What are the best perks for Sweet?

[DjSharperimage]

What are the best perks for Sweet, to do maximum damage?
For a secondary gun, I am using the Drone Launcher

[Lotus Crane]

Uh, for personal DPS, or boosting tower DPS (which usually is a bigger amount overall)?

If you're going personal DPS, you should probably consider Battle Rifle or Smatter Band instead of Drone Launcher, because Sweet's DPS perks are usually Long Range Specialization (which does nothing for the Drone Launcher), Long Range Superiority, and your choice of Tactical Juxtaposition/Upper Class/Spray 'N Pray/Armor Shredder (even though Hip Fire seems to be a popular choice, I personally think it's a terrible idea because you basically become useless against at least 2 mob types).

If you're going tower booster (which as I noted, usually causes more actual damage), then keep your Drone Launcher, and use Synergy, Exposure Rounds, and your choice of Slowing Rounds/Engineer/Tinkerer (Zeus Module and Thor Module are only useful in really specific circumstances, depending on the stage, feats, towers, and teammates).

[SirArcoz]

Originally posted by Lotus Crane:

[...] (even though Hip Fire seems to be a popular choice, I personally think it's a terrible idea because you basically become useless against at least 2 mob types).

Which mobs? If you mean bobbleheads and Fliskeplaske (because these are the only two mobs that can only be damaged at their weakspots), I can say that LRS Sweet can attack them, if she uses the Smatter Band (primary fire).
Using Hip Fire means, that weakspot damage is deactivated, but not the weakspot hitbox itself. Therefore, bobbleheads can still be damaged, but they will only take the non-weakspot damage.

[SirArcoz]

Sorry, but I just couldn't ignore this:

Originally posted by Lotus Crane:

[...] boosting tower DPS (which usually is a bigger amount overall)?

Be careful with statements like these. I don't know how you came to that statement, either by experience (and you just did not mention the conditions under which this statement became true) or by thinking (and probably oversimplifying things), but this statement can only be true, if certain conditions are met. In general, the damage output of the towers must be significantly higher than the damage output of the players as using that build means losing damage output compared to maximum damage builds (like LRS Sweet).

At this point I want to mention that I was about to write an entire essay about player damage (and post it in this thread), as many players - mostly the less experienced ones - don't seem to be aware of their own damage or ways they could improve it (I'm looking at players with level 30 or higher). I'm only mentioning this because it is possible to deal 3.0 million damage or even more (depends on the map) with a good build and I - as an experienced player with over 400 hours of playtime - have seen so many people who were not even able to deal at least one third of that.
So players have the potential to deal vast amounts of damage and the question that comes to my mind is: Why sacrificing that? Why not try to improve the own damage output, especially when it is not as good as I already mentioned.
But in order to properly reply to your post (and not just complaining about newbies), I'll explain you in detail, when this build can (and should) be played:

In survival, the enemies' hitpoints will continuosly increase, but so will the towers' damage output. The only damage output that does not increase over time, is the players' one. It can be said that the ratio (players' damage : towers' damage) will converge to zero, the longer the match takes. In other words: (Almost) all damage is done by the towers and therefore the aim of the players' perk choices should be to boost the tower damage as much as possible. The Synergy/Exposure Rounds build makes the enemies take 1.45 times more damage from towers - at any point of the match. That's why the build mentioned by LotusCrane (Debuff Sweet) is highly recommended for long survival matches.

[Lotus Crane]

Originally posted by R4ndomGuy:

I don't know how you came to that statement, either by experience (and you just did not mention the conditions under which this statement became true) or by thinking (and probably oversimplifying things), but this statement can only be true, if certain conditions are met. In general, the damage output of the towers must be significantly higher than the damage output of the players.

125 hours, all the 5 feat achievements, wave 34 (I think?) of The Last Stand.

I don't generally play survival (except for The Last Stand, which is built like a survival match even though it's part of the normal campaign), but I do always play 5 feats, and even at 5 feats, at least in my experiences, the damage ratio is already skewed in favor of towers (especially Focus Towers).

In campaign with no feats, well, the game is easy enough that you could get by without any real build optimization at all, so sure, go ahead and play a DPS Sweet. (As a generalization, if posters don't specify that they're doing less than 5 feats, I just assume they're talking about 5 feats, because I think the goal of most posters here is 5 feats.)

One other question is how firmly attached DjSi is to the Drone Launcher. If he really, really loves the Drone Launcher (I know a lot of players do), does Long Range Specialization still make sense in a DPS build even though it would only apply to the REX?

[BCGutsy]

Originally posted by R4ndomGuy:

Be careful with statements like these.

I was thinking the exact same thing, but felt "hey, his play/build style might justify it. "

The answer really does "depend" when compairing person DPS perks to tower boosting dps perks. Most of the time, I would lean (very heavily) towards personal dps (expose weakness I view to be a 'balanced perk'). Then again I love corpse explosion, and in many maps (5 fos) it is over powered imo.

That being said, I do appreciate the new challenges associated with optimally playing a 'tower perk buff' style. The other day I played last stand for many waves with resilient core + expose weakness + engineer. Effectively using the engineer perk vs those damn spore keepers was a challenge (that ultimately got me killed). Next time I will probably try resilient core + synergy + tinkerer

[SirArcoz]

Originally posted by Lotus Crane:

One other question is how firmly attached DjSi is to the Drone Launcher. If he really, really loves the Drone Launcher (I know a lot of players do), does Long Range Specialization still make sense in a DPS build even though it would only apply to the REX?

I have to admit that I never used the drone launcher for anything else than stacking the passive of Skye, so I don't know its damage potential. I have tested, if the secondary fire counts as an explosion which can be enhanced by Long Range Specialization (because it looks like an explosion), but after short testing, it didn't seem to do so. Therefore, using the Drone Launcher means giving up AoE damage.

I have suggestions for a Sweet build revolving around the Drone Launcher, but I can't guarantee, that this will lead to a high DPS:

First of all, I'll explain how the Drone Launcher works. I'm not sure, if everyone (already) knows these things, but they are important to know, if this build should ever been tested.
The Drone Launcher can potentially reach targets at any range and completely ignores armor, which makes the use of the Armor Shred perk mostly unnecessary.
If the crosshair is pointed at an enemy, while the launcher is fired, the drone will attack that target. If no specific target is sighted, the drone will fly in the direction it is fired and lock on the first enemy it encounters on its path (if that is not the case, it will just lock on the closest enemy).
A drone will keep attacking the target it is attached to until it dies, then the drone falls to the ground. As this attack doesn't seem to deal AoE damage, it probably won't hit anything in that case. Correct me if I'm wrong. I've heard that drones can remain in the air up to 45 seconds unless the target is killed, but I never had a chance to find proof for this. If somebody has reliable information on this subject, please tell me and anybody who is reading this wall of text.
The last thing worth mentioning is, that the secondary fire mode applies to ALL drones in the air and can only be used, if the weapon isn't reloading. I'm not sure if the secondary fire ignores armor, too.

Now to the build itself:
In my short test for the secondary's AoE capabilities (Sweet with both LRS perks and Spray and Pray) I have noticed that the secondary can deal 600 damage (with these perks) and probably even a bit more (the enemy I noticed that damage was relatively close to me). Shooting a complete magazine of drones gives the potential to deal 3600 damage in one secondary shot (unarmored enemy, I assume). Stacking drones on one single enemy will also deplete its lifebar relatively fast. If the player knows, how many drones are attached to one target, he could figure out when he has to drop the drones on him to kill him in one shot. This requires much awareness of the player.
This is where Corpse Explosion comes in. I personally don't like this perk for its inconsistency and its lack of usefulness in multiplayer where it is harder to get kills, but the latter problem should not occur with this build.
To maximize its effectiveness, many enemies should be around the main target. The option the player has is to delay the secondary shot if it is obvious that more enemies will reach the main target in a few seconds. However, the secondary shot cannot be set off early (if the player is not miscalculating) or at least it is not recommended.
With this core feature, we have a build that heavily focusses on single target damage, especially burst damage, which always comes in handy when Corpse Explosion is used. This build could now be enhanced with damage perks (e. g. Long Range Superiority, maybe Core Guardian or Upper Class).
I have no clear idea what could be used as secondary weapon (if the player has already reached level 40). The REX might be a bad choice as the secondary fire is hardly strong enough to punch through the armor of Armored Heavies and to hit hoverers properly which are both main targets due to their many hitpoints. I'm also not sure how the fire rate of the drones (not the Drone Launcher) is altered when using Tactical Juxtaposition.
This build is highly experimental and I have no idea if it works properly at all and I currently don't have any better alternatives.

[Gongfuren]

Originally posted by R4ndomGuy:

A drone will keep attacking the target it is attached to until it dies, then the drone falls to the ground. As this attack doesn't seem to deal AoE damage, it probably won't hit anything in that case. Correct me if I'm wrong. I've heard that drones can remain in the air up to 45 seconds unless the target is killed, but I never had a chance to find proof for this. If somebody has reliable information on this subject, please tell me and anybody who is reading this wall of text.

A single drone can shoot up to 45 times. After 45 shots, the drone dies. If the enemy that the drone is attached to dies, the drone will die as well.

I've tested this extensively.

EDIT: Quoted wrong person.

[DjSharperimage]

Thanks, I'll try out the Long Range Specialization, and maybe Corpse Explosion
And the Smatter Band.
And I always have Tactical Juxtaposition on.

I'll probably try out the Smatter Band,
But I've read on the Sanctum Wiki that the Drone Launcher does the most damage tho, plus it's really good against Bobbleheads

Also, The game developers should add more perk slots, so we could have more customizable builds, kind of like in Borderlands 2

[Blaquicat]

I would stay with perks that give bonus on hit

for example:
Exposure Rounds
On sweet this baby last 11 secs.. (sweet burn´s)

Just like Synergy or slowing rounds (last way more time)
And, with the Tactical Juxtaposition, you can shoot everybody in a sec.

[Lotus Crane]

Gongfuren, check your quote. What you quoted was actually said by R4ndomGuy, not by me.

DjSi, Drone Launcher is good, but it doesn't benefit at all from Long Range Specialization (Drones don't benefit from accuracy or AoE bonuses). So this is the decision you have to make: do you take Long Range Specialization because it's the best perk for Sweet's REX, or do you take the Drone Launcher because it's possibly the best secondary weapon? You don't want to use both the Drone Launcher and Long Range Specialization, because they don't work together at all.

[Hadashi Ryukō]

I personally like the drone launcher with Sweet. The perks I use are tactical juxtaposition, armor shredder, and long range superiority. You know the super heavy right? Get it burning with the alt fire on rex, sic your drone army on it and basically watch it die. If done right it dies around 30 sec without any towers. Remember to keep shooting. I generally empty one gun then go to the other.

[DjSharperimage]

Originally posted by Amegawa_Houto:

I personally like the drone launcher with Sweet. The perks I use are tactical juxtaposition, armor shredder, and long range superiority. You know the super heavy right? Get it burning with the alt fire on rex, sic your drone army on it and basically watch it die. If done right it dies around 30 sec without any towers. Remember to keep shooting. I generally empty one gun then go to the other.

LOL, That is what I always do. Best build ever!!!!