I think people were hoping for baldurs gate 3.5 with no turns and got Dragons dogma

[The Wushuang of the Wudang]

my asus g15 advantage edition laptop with the radeon 6800m and radeon 5980 hx is running this at 60 fps, using steam fps counter ive gotten up to 147 fps outside of vermund
really dont see the reason behind the flak the game is getting.
Plays great, Looks great. another capcom W. looking forward to this game's version of bitterblack isle

[BlazeRomulus]

yep, I played Dragon's Dogma, looked at the trailers and gameplay, still looked like Dragon's Dogma, which is what most of the fanbase wanted.

MTX asside, performance being an issue is the only valid heavy criticism I'd throw against the game.

[VeraelHasta]

A lot of influencers and youtubers launched hype trains based on their limited knowledge, trailes and select clips.
I knew right away it won't end well.

Still, MTX and performance based reviews are completely valid, devs did it to themselves. Or the publisher did it to them.

[Shin Happens]

You cannot blame people for feeling disappointed, even if you disregard the PC performance issues or MTX debate (which is way overblown in my opinion). This game received a lot of publicity, many people will play this who did not play the first one and expected maybe something like a love child between Elden Ring and Skyrim or so. And DD2 is shockingly bad when it comes to quests, its main story, basic gameplay loop and overall world design, as in, you are sent on forced marches throughout the world, backtracking like crazy at times, fighting the same pointless mobs (after you reach a certain level) over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again and even super high level 5 health bar dragons eventually become just a nuisance you can swat like a house fly in under a minute, and that is even before the endgame (which is a bit more challenging, but not really)... and exploration is not even fun or rewarding because the loot you find is pointless, when most of the best gear is found in shops only.... and the devs must be aware of this since they even gave pawns a line of dialogue that addresses this... even more puzzling then why they made loot so pointless in this game and give you all the best gear (with some exceptions) only in shops. Itsuno's idea of making traveling from A to B "fun" is placing the same six monsters every 10 steps along the way. No interesting locations to discover, no interesting loot to find (with only rare exceptions), locations do not have any backstory to them, like the ancient battleground, you never even learn what was going on there really, there is no real quest connected to that place other than escorting some person to check on some magical doohicky, there is no depth here. And don't even mention this game's idea of "companion" quests which are all just escort missions, that can at times take 10-20+ minutes unless you are lucky and the destination has a portcrystal.

Compared to the highly challenging and very tactical combat in BG3 DD2 feels... lacking, BG3 challenges you all the way through. The dynamic fights in DD2 can be a LOT of fun, make no mistake, but after a certain point literally nothing is a challenge anymore. Also, in 2024 many people expect a decent, proper main story that makes sense, quests that are not about... "give me 5 medicine"... "give me 5 herbs"... or "go there and kill monster" or "walk 20 minutes to talk to some NPC, then walk all the way back to report back to me...." or "stealth" missions without any stealth mechanics and they also want NPCs that do not feel like faulty Westworld bots, if someone had NPCs like Shadowheart, Astarion or Karlach in their game and then gets things like pawns (who can be funny at times) or super shallow barely existing NPCs like Ulrika etc you can't blame them for thinking DD2 is mid tier at best, if not even, as it is now, a bad game, with combat its only saving grace, and even that becomes braindead after you reach a certain level maybe halfway through the game or so, unless you beeline it all.

Compare any of the quests in DD2 to an early quest in BG3 where you are to deal with the goblins in their main camp, you can approach this any number of ways, you can even betray the tieflings/druids, you can obliterate the goblins, you can find and get a new main companion etc. Each companion has a proper and mostly well written and interesting arc and own personal quest. No wonder DD2 gets flak for a variety of reasons, not just performance or MTX.

Horizon Forbidden West which was released for PC on the same day also has the better overall combat (more interesting and versatile mechanics) with some super massive and impressive mechanical beasties, the better designed world (not just interconnected corridors) with interesting locations to find and explore, it at least has a comprehensible main quest and gives you various fun options for traversal, even if late into the game here and there like the glider or your own flying mount. Also, it looks better and runs buttery smooth on PCs. DD2 feels extremely clunky and badly designed in comparison. And in DD2 all you can do is walk from A to B in your first hour of the game... and walk from A to B in the final hours of the game, or you are graciously given some ferrystones by the game and allowed to fast travel to a handful of locations. Don't even mention oxcarts, I stopped using them because the frequent attacks often resulted in the destruction of the cart so I had to walk from A to B anyway.

In an age where BG3, Horizon Forbidden West or even Elden Ring exist you cannot be surprised DD2 gets flak. And saying "I don't see the reason for all the flak" is giving the dev a hallpass for all the lazy and outright stupid things in this game. Fair critique, coming from a place of positivity, not hate, is needed. Itsuno is in dire need of proper feedback. DD2 could have been a brilliant game, the core is there, the potential exists, all the ingredients are in the game... but either money and time constraints or outright laziness and a woeful misunderstanding of what makes modern games "fun" is holding it all back. This goes far beyond "mtx" or "performance on PC".

[Scrubwave]

People were hoping for improved DD1, not bladder's bear 3.

[justfaded]

Ugh BG3. I know a lot of people liked it but man that ♥♥♥♥ was so lame. It does show that this game is still very niche and not meant for everybody.

[[-iD-]]

i was definitely not hoping for anything like bg3. i am not a fan of turn based / dice roll games.

[Smug Kot]

I was expecting a completely fleshed out version of dragon dogma since Itsuno cried so ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ much how his game got content cut and instead we got dragon dogma 1 again, even MORE butchered and with unoptimized graphics.

[Pink Eye]

Cool. Except most of us weren't hoping for Baldur's Gate 3 but a more refined version of Dragon's Dogma Dark Arisen.

[gofgof]

I wanted a fantasy game were I could run around in the woods climbing on monsters and throwing pawns into the river. That is what I got, but waiting for a performance patch before I continue, for while everything outside the city runs great inside the city it is playable but annoying in the long run.

[Corona Scurrae]

set rendering mode to progressive at max. doubt you get the same performance.

but it's up to you in the end. I don't like soft and blurry image quality, so I set progressive to max. that way the game looks incredibly good. also shadows will net you a big fps boost when dropping it from max to high

[cyäegha]

when's the last time crapcom released a fully-featured game on PC that worked flawlessly out-of-the-box on release?

last i checked, never, and DD2 is no exception
as a result, it's hard to blame people for having rock-bottom expectations, and crapcom still failing to aspire to such low expectations

[Corona Scurrae]

Originally posted by cyäegha:

when's the last time crapcom released a fully-featured game on PC that worked flawlessly out-of-the-box on release?

last i checked, never, and DD2 is no exception
as a result, it's hard to blame people for having rock-bottom expectations, and crapcom still failing to aspire to such low expectations

re2
re4
monster hunter world / iceborne / wilds
devil may cry 5

these are at least the games I own and remember haha. could be more than that

[Witski]

Originally posted by cyäegha:

when's the last time crapcom released a fully-featured game on PC that worked flawlessly out-of-the-box on release?

last i checked, never, and DD2 is no exception
as a result, it's hard to blame people for having rock-bottom expectations, and crapcom still failing to aspire to such low expectations

For me it works, so, who cares.

[1CMF]

Originally posted by Shin Happens:

You cannot blame people for feeling disappointed, even if you disregard the PC performance issues or MTX debate (which is way overblown in my opinion). This game received a lot of publicity, many people will play this who did not play the first one and expected maybe something like a love child between Elden Ring and Skyrim or so. And DD2 is shockingly bad when it comes to quests, its main story, basic gameplay loop and overall world design, as in, you are sent on forced marches throughout the world, backtracking like crazy at times, fighting the same pointless mobs (after you reach a certain level) over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again and even super high level 5 health bar dragons eventually become just a nuisance you can swat like a house fly in under a minute, and that is even before the endgame (which is a bit more challenging, but not really)... and exploration is not even fun or rewarding because the loot you find is pointless, when most of the best gear is found in shops only.... and the devs must be aware of this since they even gave pawns a line of dialogue that addresses this... even more puzzling then why they made loot so pointless in this game and give you all the best gear (with some exceptions) only in shops. Itsuno's idea of making traveling from A to B "fun" is placing the same six monsters every 10 steps along the way. No interesting locations to discover, no interesting loot to find (with only rare exceptions), locations do not have any backstory to them, like the ancient battleground, you never even learn what was going on there really, there is no real quest connected to that place other than escorting some person to check on some magical doohicky, there is no depth here. And don't even mention this game's idea of "companion" quests which are all just escort missions, that can at times take 10-20+ minutes unless you are lucky and the destination has a portcrystal.

Compared to the highly challenging and very tactical combat in BG3 DD2 feels... lacking, BG3 challenges you all the way through. The dynamic fights in DD2 can be a LOT of fun, make no mistake, but after a certain point literally nothing is a challenge anymore. Also, in 2024 many people expect a decent, proper main story that makes sense, quests that are not about... "give me 5 medicine"... "give me 5 herbs"... or "go there and kill monster" or "walk 20 minutes to talk to some NPC, then walk all the way back to report back to me...." or "stealth" missions without any stealth mechanics and they also want NPCs that do not feel like faulty Westworld bots, if someone had NPCs like Shadowheart, Astarion or Karlach in their game and then gets things like pawns (who can be funny at times) or super shallow barely existing NPCs like Ulrika etc you can't blame them for thinking DD2 is mid tier at best, if not even, as it is now, a bad game, with combat its only saving grace, and even that becomes braindead after you reach a certain level maybe halfway through the game or so, unless you beeline it all.

Compare any of the quests in DD2 to an early quest in BG3 where you are to deal with the goblins in their main camp, you can approach this any number of ways, you can even betray the tieflings/druids, you can obliterate the goblins, you can find and get a new main companion etc. Each companion has a proper and mostly well written and interesting arc and own personal quest. No wonder DD2 gets flak for a variety of reasons, not just performance or MTX.

Horizon Forbidden West which was released for PC on the same day also has the better overall combat (more interesting and versatile mechanics) with some super massive and impressive mechanical beasties, the better designed world (not just interconnected corridors) with interesting locations to find and explore, it at least has a comprehensible main quest and gives you various fun options for traversal, even if late into the game here and there like the glider or your own flying mount. Also, it looks better and runs buttery smooth on PCs. DD2 feels extremely clunky and badly designed in comparison. And in DD2 all you can do is walk from A to B in your first hour of the game... and walk from A to B in the final hours of the game, or you are graciously given some ferrystones by the game and allowed to fast travel to a handful of locations. Don't even mention oxcarts, I stopped using them because the frequent attacks often resulted in the destruction of the cart so I had to walk from A to B anyway.

In an age where BG3, Horizon Forbidden West or even Elden Ring exist you cannot be surprised DD2 gets flak. And saying "I don't see the reason for all the flak" is giving the dev a hallpass for all the lazy and outright stupid things in this game. Fair critique, coming from a place of positivity, not hate, is needed. Itsuno is in dire need of proper feedback. DD2 could have been a brilliant game, the core is there, the potential exists, all the ingredients are in the game... but either money and time constraints or outright laziness and a woeful misunderstanding of what makes modern games "fun" is holding it all back. This goes far beyond "mtx" or "performance on PC".

Saying Horizon Zero dawn had a better combat system is a stretch in my opinion. Elden Ring/Souls games have a better combat system sure, but this is a more casual version of that, while still hitting the marks.

HZD is basically auto target button masher and throw in traps or arrows to exploit vulnerabilities. Mostly good for story/graphics with a fairly standard open world find everything on a map Ubisoft style. I like the game, but it hits all the industry standards while being really safe.

DD2 goes against the grain in a lot of regards, and while these may not be fan favorite ideas, I enjoy seeing developers taking risks, which is what BG3 did and it turned out great. DD2 is getting a different reaction though, so maybe these decisions are off the mark, but a worthwhile endeavor at least. Combat here allows it to be arcade-y to a degree while bringing it closer to the Soulsborne style. More deapth of movement and attack, stagger mechanics, weak spots, timing mechanics, resistances, and decent (not great) AI companions. All the while providing an open world where you don't have to "touch every corner of a map to hit a marker and complete it all", but still encouraged to explore.

Some people need that checklist action on map finders, but I find it tedious now.

This is all opinion though, so if you feel that way it's fine, I just disagree. I will say HZD and Elden Ring perform way better, so I'll give you that.

[Shin Happens]

Originally posted by 1CMF:

Saying Horizon Zero dawn had a better combat system is a stretch in my opinion. Elden Ring/Souls games have a better combat system sure, but this is a more casual version of that, while still hitting the marks.

HZD is basically auto target button masher and throw in traps or arrows to exploit vulnerabilities. Mostly good for story/graphics with a fairly standard open world find everything on a map Ubisoft style. I like the game, but it hits all the industry standards while being really safe.

DD2 goes against the grain in a lot of regards, and while these may not be fan favorite ideas, I enjoy seeing developers taking risks, which is what BG3 did and it turned out great. DD2 is getting a different reaction though, so maybe these decisions are off the mark, but a worthwhile endeavor at least. Combat here allows it to be arcade-y to a degree while bringing it closer to the Soulsborne style. More deapth of movement and attack, stagger mechanics, weak spots, timing mechanics, resistances, and decent (not great) AI companions. All the while providing an open world where you don't have to "touch every corner of a map to hit a marker and complete it all", but still encouraged to explore.

Some people need that checklist action on map finders, but I find it tedious now.

This is all opinion though, so if you feel that way it's fine, I just disagree. I will say HZD and Elden Ring perform way better, so I'll give you that.

When I say HZD or HFW has "better" combat then I mostly mean it's more challenging and the (big) mechanical monsters can be very impressive as well. I absolutely agree that the combat system itself in DD2 is pretty great and a bit more versatile and you can get pretty creative, and the surprises you can get along the way can make things pretty hilarious (like when that griffin decides to join in on the fun and you think "really now?!?") but my point was that a game like HFW etc still presents a challenge even in later stages of the game and/or gives you new enemies... in DD2 everything becomes super easy past a certain point. So I have more fun dismantling some Thunderjaw or Stormbird than killing my n-th cyclops in under 30 seconds or even my n-th dragon in something like 30-60 seconds.
And in DD2 it's also about hitting weak points or exploiting elemental vulnerabilities. The thing is after a certain point any of the creative combat tactics are no longer needed because everything dies after one or two swings with your weapon and you just pommel the dragon weak point and the thing dies in under 30 seconds even.

And sure, in some ways the "Ubisofty" way of doing things in HZD etc is annoying and the amount of handholding is infuriating at times, I know what I have to do Aloy, THANK YOU, now stop telling me what to do every 10 seconds... also, auto parcours is pretty braindead in this game, this game is far from perfect either.
I think a love child between something like HZD or FW and DD2 could be a perfect (action) RPG. So something that is not holding your hands like a nanny, without a bazillion map icons, DD2 style combat (with better enemy scaling and more variety), but with compelling / fleshed out NPCs / team mates and a well written story, A combination of HZD, Dragon Age and DD2 would probably be my dream (action) RPG.