The Stagnant Terran Economy.

[Maxwell Sinclair]

So I did some research online, and a few other people say they seem to have run into this as well, but there wasn't any advice on how to fix it.

Basically, I started as the Terran Commander, I recently saved up enough money to buy myself a brand new, sparkling M7, and when I went about looking to equip it, I found every terran forge or fabrication plant, for every type of missile and weapon, was out of stock.

I checked all the various secondary resources and it seems as though Water is the jam point, with all fabs reading 0. I don't know how I'm supposed to go about restarting this however. There is plenty of energy cells in terran space, there are supposed to be ice mines somewhere in terran space but I can't buy my own to help jumpstart the economy. Without the ice, the water purification plants don't work, and then everyone is out of water.

Basically I'm asking for advice from people who have likely played this more than I have, because I'd quite like to jumpstart the terran economy again, I have plans to own a Kyoto one day and it'll be pointless if I can't outfit it properly.

[Plays In Traffic]

You need to build some Protien Paste factory's. Well trained CAG's will also really help.

[Maxwell Sinclair]

Originally posted by jalecandrew:

You need to build some Protien Paste factory's. Well trained CAG's will also really help.

Protein paste? How does that help me when Water is the problem?

[Plays In Traffic]

Mineral scanner+Ore collector+Anything that will blow up a rock.

EDIT: All the ice you want.

[Plays In Traffic]

Originally posted by Maxwell Sinclair:

Originally posted by jalecandrew:

You need to build some Protien Paste factory's. Well trained CAG's will also really help.

Protein paste? How does that help me when Water is the problem?

There aren't any till YOU build them.

[mmmcheesywaffles]

Aim at providing through the South Western links to Terran space.

You can build your water resources in any safe territory so long as your TS has a straight run to the supply and teh point of sale without going through any War Sectors.

Don't trust the Black List and White list options... they have been known to fail.... ofc you should testr if they work well in your game, for if they do, it will prove more profitable than doing it the way I had to.

The problem is that the nearest Ice is only reachable through a War Sector. I found that a small shield fab also helped finance my revitalisation and I watched the local prices to make sure I only undercut the competition by 1 credit :)

[Maxwell Sinclair]

Ok so I need to set up protein paste factories, and as far as I know there are plenty of water purification plants, it's just nobody is supplying them with ice. I looked up the list of known ice asteroids and it's really REALLY small. Although there is one in the asteroid belt with a yeild of 144 apparently.

[DrSuperEvil]

Only NPC factories need water. All your USC Food Production Facilities only need Protein Paste. Just make a simple complex of 2x Protein Paste Blending Facilities and 2x USC Food Production Facilities in Venus and Uranus selling cheap MREs (at a small profit). Put the complex leash range so your CAGs do not go to the war zones and let the NPC ships deliver the wares. Ice Harvesting Facilities can be brought from The Moon. There are also Ice asteroids in Oort Cloud and Saturn 3. Unless you have stopped the war, avoid Asteroid Belt, Circle of Labour and Treasure Chest for Ice mining. All other Ice asteroids are far from Terran space in Rhonkar's Clouds, Wastelands, Ghinn's Escape and Unseen Domain.

If you want weapons just make your own forges. You need 3 PSP Forges and 4 SSC Forges anyhow just to keep your headquarters supplied. Just do not ask about the 173 EMPC Forges needed to keep up with Valkyrie production.

[Maxwell Sinclair]

Originally posted by DrSuperEvil:

Only NPC factories need water. All your USC Food Production Facilities only need Protein Paste. Just make a simple complex of 2x Protein Paste Blending Facilities and 2x USC Food Production Facilities in Venus and Uranus selling cheap MREs (at a small profit). Put the complex leash range so your CAGs do not go to the war zones and let the NPC ships deliver the wares. Ice Harvesting Facilities can be brought from The Moon. There are also Ice asteroids in Oort Cloud and Saturn 3. Unless you have stopped the war, avoid Asteroid Belt, Circle of Labour and Treasure Chest for Ice mining. All other Ice asteroids are far from Terran space in Rhonkar's Clouds, Wastelands, Ghinn's Escape and Unseen Domain.

If you want weapons just make your own forges. You need 3 PSP Forges and 4 SSC Forges anyhow just to keep your headquarters supplied. Just do not ask about the 173 EMPC Forges needed to keep up with Valkyrie production.

Currently the farthest I am in the plot is delivering the Xperimental. Once I HAVE an HQ I'll worry about setting up proper forges and such. Currently I have 2 ore mines trading in Zyarths stand/Twisted skies to improve Split rep, because I'm waiting to get a Cobra for boarding purposes. I bought an Aegir because I really wanted to use an ATF ship, and I wanted to station it in Zyarths Stand, but keep it as a rapid response M7 on the off chance I find myself in a situation where I need heavier firepower than what I've already got. I just discovered the stagnant economy when trying to equip said Aegir.

Really though... I'm making the argon like me right now, so I can have a bit more ease with the plot, what with spending so much time in Commonwealth space. But once I'm done... War or no War, I'm setting up my HQ complex in the asteroid belt. Even if it means I have to flood the sector with a hundred ships.

[DrSuperEvil]

If you want Split and Paranid rep just place a Space Weed/Space Fuel complex in Hatikvah's Faith. Set the Space Weed to 2700 and it sells itself.

For a fast and easy Cobra just do Return Abandoned Ship missions till a Cobra spawns and then jump it to the Yaki shipyard.

The Aegir is a decent M7 though it is more anti fighter orientated (like the Cerebus) than the Split and Paranid M7s.

The kill the Jump Beacons mission is a pain for Argon Rep because the multimillion credit petty vandalism costs as much rep as if you board Argon One three times in a row. Max Argon race rank and after each beacon do missions to regain it. Also get Boron rep because from +10 the last few missions of the Terran Plot chew about 16% off the max rank (the kidnap Bala Gi and capturing of the Xenon Hub ones).

Your idea of Asteroid Belt is really a disaster for reputation. Due to the war mechanics out of sector the faction with the lowest rep will have a random ship go hostile and keep doing so until your race rank is so low all its friends and their sectors go hostile. If you really want it in Asteroid Belt complete the Shady Business plot first. I personally prefer Savage Spur for my headquarters and main manufacturing complex because it has enough asteroids for most of my shield and weapon manufactuing needs.

If you do build it in Asteroid belt you are going to need at least 6 M2 ships 3 M7M ships and 24 M7s just to defend the headquarters from the attack fleets. Then there will be the problem of getting any wares and damaged ships (for RE) to the headquarters in one piece.

[Maxwell Sinclair]

Originally posted by DrSuperEvil:

Your idea of Asteroid Belt is really a disaster for reputation. Due to the war mechanics out of sector the faction with the lowest rep will have a random ship go hostile and keep doing so until your race rank is so low all its friends and their sectors go hostile. If you really want it in Asteroid Belt complete the Shady Business plot first. I personally prefer Savage Spur for my headquarters and main manufacturing complex because it has enough asteroids for most of my shield and weapon manufactuing needs.

If you do build it in Asteroid belt you are going to need at least 6 M2 ships 3 M7M ships and 24 M7s just to defend the headquarters from the attack fleets. Then there will be the problem of getting any wares and damaged ships (for RE) to the headquarters in one piece.

Well I wasn't planning to keep my argon rank up. Not if the war keeps going despite operation loose ends being completed. I fully intend to keep the war rolling. I'm *kinda* roleplaying it. I'm a proud terran at heart. I try to use Terran ships wherever possible, although I didn't see any decent M7M, I try to use terran stations and such. I really don't NEED to improve my argon rep since my playership outruns everything but the most persistent of argon ships. But I do plan to become an integral part of the terran war effort once I have the PHQ and complex set up.

If this war is ending. It's ending when my fleet, backed by the might of the Terran Navy, crashes headlong into Argon Prime and rips it from their grasp. I guess I'm something of a Genocidal Terran. I'm only really improving my rep at the moment so I can top up on energy cells for the Jumpdrive every so often, at the moment I have to top up every time I jump back to saturn.

Also for damaged ships I keep a JD equipped TM with a whole boat load of energy cells, to jump in, pick up a captured ship, and then bail out again. Eventually I'll upgrade it to an M1 or maybe a Valhalla if I feel like burning my Terran Rep enough to capture a Valhalla. That way it could carry M6's. That said I think most M1's can carry an M6. I distinctly remember the last time I played (I script editored to see what kind of rediculous things I could do.) I had an M1 or an M2 that docked my Centaur on it...

Also that script editing was fun. I had a Xenon K that was tuned into this like... perfect sweetspot, where it was as fast and maneuverable as an Arrow. It was quite amusing and I crashed it a LOT.

[Plays In Traffic]

WTF you don't see a good terran M7M, the Skirnir IS the most powerful ship in the game. It could blow up planets if the game let you target planets.

[DrSuperEvil]

Logistics wise making a complex in asteroid belt and keeping it defended is quite challenging. Possible but sustainable? Especially when you have just gotten yout HQ is also questionable. Remember you only get one HQ.

As the other post mentions the Skirnir is pretty lethal if you can feed it the missiles it needs per minute, which is quite high.

At the end of the Shady Business Plot the argon and Terrans have a peace talk but the Yaki disagree. If you can survive the merc raiders attacking your HQ without damage during the plot then you might have what it takes to build one in a warzone maybe...

I also use a TM or TL full of fighters with spare equipment and Jump Drives.

Getting a Valhalla is best done in Asteroid Belt when there are no M7 escorts and <4 M6s as that will only put you down to Marshal of Mars. Valhalla sucks for a transport ship since it needs a Jump Beacon in every sector, rather use it for UFJD sectors. The Kyoto and Aran can also carry M6 ships.

Most M1 ships can only carry M3-5.

Use enough Pandora Tunings and any ship can be as agile as an arrow though remember double the speed, double the braking distance (although ship acceleration also increases slowly with tunings).

Originally posted by jalecandrew:

WTF you don't see a good terran M7M, the Skirnir IS the most powerful ship in the game. It could blow up planets if the game let you target planets.

Nice quote from www.x3wiki.com. Main problem with the M7M class of ships in general is the supply lines. "An army marches on its' stomach" fits the bill. If the player has enough stations to keep an M7M supplied it is a death machine even a commonwealth ones.

[Maxwell Sinclair]

Originally posted by jalecandrew:

WTF you don't see a good terran M7M, the Skirnir IS the most powerful ship in the game. It could blow up planets if the game let you target planets.

I
A. Didn't even see a Skirnir on the list, because I was using the pleb's shipyard in Saturn, since there was no jump beacon at the moon.
B. Wasn't doing the background reading I usually do on Rougey's site.
C. Was looking specifically for a boarding ship, and every google search regarding boarding, points me to the Split Cobra.

I'm not looking to blow up planets, I'm looking to steal them. Speaking of blowing up planets. I had a Xenon L drop a torpedo marked with a mushroom cloud. Hammerhead I think? Is that a Terran Missile. I was too close to the explosion of one, I wasn't even the target but I still lost 600MJs of shielding and half my hull. Thankfully no systems were destroyed but still. I know the L can equip it.

[DrSuperEvil]

Use Cobra for general boarding purposes due to it having a decent speed. For Xenon ships use the Sirokos from OTAS as a backup ship. Also have a self sufficient complex with 1 Flail Missile and 2 Hammer Heavy Torpedo producing stations. If you need boarding hints just ask. Or read this:

http://www.egosoft.com:8292/confluence/display/X3WIKI/Boarding+Hints

All NPC ships can drop the Hammerhead Missile. It does 1.2 million shield damage and a ton of hull. Most commonwealth ships can equip it. The OTAS Solano is a good cheap bomber in that respect.