The war mechanics in AP are so absurd it boggles the mind.

[Bacon Snot]

How Egosoft justified AP as a release is beyond me. The whole series comes across as stable beta or technology demonstrator. I come from X3TC with the promise of a large scale war and fleet action, only to find its a massive RNG mess.

I get my hopes up starting with a Katana right off the hop. I don't let the fact that they gave me 10 out of 12 EMPCs get me angry (I mean come on, you're giving me a whole Katana and 200k in walking around money, don't get cheap on me now). I put two EMPCs from the main guns to the rear turret because I know X3's idea of a challenge is missle spam.

I start cruising around terran space for the 3rd time in the series just to look around because the bastards still won't give me a map. I'm starting to notice that Argons are fond of kamikazi missions as they send wave after wave of M5s and M4s. It seems everytime I turn my back, there are 5 more jumping in. They have also somehow managed to develop technology to jump to transorbital accelerators I notice.

So I get bored of swatting flies once I realise they are just spawning on a timer and killing them means nothing. I head south towards heritic's end looking for these big fleet battles the developers were promising. I jump in only to find more kamikazi argons. I barely get a shot off before we all drift too close to an Osaka who manages to smash my shields in seconds with indiscriminate SSC fire. I turn and burn from the Osaka who is a bigger danger to my health than the 12 Argons and get a message from terran command that out ships in Circle of Labor are in trouble. Finally, some action. I arrive in Circle of Labor to find a decent sized battle, but before I can get close enough to fire a shot the two Tokyos took out the Titan and are mopping up some corvettes.

I got bored again and took a patrol mission from an ore mine, I figure maybe it's a way to advance the war plot. I fly around Circle of labor in SETA an nothing happens, then it tells me to fly to Omicron Lyrae. I jump in there to see an M2 and 2 M1s in the distance, and a swarm of fighers by the gate. I hope that the patrol mission will end before the big guns get in range. Its a pitched battle but I manage kill 12 argons and only lose 30% hull. The mission completes and I get a message that I didn't manage to kill any enemies, but here's 3500 space bucks for my trouble. Just great.

I jump back to Circle of Labor and see what looks like half the terran ATF fleet. Wow, the terrans must be serious about locking down this sector! And what's this?? TWO VALHALLAS? There are two Valhallas parked in the middle of the sector, along with a hand full of Osakas, Tokyos and a gazillion ATF corvettes. Holy crap, I pity what ever comes through that gate. I sit round waiting for the Argon's to try something, but nothing happens. The Valhallas just sit there pointing away from the Argon gate. Then I get the message from Terran Command that they are planning on invading Omircon Lyrae, get to it! Finally, this is what the devs promised.

No one seems to be moving, so I think maybe the Terrans are spawning in the other sector like the Kamikaze argons. I turn around and fly back through the gate to Omicron Lyrae and come nose to nose with a Titan and 3 Centaurs, not a Terran ship in sight. I fly around the back of the gate and bravely run away hoping that the Terran Fleet is going to jump in at any minute and save my ass. Nothing. Then I get a message from Terran Command. The Asteroid Belt is under Enemy influence, find out what's happening!

What the hell? That M2 is parked right on top of the gate, I have no hope of flying back, so I use my jump drive to jump into Circle of Labor. The fleet is gone, the Valhallas are gone. Just a few corvettes and M6s getting spanked by a Colossus and a whole bunch of Centaurs. What the hell is going on? I better get to asteroid belt. I jump right in and find a friendly split raptor drifting around like it owns the place and all the mines are owned by Argons. Now I'm really confused.

I fly across the sector and jump to Jupiter to find a Cerberus and some fighters harassing everything in site, and no one fighting back.

Am I missing something? Is this the experience the Dev's were after?

[Don]

The War Sector is meant to get your feet wet in combat, and you can use it to raise your fight rank along with getting salvage and ships from boarding. It's scripted and designed to look like a random chaos with endless back and forth (like the trench warfare in World War 1). You'll eventually find out (which you seem to did) that your effort is useless, and your insignificant self seemingly have no effect in the war. You're suppose to move on from these sectors, and start the actual gameplay (either sandbox play or going for the plots). It is jarring to see, especially if you jump a lot, how the sector status can drastically change in short time. Such is war...

[Bacon Snot]

So its not me, its the mechanics. I was wondering if it was a glitch, or just lazy programming. I mean I get that the front will move back and forth, but losing everything all the way to Jupiter in under 2 minutes is just some lazy mechanics at work. God must just be rolling dice to see who owns a sector and that's it. I expect something that simplistic from a mod, not an entire release.

I read marketing material that said the player would change the outcome of the war, buy supplying your side, fighting or completing missions. They must have been lying or couldn't deliver on their promises. I get the feeling that AP was thrown together in a hurry and pushed out the door just to drum up interest in X4. If I recall correctly I got it for free with my copy of X3TC, so there isn't much to complain about; other than if I knew this is how the game would play I wouldn't have wasted any time on it.

[Don]

I agree that the war sectors change too much, since spawning of war fleets are scripted, but you're not supposed to stay in it for long. Like I said, it's not for you to change the war status quo from the start, but to go about building an empire. You're harshly judging a whole game from just the intro mission designed to get you're feet wet in combat, and to tell you the state of the Galaxy's race relationships.

"player would change the outcome of the war, buy supplying your side, fighting or completing missions"

That is still true. Without spoiling things, what you experience is just the intro to a hundred-step process to accomplish this in this sandbox empire building game. If you come to this game expecting to combat your way through right from the start to finish, you'll be highly disappointed (although it still can be done).

Edit: X3AP was released in 2011, way before X4 or even X-Rebirth was even thought of, and it's their highly rated game in steam so far.

[DrSuperEvil]

So the starting ship is not top spec when it comes to being outfitted. Would not be much progression if it was. I admit having to bust out of argon space using a slow M6 like a katana is a challenge but certainly is possible. Just make a big loop in Omicron Lyrae.

EMPCs are rather poor accuracy weapons so not great at missile defence. If an RR M7M jumps in to join the fight in Heratics End you can just try to jump to safety or be wiped.

In war sectors you get 12 states (beginnings and middles) which spawn large ships but while the player is in sector in a war sector there are periodic trash mob spawns. Out of sector the faction with the lowest rank beelines player assets even if allied.

In general it is a bad idea to hide in the line of fire since ships do have banks of turrets. Also large ships do have blind spots in which you could have hidden.

Yes taking war sector patrol missions can send you deep into enemy territory so may not be a good choice for beginners. They eventually time out with a cash reward based on kills. Still I would not advise doing it in anything smaller than an M7.

Some patrols are against certain factions and if it is anti xenon then all factions will kill those ships before you can get there in a heavily fortified sector like Omicron Lyrae.

Yes in the one war state you get two valhallas. Just like the one has jump beacons on the boardable ships in Jupiter.

War states do not progress if the player is in sector. Leave the sector and come back and it will have changed.

War messages tend to go in pairs with a buildup state and then fleets jump into a neighbouring sector for a big battle. As many of the war state messages were not included in the final version they can be deceptive.

[MerlinTheGameWizard]

Not sure if you are looking for a vanilla experience or not OP. But there are some fantastic mods that make it possible for you to build your own empire and causes there to be actual non scripted territory changes. (The Star wars mod being one of them, even if it feel hastily thrown together sometimes)
I think one of them even adds a endgame where you are trying to fight a "Super-enemy" That slowly grows stronger throughout the game and if you can't assemble a good enough corporation by the time they reach core systems you are hopelessly slaughtered.
I haven't played in a fat minute. But when I was last playing I was doing a run through the star wars mod that essentially gives you a ship factory, some component factories, and starts you at war with every faction. Was hectic and involved lots of trial and error, But I eventually had a pirate sanctum to call my own that was extremely pleasing to watch the income numbers go up.

[Bacon Snot]

I was trying for Vanilla, but it looks like I won't have the patience for it. I was trying to find out if I wasn't understanding something about AP, but from what I can tell it's functioning as intended. I might try that Star Wars mod. The X3 engine seems like it would be a good fit. So far the most fun I've had was with the mod that brings TC into AP. I always worry about mods since many aren't balanced and can ruin the challenge.