Does the solution for the 7th bird puzzle required some audio isolation software?

[himmatsj]

I've completed 10 lasers, on my final one(?) in the forest with the birds.

I mean seriously I am at my wits end here. I have spent FIVE ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ hours trying to do this. I can brute force it, there are 81 possible solutions. But that won't have meaning.

Just tell me if this needs some audio isolation software cause me ears can't tell the whistles apart.

Also, can you confirm, for this final puzzle, I ought to be IGNORING the birds chirping, and focus on the whistling?

Edit: Also, just to confirm, the 6th puzzle also requires you to ignore the birds chirping, yes?

[jfryk]

You have to ignore all but one source for all of those puzzles. Try ruling some out by counting the notes.

[himmatsj]

Originally posted by jfryk:

You have to ignore all but one source for all of those puzzles. Try ruling some out by counting the notes.

So man, in simple terms. For the seventh puzzle, do I listen to the birds chirping or not? Or do I listen to the whistling?

[jfryk]

It depends on the puzzle. You have to figure out which one is correct each time.

If you can post a screenshot of the 7th one I might be able to help more.

[himmatsj]

Ok, so basically, do all the puzzles in the jungle (the seven puzzles) require you to listen to the birds chirping, or other sounds too? For the fifth and sixth, I partially and fully ignored the chirping sounds.

Also, is this puzzle sensible like the rest? Like I said, I've completed 10 lasers, I found the rest of the game to be fairly logical. THis doesn't seem logical. Five hours and I'm getting nowhere.

[The Renderer]

There are more than seven, so we naturally don't know which one you talk about unless you give us a screen shot.


All I can say is that you need to listen to the birds, of which there are two variants, probably what you call the "chirping" and the "whistling" kind. You sometimes get other sounds that you can ignore and you sometimes get more than one bird so you need to figure out (or try) which of those you hear is the right one.

[trevormobbs]

In each puzzle, only ONE source of sound will actually correspond to the puzzle in front of you. The right number of notes, or the right length of notes in the puzzles where the lengths aren't equal.

Listen to that one.

[Scyto]

As some one who is currently deaf in one ear with severe tinnitus this puzzle is terrible. Talk about a lack of accesibility. I am on one which has 4 segements short, short, long, short. A wolf howls when the birds start. There are two high chirps and then 3 whistles, i think the whistles are low high mid (not sure) but that is 5 bird noises. If iwas to assume the two chirps is a different bird then i only have 3 noises, not enough to complete the puzzle. Am i supposed to treat the chiprs as one noise. (i think this is piuzzle 6 of this sequence - in the trees at the south of the island. This puzzle is clever but poorly cosnidered and implemented in my opinion. I don't want the patters as answer - just the approach give i *get* the puzzle it is the execution i struggle with due to loss of heairng. Blow is a dumbass for this one.

[Scyto]

oh the wolf noise is not a dstraction it is an long single multivariant tone you have to figure out - fukcing stupid puzzle, i figured it out on my own. I don't feel smart. The puzze is dumb, its sequencing is dumb - introducing spurious sounds over the chip noise and learning to ignore them and then introducing the long tones that sound like a femal fox and not a bird. It should introduce the long tones first so you know they are valid noise. It is just a p.i.s.s-poorly contructed puzzle. I should be clear this is the first bird puzzle i found, i have been playing for 4 hours and not lit any lights. Perhaps they teach you in some other bird puzzle... no idea...

[Scyto]

And i also can't figure out the 7th song (at south of island near dock) like the OP - I can hear the two different birds but they smoosh together into audio i can't seperate/discriminate.

--edit--
i cheated, even knowing the solution i can't hear those noises (could for the other 6) stupid / terrible puzzle. Pointless having subtitrles for video and audio logs as the game is impossible to complete if you are deaf.

[trevormobbs]

Originally posted by Scyto:

oh the wolf noise is not a dstraction it is an long single multivariant tone you have to figure out - fukcing stupid puzzle, i figured it out on my own. I don't feel smart. The puzze is dumb, its sequencing is dumb - introducing spurious sounds over the chip noise and learning to ignore them and then introducing the long tones that sound like a femal fox and not a bird. It should introduce the long tones first so you know they are valid noise. It is just a p.i.s.s-poorly contructed puzzle. I should be clear this is the first bird puzzle i found, i have been playing for 4 hours and not lit any lights. Perhaps they teach you in some other bird puzzle... no idea...

Well, in that case you must think that a lof ot the VISUAL puzzles are poorly constructed as well, because many of them perform the same kind of trick. There are visual puzzles where first you have to pay attention to shadows, then to light. There are visual puzzles where first you have to rely on the panel, then realise on a later puzzle that the panel is lying to you.

In fact the whole point of MANY of the sequences of puzzles is to trap you with an incomplete understanding of what the rule is, so that you then think the next puzzle is "wrong" when in fact it's your understanding of the rule is wrong.

This is a classic illustration. Time and again, people decide that because the first sound was a bird, they must always listen to "a bird" rather than to "a sound".

[Scyto]

Originally posted by trevormobbs:

Well, in that case you must think that a lof ot the VISUAL puzzles are poorly constructed as well, because many of them perform the same kind of trick. There are visual puzzles where first you have to pay attention to shadows, then to light. There are visual puzzles where first you have to rely on the panel, then realise on a later puzzle that the panel is lying to you.

In fact the whole point of MANY of the sequences of puzzles is to trap you with an incomplete understanding of what the rule is, so that you then think the next puzzle is "wrong" when in fact it's your understanding of the rule is wrong.

This is a classic illustration. Time and again, people decide that because the first sound was a bird, they must always listen to "a bird" rather than to "a sound".

then you missed my point. this is because one is hard of hearing. Putting subtitles into a game doesn't make it accessible if there are audio only puzzles that require high levels of hearing discrimination. Especially as fairly good job has been done on the visual puzzles tro reduce color blindness issues. Its just very disappointing. Also now 8 hours in, i don't feel the visual puzzles have changed the rules unreasonably or unpredictably or have been unfailry or poorly contructed. Given some folks above had this as a late game puzzle they could not complete i would argue it betrays the nature of learning rules for one purely of how good your hearing is. It is the antithesis of the rest of the way the game is constructed. There is no way to 'learn' the new rule and execute it. I get you may not agree. That't why they are opinions. I think mine is right :-p

[trevormobbs]

Originally posted by Scyto:

then you missed my point. this is because one is hard of hearing. Putting subtitles into a game doesn't make it accesible if there are audio only puzzles that require high levels of hearing discrimination. Especially as fairly good job has been done on the visual puzzles tro reduce color blindness issues. Its just very dissapointing.

That's a completely different issue and not the one you talked about. I accept that the puzzles require hearing discrimination, but you were arguing that all 'valid' sounds ought to be introduced before all 'invalid' ones.

That's not a hearing issue, that's a cognition issue. A person with perfect hearing can be tricked into focusing on the bird rather than the long tones in exactly the same way as a person with hearing issues can.

In fact that's exactly the way the puzzle is trying to fool people. The whole point is that people will complain that the puzzle "doesn't match the bird", because they've set up the expectation that the bird is what the puzzle must match.

A hearing issue is if you can't actually hear each noise. It's not a hearing issue if you can hear each noise, but are trying to match the wrong one to the puzzle.

[Scyto]

Originally posted by trevormobbs:

Originally posted by Scyto:

then you missed my point. this is because one is hard of hearing. Putting subtitles into a game doesn't make it accesible if there are audio only puzzles that require high levels of hearing discrimination. Especially as fairly good job has been done on the visual puzzles tro reduce color blindness issues. Its just very dissapointing.

That's a completely different issue and not the one you talked about. I accept that the puzzles require hearing discrimination, but you were arguing that all 'valid' sounds ought to be introduced before all 'invalid' ones.

That's not a hearing issue, that's a cognition issue. A person with perfect hearing can be tricked into focusing on the bird rather than the long tones in exactly the same way as a person with hearing issues can. In fact that's exactly the way the puzzle is trying to fool people.

see my edit above - i disagree with you (but respect your opinion) also telling me i have a cognition issue is pretty condescending.

[trevormobbs]

EVERYONE has a cognition issue. The entire game is about that. That's what a puzzle is!

[Scyto]

No, you don't say, i hadn't realized, thanks for educating me, doh i was dumb unti you came along and gave me the benefit of your huge wisdom. I believe it is actually about perception. It is about how different people will see different things and take different meaning from what they discover. The congnition is the toolset one uses during the game. Don't confuse the how and what with the why.

And 11 hours in I still haven't discovered any other puzzle I would call badly designed, unfair or illogical.