty after that, especially when you reach the sewers when they started playing with physics mechanics. And the new season 2 bosses? at the very least 50-69 bracket? Please...if you needed graces for irukul, you'll need to spend hundreds of dollars to kill even the 2nd boss, and god help you if you kill blackwing first.

And do people like you keep the game afloat by buying in-game currency? No, no you don't. You know who keeps them afloat? The people that bought those $100 and $200 wings. And you better believe that a large number of people bought those things. People with +10-+15 gear? Yea they help keep them afloat too. People like you that buy in-game currency do nothing but hurt the developer, and the in-game community.

[Lunar Templar]

Publicado originalmente por teabag:

I have been in the mid level raids with capped players fully decked and watched them fall like even the lowest levels. So easy as you claim these bosses to be would not explain why practically entire raids often wipe. More often then not it's also the capped players who seem to use graces more so then lower levels.I've yet to see more then a player or three at the most not die even once in mid level fights. Plus there is no direction or leadership whatsoever in raids and this simply leads to chaos more often then not.

really -.- then ether they're playing it on Hero mode, or they're just terrible players that deserver to have their money taken from them. I've been around long enough to know that you pretty much have to suck horribly at the game it self to lose to the 'mid range' raid bosses. more so if they where at the cap and fully geared as you say. the other alturnative is the boss was just released. donno when you played so no time fram as to what was getting people killed/'top tier gear.

the lack of leadership isn't new though, raids have always been like that, unless some one wants the break off then you shouldn't be expecting to be told to 'hit it till it falls down'.

though i have read how people are having problems with The Karken due to this, since it REQUIRES the team to function as a team to win.

when it's not glitching and banning people anyway

There is simply no time between fights to give guidance and it's not like you can easily learn every boss in a session or two. I don't know very many who would want to sit doing the same fights over and over for 6-8 months just to reach cap and gear up. Maybe you enjoy that crap but i'd rather explore the content and move on to the next game until the next update. There are to many games some of which make Vindictus look pretty amateur and i want to play as many as possible.

your suppossed to learn as you go by paying attention to the bosses, and yes, you can learn the bosses 'in a season or two' its less a matter of diffaculty and more a willingness to actually LEARN.

:D Hi, I'm Lunar Templar, and i farm bosses for gear i've no interest in using beyond the attached story.

CAUSE I ENJOY THE COMBAT MECHINCS MORE THEN THE GEAR, i've picked fights with raid bosses, alone, or as a duo for fun. usually win to :D (baring the boss doesn't sit on me like my Vella's first Thor run -.- yay for cheap deaths)

I'm the one who keeps money flowing and rewards developers so they can produce new games and continue creating better content. Maybe some people don't like the idea of Play to Win but that's what most MMO's (esp Korean games) have become. I enjoyed farming my tail off in some other games because it's far more rewarding then Vindictus. And you think i need to spend money but i can already buy almost anything in Vindictus gear wise simply buying and selling certain items. Every piece of gear i bought or made was flipped at profit because i only invested in the best bits. Also because i spent a few minutes in the dye shop to make a matching set before selling.

dood, EVERY ONE tries to get their gear to match, thats nothing new. you should have seen the pissing and moaning about the dye system in open beta/around launch.

I have no problem throwing money at Nexon, its a F2P game so funds gotta come from somewhere. the problem is that Nexon is run by idiots. they aren't doing anything to keep players around so they can spend money, they aren't giving players like me, who've been they're for-♥♥♥♥♥♥♥-ever, a reason to break normal spending habits (storage/avatar items when needed, the occasinal Mer Pots/Grace aquisition), and just adding a 'new thing to buy for an event' isn't good enough, sure, there was a near constant stream of po ups saying X player got Y things from box Z, but that really just breeds contempt.

Now you may dislike my play methods (which are totally within the rules) but many others complimented me for having the gear i had even as a new player. Even some mid level players seemed to think it was extremely hard to make money in the game. I found that many had no clue they could make more money by trading smart rather then vendoring every bit of loot. That or by crafting rather then selling certain mats for next to nothing. I invested a good chunk into crafting but the average new player can't afford to even consider that aspect early on (which is stupid) because of the randomness of drops and expense of rarer items that are required to level up.

I've actully lost respect for you as a player when you said you bought the gold for your gear as oppessed to earning it. things like that irk me.

random, but not unmanageable, and not that bad. I took 2 days to craft a brand new Chuilin Set from scratch, that ones kind of a pain in the ass due to all the Exquisite ore you need, and i'm starting on the Ingkara set (which is equally as bad due to all the long belts)

Your right i don't know or even want to know about the higher level bosses. But your also wrong about players like me being bad for the game. Eventually when all the players like me have moved on there will be no income source to keep the servers running. So the players like you will be forced to get a job and come to understand that the rest of us don't care about the haters. It's just to bad that money has so little value to a company that would be flat broke at this point if not for it's Pay to Win customers.

I have spent money on the games cash shop. for avatar items, and storage. (i have, every armor set in the game with a quest tied to it, except the FrostHeart Hunter, Swift, Kakrish, Ingkara, and Vehemnce sets. so i NEED the space), hell, right now my Vella is chillen with a VIP Cap, a Cadet badge and some merc pots and Graces that came with the package deal that got me the VIP cap and Badge. i don't die much so the Graces just kinda sit there

also. I have 2 jobs :D next half assed assumption, granted, i was unemplyed for a year, but now i'm not and i can go back to my normal spending habits and take cae of my character's needs (mostly Storage related though)

players who buy gold ARE bad for the game, Nexon doesn't get a cut of that money, despite what you think (they don't care about the player base as a whole, what makes you think the gold sellers gestier on the radar ether? that would require them to pay attention for a change). all buying gold does is ♥♥♥♥ up the in game economy, and make it harder for legit players to do anything cause prices are set to the 'gold buyer' standard, not the 'average player' standard

[Lunar Templar]

Publicado originalmente por ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥:

I've solo'd Ancient Elchulus from the 40 minute mark until he died at the 2 minute mark(yea you heard me), as well as having solo'd Ahglan. Again, no graces, no support from other players.

best i've done with Ahglan is a dou with a good friend of mine, it was a Fio/Lann combo.

same friend who usually goes along with my insane 'hey, lets go duo this guy that can probably kick out asses sideways' ideas XD

as to soloing Ancient Echulus. I have no words.
1) how bad did things have to go to GET that way
2) what kind of super god gear do you have to give you the damage out put you'd need to pull that off o.0. cause i wants.

lastly, you wouldn't happen to be that one Spear Lann with the 2 part Irukul video people where passing around on the forums a while back would ya?

[Mordtziel]

same friend who usually goes along with my insane 'hey, lets go duo this guy that can probably kick out asses sideways' ideas XD

Heh that's me too...except it's usually "I'm'a go solo this cuz I have no friends...RAWR!"

as to soloing Ancient Echulus. I have no words.
1) how bad did things have to go to GET that way

Well...it was towards the early days of his release. When few people could dodge his attacks.

2) what kind of super god gear do you have to give you the damage out put you'd need to pull that off o.0. cause i wants.

Back then I was full Shining Will(2 star)...I don't remember if I had my DWLS yet or if I was still using my Ivory /shrug And elchy isn't THAT tough...at least not for 24 people. Most runs now are only 20-30 minutes. He only has 3 mil health and nowadays with my full swift and +6 pain DWLS I typically do between 6%(180k) and 15%(450k) of the damage depending on who shows. I mean I wish it showed raw damage but if you figure that maybe I do 15% per 30 minutes, 58 minute fight would mean around 30% of the damage would be me, except when I have the boss focusing me, that means I get off more counters and easier to place Amaranths so the output would be even higher(probably closer to 40-50% of his health, so I would have only needed the group to do 50-60% in that first 20 minutes).

lastly, you wouldn't happen to be that one Spear Lann with the 2 part Irukul video people where passing around on the forums a while back would ya?

Long Sword Small Shield Fiona from day one until the end of time! And you better believe I foamed at the mouth when I learned of the sword buff D: I have a whopping 1 video out there of me on Vindictus, and I wouldn't consider it pro(hero....I wanna say it was white tyrant lol)

[Lunar Templar]

Publicado originalmente por ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥:

Heh that's me too...except it's usually "I'm'a go solo this cuz I have no friends...RAWR!"

those are always the best times aren't they :D

Well...it was towards the early days of his release. When few people could dodge his attacks.

and some still don't .... not to mention all the lowbies that like to show up -.-

Elchy isn't THAT tough...at least not for 24 people. Most runs now are only 20-30 minutes.

last one i ran was closer to 40, WAY to many level 40-50s -.-

he's not that tough over all, his tells are pretty easy to read, on my Fio i've pretty much got him down to the point of not needing to heal, course, every one else is another matter.

Long Sword Small Shield Fiona from day one until the end of time! And you better believe I foamed at the mouth when I learned of the sword buff D: I have a whopping 1 video out there of me on Vindictus, and I wouldn't consider it pro(hero....I wanna say it was white tyrant lol)

:D Longsword Fio here as well or, was, Vella's kinda every thing i wanted from Lann so i kinda switched.

i have a few, mostly to show my friends who don't play the stuff i've done, none on hero though, no use for that mode

[Mordtziel]

those are always the best times aren't they :D

I suppose until you have to fight something like king cockblock at the ship graveyard >=O thank god the final hit of r9 Ivy Sweep somehow sneaks around the back from the front >.>

and some still don't .... not to mention all the lowbies that like to show up -.-

Which is really surprising to me...I mean I expect people to still be leveling up and it's new for them....but lol I joined one the other day there were only 3 of us above 50...and the rest were mostly clueless(luckily a couple were alts and could actually aim the ballistae).

he's not that tough over all, his tells are pretty easy to read, on my Fio i've pretty much got him down to the point of not needing to heal, course, every one else is another matter.

Yea the only thing I really have left to work towards on that fight is maintaining the battle focus buff. Well that and finding exactly where those invincibility frames are on the dodge roll for those damned balls of '♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ now I have to run across the entire map'.

:D Longsword Fio here as well or, was, Vella's kinda every thing i wanted from Lann so i kinda switched.

I don't think I could enjoy playing anything other than Fiona :x I tried Kai and it just felt so easy that I was disgusted with it(mind you, only level 50 but still).

i have a few, mostly to show my friends who don't play the stuff i've done, none on hero though, no use for that mode

I would probably sit down and release more videos but the lag doesn't make the fights any easier...maybe when I get around to upgrading my computer some more :x

[Certified Fentanyl Dealer]

To answer the OP and get this thread back on track:

It's the platinum standard for grind. Just to finish a side quest you need 8 rare items and the drop rate for them is extremely low. To get high level armor you can expect to run the same dungeon at least 60-80 times just to get enough of one crafting material.

Your only choice to get any of the high-end equipment (not even the endgame stuff) pretty much is to buy in-game currency from farmers because the game's economy is so badly broken. Items selling for hundreds of millions of gold is an everyday occurence.

[Mordtziel]

Publicado originalmente por Dr. Cripples:

To answer the OP and get this thread back on track:

It's the platinum standard for grind. Just to finish a side quest you need 8 rare items and the drop rate for them is extremely low. To get high level armor you can expect to run the same dungeon at least 60-80 times just to get enough of one crafting material.

Your only choice to get any of the high-end equipment (not even the endgame stuff) pretty much is to buy in-game currency from farmers because the game's economy is so badly broken. Items selling for hundreds of millions of gold is an everyday occurence.

Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wroooooooong. You obviously haven't looked at the recent changes. Most crafts have been dramatically reduced in crafting material needs. Black Hammer Boots used to require roughly 18 exquisite ore, 30 fine fobellow tin, 9 pairs of centurion boots, 12 spiked bones, 15 warlord boots, swift boots, and i think it used to require horned belts too...now? 6 Exquisite Ore, 3 Fine Fobellow Tin, 3 Warlord's Boots, and Swift Boots....that's it. Heck if you're incredibly lucky, you'll get all of that in one run.

[Lunar Templar]

Publicado originalmente por ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥:

Well that and finding exactly where those invincibility frames are on the dodge roll for those damned balls of '♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ now I have to run across the entire map'.

that made me laugh

:D Longsword Fio here as well or, was, Vella's kinda every thing i wanted from Lann so i kinda switched.

I don't think I could enjoy playing anything other than Fiona :x I tried Kai and it just felt so easy that I was disgusted with it(mind you, only level 50 but still).[/quote]

Vella has the good bits of Fio and Lann, with the added bonus of being able to slap all forms of projectile back at what ever threw it at you. I was able to get mastery over Cross Strike/Double Cross with all the time i spent as a Fio, so you shouldn't have to step a learning curve there.

and Kai IS boring, if i wanna throw a stick at something i'll use spears