How insane is the p2w in this ?

[BluntForceTrauma]

...compared to Genshin ?

[Ocerkin]

i saw a genshin whale stream this and they said its about half as bad as genshin in comparison, give or take

[Marmarmar34]

Bro, imagine playing gatcha games

[Xaelon]

ToF's buisness model is better than Genshin in some ways but not in others so they end up being about the same. I prefer how ToF does things personally.

The main thing ToF does that Genshin doesn't is offer a supply of both limited and standard pulls. Weekly missions award "Black Crystals" think of these as primos and daily missions give standard pulls. Meaning you can (and should) save your black crystals to exchange for "red" (limited) pulls, while still being able to pull on standard banners.

Feel free to read on if you want more detailed information about ToF's business model.

While ToF gives more pulls than Genshin you'll also "need" more dupes per character. How many cons/ascensions/dupes a character requires to be "good" varies from character to character. Most characters want at least one, a few work well even at zero, and a 1 or 2 characters want 3+.

Requiring more cons for most/all characters would be bad except ToF has a "sparking" system. Each time you pull on a banner you earn at least one spark currency.

• The standard banner pulls give "Black Gold".
  
  
• The limited banner pulls give "Red Gold".
  
  
• 120 Black Gold will let you buy a dupe for any standard character you already own.
  
  
• 120 Red Gold will let you buy the current limited character even if you weren't able to pull them normally.
  
  
• Red Gold converts to an equal amount of Black Gold after the current limited banner ends.

ToF also has a pity in effect where you are guaranteed an SSR every 80 pulls. The pity does not reset if you get an SSR character early, so it's possible you will get multiple SSRs per set of 80 pulls. On the limited banner the pity is a 50/50 between the limited SSR and standard SSRs. Unlike Genshin, you are not guaranteed the limited character every other pity. The sparking system serves as that guarantee instead.

Having lost the pity roll in Genshin many, many times I prefer the way ToF does things since assuming I have 120 pulls worth of resources I can still get the limited character even if I lose the 50/50.

ToF's other banner type gives "matrices". These offer a set amount of base base stats (HP, ATK, Crit). All sets offer the same amount of base stats, but they have set bonuses for wearing 2 or 4 pieces of the same set. The pity for matrix banners is 40 pulls. You do not need any duplicate matrices to activate the set bonus.

Unlike in Genshin where F2P can't really pull for weapons, SSR matrices have a very low chance to drop from certain game activities. One activity that can be done a few times a week also gives a single matrix pull. This means you can eventually earn SSR matrix sets without needing to split your resources between pulling for characters and pulling for matrices.

Limited matrix sets also aren't straight better than standard sets either. Limited matrix sets are good for a specific element or character, but standard matrix sets are good for any element or character.

[Farnik]

It's p2w. You can't compete with whales because they just have bigger numbers (in pve). Pvp somewhat balanced tho

[jyochu]

whales do carry tho so its nt bad at all, you get 4 rolls per day 1 counting towards pity (as long as you do your daily bounties). I do like how you can buy another copy after rolling or getting 120 flames. The thing thats annoying is the matrices (but its not too bad 80 to pick one you)

[nicodeimous]

The PvP part makes the p2w aspect of the game become a much larger issue - even with "normalization" - whales will have an advantage. Other wise it's pretty much the same as Genshin for most players.

I find ToF less polished - needing especially on the pc better optimization.

My Opinion - From a gacha perspective I find the my actual experience with the game to be worse than Genshin. The basic currency has yet to yield a special character, the gold and orange [red] sphere's have only yielded a character when they got to 80 [hard pity]. As a result my "weapons" aren't very strong. This is the biggest issue to me - in Genshin I can level them up independently without having to actually pay in more to move them up. Most of my C0 5 stars do great so no need or feeling of need to roll on re roll banners etc - and the weapons are likewise easy going for me. In Tower of Fantasy my big weapons are all very linked to the gocha rolls and if not lucky then your just weak [no new abilities etc]

[CalibarZero]

in my opinion, compared to other gacha games? it's not actually that bad, most of the SSR weapons are usable even without dupes and you're practically guaranteed a full set of SSR weapons within the first week of playing

compared to more main stream games though? it's a gacha game and by default is grossly more pay to win than something like final fantasy 14, power is tied to an ever shifting meta and how many dupes of said meta weapons you can get

[Tsukiya]

not really.. strongest Whales only have around 60k- 70 CS, and Strongest F2P have around 50k- 58CS.

[Meteorite]

Build your team with good strategy. Still you cant do anything for all element get debuffed on once in a week so your main element will be useless sometimes.

[Ave]

ToF is more f2p friendly compared to Genshin but both are still pretty bad.

if the devs give ''compensation'' for something they give like half a summon worth.

[Kaitsu]

The game is a lot more F2P friendly than most gacha games. I've already maxed out Samir (the main DPS PVE character) without money. But for limited banners, it seems like this is pretty much where your money will go if you don't properly manage and save your red nucleus.

You can get characters from banners or just field bosses. Matrices are also obtained through banner, bosses, and front ops, and several other stuff.

P2W is a weird word for this game. It's more of P4C (Pay for convenience). Because this game's gacha is so forgiving. People have already mentioned the above about the black and red gold. You can't really buy anything that would make you win everything. It's not like Genshin where the weapons are a separate banner (thank god). Or paying for locked battle pass weapons, etc. It doesn't have any of that.

Everything you an get in this game, can be done through F2P. But I'm sure people will realize how forgiving it is, and spend money anyway. I eventually did. lol

Ultimately, in the end, it's still a gacha game. So my experience of getting maxed out characters with ease will probably differ. I probably just had good ass luck.

[Wehzy]

Pretty strong p2w but more f2p friendly than genshin

[Wehzy]

Originally posted by Marmarmar34:

Bro, imagine playing gatcha games

"bro" aka zoomer , you play TF2 in 2022.

[ChocoElBanana]

Gacha game is always P2W. The only difference with MMO Gacha is that you get to show it off to other players. If you're talking about banner pulls however then ToF has a better pity system than Genshin not to mention cheaper pulls.

[Unstable Penguin]

Originally posted by Tsukiya:

not really.. strongest Whales only have around 60k- 70 CS, and Strongest F2P have around 50k- 58CS.

CS is not an accurate representation of power, especially for when it comes to advancements. The game measures advancements the same in terms of CS. Even if an advancement could essentially double the damage output of a unit.

Nemesis at A6 gives her an additional tower, which essentially doubles her off-field DPS, over an A5 nemesis. Ruby gives 160% additional DMG at a6. Cobalt gains tons and tons of off-field DPS and burst DMG with her advancements.

If you take 2 50k CS players. One with all characters a6 and with no characters a6, the one with a6 characters will ALWAYS vastly out damage the f2p one.