Torchlight II

Torchlight II

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Var Sep 19, 2019 @ 9:39pm
Shotgunne Question: Cursed Daggers vs Venomous Hail
Hello,

I am new to the game. I do have a Shotgonne build. I am torn between cursed daggers and venomous Hail. I really want to go with cursed daggers, but I read that venomous hail is almost a must have in gun builds. What are your thoughts? Am I crazy for wanting to go with cursed daggers over venomous hail?
Last edited by Var; Sep 24, 2019 @ 9:04am
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Showing 1-15 of 20 comments
HiFive Sep 19, 2019 @ 9:54pm 
Personally I don't like Cursed Daggers - there is too much space between the daggers. I prefer the Flaming Glave for high-level skills. I haven't really used Venemous Hail a lot. I tend to level up Rapid Shot the most, and then sometimes use Flaming Glave.

What you should do is acquire the skill and try it out for a while. If you don't like it, you can always refund the skill point for it and try something else. That's what I do when I want to try new skills. I acquire them, try them out on the town dummy, try them out in the field, then save them or undo them and try another.
Last edited by HiFive; Sep 19, 2019 @ 9:55pm
Sol Sep 19, 2019 @ 9:57pm 
If i got to choose then i'd take venomous hail. Cursed daggers is better on a mage outlander who invested in focus using wand and shield.
Var Sep 19, 2019 @ 10:30pm 
Originally posted by Sol:
If i got to choose then i'd take venomous hail. Cursed daggers is better on a mage outlander who invested in focus using wand and shield.

I am building up strength and focus, because I also have a lot of poison and element effects. I will also be maxing out master of the elements.
Var Sep 19, 2019 @ 10:33pm 
Originally posted by HiFive:
Personally I don't like Cursed Daggers - there is too much space between the daggers. I prefer the Flaming Glave for high-level skills. I haven't really used Venemous Hail a lot. I tend to level up Rapid Shot the most, and then sometimes use Flaming Glave.

What you should do is acquire the skill and try it out for a while. If you don't like it, you can always refund the skill point for it and try something else. That's what I do when I want to try new skills. I acquire them, try them out on the town dummy, try them out in the field, then save them or undo them and try another.

I was planning on doing this as well. My issue is that I have to get to level 42 before I can compare.

The farther you level dagger the more daggers you get and it cuts down on the gap you get. It would seem.
HiFive Sep 20, 2019 @ 12:27am 
Originally posted by Var:
I was planning on doing this as well. My issue is that I have to get to level 42 before I can compare.

The farther you level dagger the more daggers you get and it cuts down on the gap you get. It would seem.
Yes, it should. I really ought to try leveling that skill just to see how it works at the higher levels. I've never done that - might as well give it a shot, for fun. I've tried out most of the other skills.
Last edited by HiFive; Sep 20, 2019 @ 12:27am
steffire3 Sep 20, 2019 @ 12:40am 
Originally posted by Var:
Hello, I am a new to the game. Am I crazy for wanting to go with cursed daggers over venomous hail?

It would be crazy to not have both. Regardless the Strength / Focus investment, those Daggers with all 3 Tiers make an excellent Debuff against foes. Venom Hail at 1, 5 or 10 points is still good. In fact, given that there's only 132 Skill Points to invest then there's no need to max everything. Some Skills are viable at lower Ranks.
Last edited by steffire3; Sep 20, 2019 @ 12:41am
ZarahNeander Sep 20, 2019 @ 8:02am 
Originally posted by Var:
Am I crazy for wanting to go with cursed daggers over venomous hail?

Yes :)

Shottie outlander is a close combat char. Due to the limited range of shotties in general and rapid fire, even at rank 10+. However s/he lacks the 25% free DR of engi and barb. No shield hence no blocking doesnt help either.

Hail solves alot of your glass-cannon problems, you dont have to get right in the face of that nasty <insert hard-hitter here>, you can snipe from a safe distance, if you dont wanne get close & personal.
And it's much more reliable when it comes to 3d terrain, e.g, hits uphill no matter what.

Cursed daggers, the dmg pales compared to hail, the debuf doesnt really help that much, you're dead anyways, and why would you want to debuf in the first place. There're 3 outcomes..

a) critters are dead due to hail
b) critters are blinded and hence dead (shotgun mastery)
c) you're dead, debuffed or not, at least on NG++/vet onward
ADEC Inc Sep 20, 2019 @ 10:25am 
Venomous Hail is devastating and has the great advantage of not requiring direct line of sight.

The weakness from Cursed Daggers is significant, but only if they haven't already been blinded.
Var Sep 20, 2019 @ 5:04pm 
Thanks everyone. I think I will max both. Do I need to max out shotgonne master. It seems that it maybe good at rank 10.
Last edited by Var; Sep 20, 2019 @ 5:04pm
steffire3 Sep 20, 2019 @ 5:47pm 
Originally posted by Var:
Thanks everyone. I think I will max both. Do I need to max out shotgonne master. It seems that it maybe good at rank 10.

It's decent at Rank 10 with 65% although 90% Chance of Blindness at Rank 15 is difficult to match by other means.
ADEC Inc Sep 20, 2019 @ 9:21pm 
Bosses have high resistance to blind but you can apply it a little at a time and it stacks. Less Shotgun Mastery will thus require more hits to incapacitate.
ZarahNeander Sep 21, 2019 @ 4:52am 
Originally posted by ADEC Inc:
Bosses have high resistance to blind but you can apply it a little at a time and it stacks. Less Shotgun Mastery will thus require more hits to incapacitate.

'High' is relative. For the most part bosses have 70% blind resist, sounds high, but compared to i.e 90% stun, it's quite low.

The key is 'Rapid Fire'. It's so rapid that they are blinded within seconds. In fact shottie outlanders are the best boss killers, no other build comes close. They only struggle against multiple bosses, like 3 sisters
ADEC Inc Sep 21, 2019 @ 12:42pm 
Yes that's why I noted it would take more hits.

As it happens, bosses have 90% blind resist and 92% against stun, so maxing out the shotgun mastery is a good move if you intend to use it.
Last edited by ADEC Inc; Sep 21, 2019 @ 1:02pm
JewelryStar Sep 24, 2019 @ 7:04am 
//txhuy88

Why not both?
They are two different skill type.
- Cursed Daggers's main effect are debuff enemies dmg, knockback enemies, at each Tier of Cursed Daggers you can gain more "buff" for you for each enemies take hit by your Cursed Daggers.
- Venomous Hail deal massive Poison dmg (can crit).
Var Sep 24, 2019 @ 9:12am 
Originally posted by JewelryStar:
//txhuy88

Why not both?
They are two different skill type.
- Cursed Daggers's main effect are debuff enemies dmg, knockback enemies, at each Tier of Cursed Daggers you can gain more "buff" for you for each enemies take hit by your Cursed Daggers.
- Venomous Hail deal massive Poison dmg (can crit).


I did decide to do both. At first I did not want to do both because I had tier one glaive throw for area attack and I did not want those points wasted. I dont know better, early game mistake, but I have decide to max both cures daggers and venomous hail and just deal with the wasted points in Glaive throw.
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Date Posted: Sep 19, 2019 @ 9:39pm
Posts: 20