Some questions about the lore

[Nopeland]

So the Nazi actually did not researched everything and they stole every tech they have used from an old jewish community? The lore is saying that jewish community is centuries ahead of other humans?Or that community isnt even jewish at all?

I appreciated if someone would explain that

[DogMeat]

Da'at Yichud is a secret Jewish society that invents stuff... just because. They keep their inventions hidden to protect humanity. The Nazis found one of their secret stashes and used it to create their technology.

Its pretty stupid, far dumber than the game's 'supernatural bupkis' from previous games. The whole thing seems to be so the developers could be ironic. Jews are persecuted as being less than human yet they have a secret society creating the most advanced technology on earth... IRONY!

I guess they were worried that it might be offensive to suggest the Nazis could create incredible technology on their own... despite the Nazis doing so in reality.

[Nopeland]

I couldn't agree with you more on the " that they don't want to be offensive against jews" so they make them gods of invention...

nazi is such a taboo in our society...
I wonder if talking or making games about mongols is a taboo or a horrific thing to persians, since they exterminated 3/4 of their population...

[DogMeat]

Nazis earned their reputation, I'm not defending them. I'm just irritated that they felt the need to get ridiculous with the story... like they were walking on egg shells. They have to go out of their way to remind the gamer that Nazis = bad to the point the plot becomes ridiculous at points... Da'at Yichud being one point.

The game even has this disclaimer every time its started.

FROM: Bethesda PR High Command
TO: Impressionable Players
"Wolfenstein: The New Order is a fictional story set in an alternate universe in the 1960's. Names, characters, organizations, locations and events are either imaginary or depicted in a fictionalized manner. The story and cotents of this game are not intended to and should not be construed in any way to condone, glorify or endorse the beliefs, ideologies, events, actions, persons or behavior of the Nazi regime or to trivialize its war crimes, genocide, and other crimes against humanity."

Yes... they were worried enough that some people would see Nazi high tech in the game and think the devs were suggesting they were a superior society/people. Duh... they're the villains and we're fighting them... we get it.

[ros117]

We can't really know how much of their tech is simply rip offs of Da'at tech and how much is home grown. What we do know is that the Nazi supersoldiers are most likely Deathshead's own creation but their weapons and armor might as well be stolen tech. Most of the nazi equipment is most certainly Da'at in origin though.

[id.dav81]

Yeah when they introduced this ridiculous jewish super secret tech...they lost me completely....I'm not antisemit, but I'm tired of this jewesh BS. I'm sorry but germans were amasing engeneeirs, they created everything themselfs.....probably with the help of some talented jewish guys, sure, but ancient super JEWESH TECH....Oh please! Well .....what did you expect creative director of this game is JEW)

[friend robocat]

Автор сообщения: DogMeat

Da'at Yichud is a secret Jewish society that invents stuff... just because. They keep their inventions hidden to protect humanity. The Nazis found one of their secret stashes and used it to create their technology.

Actually this whole game seems to have bits of Hebrew mythology in it. I've read someone posit that BJ is a biblical "Judge", who has been granted inhuman endurance, strength and durability to deliver God's wroth against those who sin against his people. It would certainly explain how he managed to get off that chair and kill without much trouble after being paralyzed for 14 years. The Deathshead Compound (the focus of the game; you practically start and end the game there) is a Tower reaching high into the heavens... guess what other such Tower pissed off that Hebrew God? The Tower of Babel. (also in Tarot symbolism, the Tower represents death and destruction... which kinda makes Totenkopf's statement that "all you people peddle is death & destruction" hypocritical in a meta way).

What the Da'at Yichud do seems similar to the builders of Babel (attempting to reach God by building greater and greater things). I wonder if their wings had already burned, like Ikaros, and by using that stolen tech, the Nazis were next in line as well (sounds like Raiders of the Lost Ark come think of it)...

[friend robocat]

Why should that be any ridiculuous than "Nazis conquer the world with superscience" or all those occult shenanigans in the previous games?

Devs were aiming for that irony, that the only way Nazis could win is if they break with their dogma, like fully applying Jewish Science (or superscience, in this case). I think its rather unfortunate that the way they went about this had to cross into that vile ideology itself (Jews are a sekrit shadow cabal of banker puppetmasters - not that the Da'at Yichud was this to begin with), but the alternative was making a world where the Nazis were, well, right (everyone is an incompetent untermensch except the Aryan Master Race, who is destined by virtue of race to conquer all) and I do not think they could accept that.

[DogMeat]

Perhaps its my cynicism, but the idea that some society would create technology of that magnitude for the sake of it is more unbelievable than any of the previous occult, magic, undead, mech or other extreme element of the franchise.

There would have been other ways of saying the Nazis 'cheated' to aquire their advanced technology without stealing it from some ridiculous benevolent secret society. Time travel (Spear of Destiny: Ultimate Challenge) or researched/stolen from the pre-existing Thule society from Wolf 09 to name a few ideas off the top of my head.

[ros117]

I actually love how they presented Da'at Yichud. They actually borderline on being villains. They bearly helped the allies against the Nazis even though they had the tech that could have won the war. Sure Set states that they didn't help more since their feared that no matter what their technology would turn out to be used for awful things. But honestly they just come off as being greedy, self-important hoarders. There is plently of their inventions that have purely civilian applications (super concrete comes to mind) but they didn't share those either. A bunch of old men huddled inside their little vaults while the world burns around them don't seem all that better than the Nazis.

[friend robocat]

Автор сообщения: DogMeat

Perhaps its my cynicism, but the idea that some society would create technology of that magnitude for the sake of it is more unbelievable than any of the previous occult, magic, undead, mech or other extreme element of the franchise.

There would have been other ways of saying the Nazis 'cheated' to aquire their advanced technology without stealing it from some ridiculous benevolent secret society. Time travel (Spear of Destiny: Ultimate Challenge) or researched/stolen from the pre-existing Thule society from Wolf 09 to name a few ideas off the top of my head.

Fair enough. I still think there is merit in what they were trying to achieve with this Da'at Yichud angle in TNO, and the Wolfenstein universe is quite open to plenty of contradictory and colorful weird stuff (some examples you've already mentioned); a Pulp Kitchen Sink if you will. So there is plenty of room left to explain why the Nazis won - for all we know (and by what Old Blood seems to be hinting), they still relied on some sort of occult element and other sources of superscience to achieve their domination victory.

Автор сообщения: ros117

I actually love how they presented Da'at Yichud. They actually borderline on being villains. They bearly helped the allies against the Nazis even though they had the tech that could have won the war. Sure Set states that they didn't help more since their feared that no matter what their technology would turn out to be used for awful things. But honestly they just come off as being greedy, self-important hoarders. There is plently of their inventions that have purely civilian applications (super concrete comes to mind) but they didn't share those either. A bunch of old men huddled inside their little vaults while the world burns around them don't seem all that better than the Nazis.

Yeah I would not go so far as to call them villainous, but they are definitely less noble than they appear. If you have all that whacky superscience that could HUGELY improve standards of living worldwide and you just lock all that up on the premise of them being too sacred to use, it makes you come across as a bunch of selfish tools. Granted, there may be more to their side of the story that we haven't been privy to yet, and perhaps it was things like discrimination against Jews and the chaotic scene of the first half of the 1900s that made them super paranoid, but so far all the evidence points to the contrary.

Also during the walk in that Da'at Yichud depository, Set Roth mentioned that "our gatekeepers were murdered, some were exiled..." Exiled from whom, I wonder? The group? For what transgression if so?

[ros117]

Автор сообщения: George W. Bush

Yeah I would not go so far as to call them villainous, but they are definitely less noble than they appear. If you have all that whacky superscience that could HUGELY improve standards of living worldwide and you just lock all that up on the premise of them being too sacred to use, it makes you come across as a bunch of selfish tools. Granted, there may be more to their side of the story that we haven't been privy to yet, and perhaps it was things like discrimination against Jews and the chaotic scene of the first half of the 1900s that made them super paranoid, but so far all the evidence points to the contrary.

Also during the walk in that Da'at Yichud depository, Set Roth mentioned that "our gatekeepers were murdered, some were exiled..." Exiled from whom, I wonder? The group? For what transgression if so?

You know, I think it could be possible that the exiled members of Da'at were those who gave some tech to the allies (the transport planes seen in 1946 are built thanks to their technology I believe). It is possible that there was some infighting in Da'at Yuchud about whether or not to interfere in the war. I also understand why they would be a bit paranoid during the 1900s because...well yeah. But keep in mind that Da'at Yichud is implied of being a very old organization. So they had plenty of opportunities to share some of their less dangerous creations with the world and yet did not. I would really love for a sequel to provide a bit more information about them.

[DogMeat]

Автор сообщения: ros117

You know, I think it could be possible that the exiled members of Da'at were those who gave some tech to the allies (the transport planes seen in 1946 are built thanks to their technology I believe).

Are you sure? I never saw any document or reference suggesting the transport planes used their tech.

[ros117]

Yeah I don't remember where I got that info from. Might have been from an interview. Of course I could just be mistaken.

[guntoting_lawbreaker]

I do love the combat, but the propaganda is so bad that I stopped reading everything.

[SuspiciouspegasusTTV]

Yeh, sorry for necro, but I was wondering, why wouldent the allies steel and reverse enginear german tech and make there own super Bad A** Sci fi weapons to fight the germans.