A few questions from a returning gtr2 fan....

[Cenobite]

Hey guys, has been a while since I have played a Simbin game, used to play GTR1 and 2, and toyed with their addons before moving to Iracing for multi.

I play Assetto C which is obviously fantastic at this point but still remember ISI to be a closer feel to my personal driving experience, I know, this is akin to debating religion....lol

So really my questions mainly pertain to DTM experience, one, how's DTM compare to other simbin products? Still the fantastic AI and ISI physics of old?

Two, how's the visuals? Still using the same graphics engine? From what I have seen its vastly improved, how does it compare to Rfactor 2? (Didn't find this impressive), or even AC?

Three, how does DTM run on triples? I have a good rig that runs Iracing with triples maxed at a solid 130fps (more most likely, I limit to 130), and assetto on triples at around 80-90fps with most bells and whistles with a 10 car field.
I havnt run a simbin product on triples but I would expect it to be thirsty on resources.

Rig:
core I7 3930k
32 gb 2133 ram
250gb ssd
Gtx 780 3gbs SLI.

Four, is the FF still as good as it used to be? Any one have issues with running a CWB?

Five, does the pedal axis have a max travel deadzone to accommodate for load sensors?

Thanks for any help on my questions guys.

[yusupov]

free to play for a reason! :)

afaik DTM-E uses the exact same engine, both graphics & physics, the cars & tracks are designed by the same guys (& the same as their R3E equivalent if there is one, not sure about DTM, but you can test all adac GT3 cars & one track out right now for that upcoming dlc),

i dont have DTM as im waiting for the 2014, but by all accounts ive heard their recently implented multiplayer (also coming to R3E within a cpl months) is already phenomenal.

my opinions -- for all the cars & tracks available there is still a lot of work to do at the core & the devs themselves acknowledge this. tbh it feels fairly lifeless in terms of physics & tire model compared to what you get in AC or rf2 (which you may want to try again if you havent in a long while, i think its excellent myself). i find AC & rf2 very different, but respectably so, i defintiely peg R3E below them in terms of feel.

graphically the game is fine to very good but it needs optimization quite badly; i have to run it at lower settings than any other title. with 780 SLI though you shouldnt have too much to worry about ;)

[HarrierDuBois]

Messaggio originale di Cenobite:

...load a questions...

Hi Cenobite,

1. AI has been rebuilt from scratch. They're using an adaptive system so there's no fixed settings to choose from. It's rather intricate, calculates multiple averages to get the AI closer to your performance. Atm they do better on some tracks than on others, still optimization needed but I generally enjoy battling them.

I like the physics, others didn't, but the general opinion tends towards "they're getting there". Recent releases showed good progress. DTM cars are relatively easy to drive, not too much hassle with those, but from all I've heard it seems to be realistic, DTM cars are fairly easy to drive.
One highlight: The Audi Quattro, most fun virtual racing car in years, at least for me, love it.

2. They've developed/improved the old graphics engine, and I think the results are decent. Would have liked it to be a bit.... more... ;) but it looks alright and on your machine you'll be able to make it sparkle.
Compared to rFactor I like this a lot better. Idk if I'm too stupid but I never got rFactor to look like it does in some of those screenshots/vids.
Car models, especially when driving, are a tad less beautiful than in AC, but I find the tracks in AC to look really dull, I like R3Es more lively and diverse look.

3. I have no first hand experience with triples but there is no native SLI support as of now and I read from some people they are having major problems. They can run it but only on rather low settings, compared to what their rig is capable of. Devs have acknowledged the need for true SLI-sup, no idea when though...

4. FFB is still being investigated, it wasn't good for many and just lately it received a major update. Many of those who critizised it are happy now, it actually feels pretty good now.
But Simbin is still working on it, ironing out some flaws, and from what I read, we're in for a treat. ^^
I think I know some guys who are using the CSW and I haven't heard any complaints, should work fine (after getting it set/configured right, there's a thread at RD for tips and settings).

5. Erm... ya? ;) Not sure what you mean. There are the usual centre deadzones but I think you mean something different.

Cheers

Christian

[Peter]

Physics engine is a improved gmotor2 engine (ImmersiDrive™), but the grafics engine is the new RendR™ engine

[Cenobite]

Ok, alot of changes, thanks for taking the time to reply guys.
I would download race room experience but my cap has suffered hard installing summer sale purchases, wolfenstein 40+ Gb for one!

So the new ISI physics engine is worse than the old?

[HarrierDuBois]

Messaggio originale di Cenobite:

So the new ISI physics engine is worse than the old?

The game is worth checking out. Starting tomorrow there will be a summer sale. 50% off everything in R3E and off DTM. Talk about timing. ;) http://admin.getanewsletter.com/t/v/3_ODYyMTE0MDQ0/

Personally I think the physics are great. Hard to say if I like em better than Race/GTR though. I find them to be more "lively" if that makes any sense to you, not as clinical. They weren't great a few months ago, but lately Simbin improved em a lot.

[Cenobite]

Great analogy, nice timing on the sale. Looks like I may try to stretch the DL cap.

One more question if possible, AI worse or better than GTR2/Race?

[yusupov]

Messaggio originale di Cenobite:

Ok, alot of changes, thanks for taking the time to reply guys.
I would download race room experience but my cap has suffered hard installing summer sale purchases, wolfenstein 40+ Gb for one!

So the new ISI physics engine is worse than the old?

yeah, i just had the cap problem for the mumblemumble time this year, finally gave in & raised my bandwidth limit...the upside is i get faster (max speed) downloads now, for some reason...but yeah, its gotten to the point where i havent even considered wolfenstein just bc of the size. ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ isp bloodsuckers.

[HarrierDuBois]

Messaggio originale di Cenobite:

Great analogy, nice timing on the sale. Looks like I may try to stretch the DL cap.

One more question if possible, AI worse or better than GTR2/Race?

Right now, depends on the track/car combo. Some are ok, on others they brake late and bump into you.
So you shouldn't expect Race/GTR type AI atm, especially not across the board.
But it's really not as bad as it might sound right now, I had some great battles with the AI and especially when interacting with each other they already do a pretty good job. They are active and actually fight for positions, and make mistakes while trying. It's mainly the AI 2 player behaviour that needs some tuning.

Well, everything I wrote is of course from my personal pov, others might see it differently. But as there's not too much oposition to what I wrote before... ;)

[Hiigara]

I prefer rF2 as best physics and FFB feel. R3E and DTM exp have by far the best car park and sound but the FFB / physics feel stay behind rF2 and AC. AS a stand alone i think R3E could feel nice but in comparison with rF2 and AC the handeling van the cars feels arcadisch but fun.
At the moment i rate rF2 as best sim follow up GTR 2 because of the 24 hour clock, implemented weather, pitstops and the awesome AI.

[yusupov]

i dont think the physics are close to 'arcade' (grid autosport would be arcade like physics, & given that need for speed is around, itd still be classed as simcade even in physics i imagine). i feel like theyre sim, just...sorta not really there. as said, some cars are better than others. the audi & the m1 procar are easily my two favorites so far in pretty limited time.

[yusupov]

audi quattro of course, havent tried the gt3 car yet

[Cenobite]

Yeah yusupov, some of these download sizes are getting beyond a joke, but if you like old school shooter feel with a believable twist, Wolfenstein is the go, can be a little ugly tho, and slow to get started.

Thanks everyone for the good info again, perfectly explained, sounds like simbin are making positive moves, about to check the store to see if the sales up yet.

Will grab Rfactor 2 again bobby, after being disappointed with the visuals compared to what I had viewed online (I had he same problem Christian), I didn't give it a good run, I'm sure it's fantastic.

I want to move away from Iracing, the time investment is just too great, and honestly, the physics have never felt fully relatable to me. (Again it's a religion thing)...lol

Jumping on AC sort of snapped me out of it, I forgot how great physics can be, hence my interest again in simbin.

Anyway, thanks for the info guys, was a lot of help.

[kmanitou81]

Messaggio originale di Boby Kim:

I prefer rF2 as best physics and FFB feel. R3E and DTM exp have by far the best car park and sound but the FFB / physics feel stay behind rF2 and AC. AS a stand alone i think R3E could feel nice but in comparison with rF2 and AC the handeling van the cars feels arcadisch but fun.
At the moment i rate rF2 as best sim follow up GTR 2 because of the 24 hour clock, implemented weather, pitstops and the awesome AI.

I used to feel like you, but like in any racing game, some cars or types of cars are better than others. I love the physics and FFB or rF2, but the slick tires just don't have the correct grip, and playing online is a pain.
I find Aseetto Corsa to be way too forgiving. It's complex, but I find it's a step back from nKP.
The new cars in Raceroom, including ADAC, finally have decent physics while remaining lively and dynamic, something Shift tried to do as well, albeit miserably.

If Simbin can connect the FFB to the physics a bit better, it will be my favourite by far. For now, I'll just have to juggle a bit, including Game Stock Car and Race 07. rF2 is in a class of its own, but they are not willing to look at the handling problems because they think they're right, a bit like how iRacing used to be iceRacing. ISI is just behind the times and Assetto Corsa wants to make it too easy.

[yusupov]

so the adac cars are current model, new GT3 cars & not the gt3 cars currently in game? sorry if its a silly question, i naturally chose the mercedes because it had the new car smell so i havent compared them at all yet.

if different, will the R3E cars be upgraded?

[kmanitou81]

Messaggio originale di yusupov:

so the adac cars are current model, new GT3 cars & not the gt3 cars currently in game? sorry if its a silly question, i naturally chose the mercedes because it had the new car smell so i havent compared them at all yet.

if different, will the R3E cars be upgraded?

There is very little info so far, but having tried them, I don't think any of the ADAC stuff is taken from the game, just like the DTM is separate from RR. The new GT3 cars feel tight, solid, and they all have very different feels. You should try them all! Maybe the GT3 cars in RR are already good, but I don't have any of them to compare.
They also plan to revisit the old cars from RR to update them to new standards. It makes sense too, because the free cars are pretty bad compared with what is available now.