I don't understand the praise for this game.

[Jiggaman2000]

Here's another "dumb" internet comment.

I played this over at a buddy's house for 2-3 hours and simply gave up. Being stuck for 0-10 minutes at a puzzle (rinse, repeat) with no driving force/motivation behind them, is not a good experience (unless you're looking for strictly a puzzle game, keep reading for alternatives).

To be blunt, aside from the island and a bunch of snake type puzzles, there really isn't much to it. Let's face it, the eye candy that is the island quickly becomes forgettable and doesn't quite leave a mark. The low-poly look of it felt sterile and lifeless. And the fact that interaction is mostly done by proxy also didn't help.

With respect to the puzzles, the constant rule shifts made me feel as if in some convoluted "teach a man to fish for a lifetime" scenario. In certain cases, with the colored paint blocks, solving them outright won't work and it can be quite a jarring/frustrating experience (you have to look at them from a different perspective).

Another part that I noticed is that some of the puzzles feature, what I like to call, "artificial difficulty." What do I mean by that? Basically the difficulty stems not from the puzzle itself but from an outside source. Having recently witnessed (no pun intended) the speedrun of the game, and in the later part (in the mountain) some puzzles feature an obstructed layout, rotating layout, moving layout, flickering colors, etc. To me, that is not a well designed puzzle.

In essence, for a (more cohesive) puzzle experience in similar vein, a mobile game such as Lyne or Flow Free would suffice (for a much lower price). This in turn makes The Witness not a good running candidate. My guess is that if Jonathan's name wasn't attached to it, this would most likely try and float average on Metacritic.

[Curious Duck]

The puzzles aren't hard to understand. The logic is done in a way where it allows you to learn it gradually.

It seems that most people dislike the game because they don't understand the puzzles.

[Paul]

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/116783-The-Witness-Bombshell-Review

sounds spot on to me.

[Starbug]

Aesthetically beautiful, but one wonders if the game's core mechanics would have been better placed on Android / Ios. Trying to make an AAA-priced puzzle game on PC is a big job for a small niche.

[Caldor]

AAA priced? It is 40 dollars. Not something never before seen for indie games. And if people do not like the price, well it will probably come on sale one day.

I have to say the puzzles are rather brilliant all the ones I have tried so far. You really have to think outside the box very often.

And yes, it is a puzzle game, through and through. Who would expect it to be an action game? Has anyone made that claim?

Its puzzles and they get bigger and bigger. And there seem to keep popping new ones up. I have found about 4 times of puzzles I could not figure out yet. And probably 8-10 types I did figure out, and they all begin being used with each other. 8-10 types probably cannot do it. I have solved more than 200 puzzles now, probably 300 as well. They use everything they can to make puzzles with in this game it seems.

[Caldor]

AAA games are usually priced 60-80 dollars on release, and then you can often expect to find DLCs for another 40 dollars or more if its from EA and some other devs as well.

[alter_ukko]

I wouldn't consider this a "dumb internet comment" (although I disagree with a lot of it).

It's hard to argue against what you're saying without spoilers, but the epiphany effect of this game, the very careful design, and the sheer size and detail of the island are what make it so outstanding for me (I also really like the art style and the shader work).

I agree that things like flickering or scrolling puzzles aren't great puzzle design, but some of the puzzles go way beyond the inventiveness of Flow Free. The elevator puzzle in the swamp, for example. That should be taught in game design school.

I'd disagree that there are any "rule shifts" going on. Earlier puzzles of a particular type might not exploit all the rules, but those rules are in force throughout. Is there an example where you think the rules actually change?

The main contrast with puzzle games like Lyne or Flow Free is that the Witness is about perspective, vantage and attentiveness in a way those other games are not. It also has an entire dimension of figuring out the rules that isn't present in those other games. And there is a "meta" relationship between a lot of the puzzles and the game world that I haven't seen in *any* casual puzzle game.

[Naysayer]

This is questionable but reading the OP I do not believe the poster really played the game, thus this discussion has been moved.

[Ottofyre]

Originally posted by Jiggaman2000:

no driving force/motivation behind them

Honestly, my take on it is the game is for people who don't need external motivation to explore and learn. It's for people who are naturally curious and driven to discover things just for the sake of the discovery itself.

[Ashabel]

I agree with the idea that this is a dumb internet comment because of the user's language. He tries to put forth the pretense of having spent plentiful time with the game, but then he claims that the puzzles are separate from the environment, while the environment is just "eye candy". Given that the environment is about half of the puzzles, that doesn't match his claim that he played the game.

He also uses "Let's face it." as a setup for his argument, which is an inhrently unpleasant and manipulative setup. The implication of that turn of phrase is that it's the absolute truth and anyone who argues is in simply in denial; it's hard for me to take someone who uses it seriously.

[Ottofyre]

Originally posted by Jiggaman2000:

a mobile game such as Lyne or Flow Free would suffice (for a much lower price).

Missed this when I first read your post.

I own Lyne here on Steam and Flow Free on my phone and.. this provides a totally different experience than those two games do. So I completely disagree that either of them would suffice as a replacement for this.

I've mentioned this elsewhere but - I think The Witness is the most beautiful and brillaint game I have ever played.

Other games I've played have had moments of brilliance, but this game - in my opinion - has brillance packed into every corner.

From the opening scene where the game immediately gives you control without intruding into the expereince to the the little discoveries like the koi in the water that turned out to be a reflection of the roots from the outcropping above to the audio logs where, if you don't fight againt their message, can help you see our own world through new eyes.

It actually makes me a little sad that some people don't experience any sense of wonder from playing this game.

[alter_ukko]

Originally posted by Hiirazz:

It actually makes me a little sad that some people don't experience any sense of wonder from playing this game.

Me too. I also find myself getting more annoyed by the negative comments than I do with most games. Uninformed and nasty comments are pretty much everywhere about every game, and I understand how that works and why it doesn't really matter. I also understand how people are often reacting to the game's creator, whom they've decided is an a**hole for whatever reason.

It's different with the Witness. My wife, who I keep incessantly telling about all of the amazing things I find in this game, said at one point, "It sounds like a game that someone created specifically for you". And that's what it kind of feels like. And there are so few games that feel like that to me that the dismissive comments about it feel a little like insults toward the sort of person I am.

Maybe that isn't particularly rational -- but I've been called "weird" by so many people for what basically amounts to curiosity that the dismissals just strike a nerve.

[Father Creamy]

Originally posted by Paul:

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/116783-The-Witness-Bombshell-Review

sounds spot on to me.

"Cereal box puzzles" is an accurate description for the majority of puzzles. Maybe you're living in the mind of a cereal box puzzle designer as they traverse the colorful lands of the cereal world, while the stone statues represent the capitalist side of the sugary market. (lazy theory)

[Ottofyre]

Originally posted by Father Creamy:

Originally posted by Paul:

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/116783-The-Witness-Bombshell-Review

sounds spot on to me.

"Cereal box puzzles" is an accurate description for the majority of puzzles. Maybe you're living in the mind of a cereal box puzzle designer as they traverse the colorful lands of the cereal world, while the stone statues represent the capitalist side of the sugary market. (lazy theory)

I like Yahtzee but I rarely have the same opinion as he does on games. He likes a very specific type of game - The Witness isn't that type. Part of the reason I like him is he doesn't pretend he's giving an objective review. A enjoy a much wider variety of game types than he does, so I only watch his videos for the entertainment value.

And there are only a handful of puzzles in this game that could accurately be described as "cereal box". They exist to help get you into the mindset for the rest of the game. Like the trash mobs of other game genres, they act as a warm-up or practice for the tougher "encounters".

The game quickly progresses far beyond them.

[Snorlax Is H4x]

The Witness puzzle design is pretty much the antitheses of artificial difficulty. There are an extremely small amount of exceptions though. Those endgame puzzles do add an element that you could argue makes it a bit artificially harder, but they are unique to that area and an interesting novel element that balances out the minor annoyance. Also, the games Lyne or Flow Free, while also being "line drawing" puzzle games, have a completely different style of puzzle and the SCOPE of those games could not be more different for the witness.

[Exizt why]

" My guess is that if Jonathan's name wasn't attached to it, this would most likely try and float average on Metacritic."

If dumb comments went to heaven yours would be perched on the right hand of god.

The Witness eviscerates one word with murderous precision and this word is 'average'.