Garden Of Thorn Gregor WAW : Res the EGO

[David Bowie Sensei]

So the kit for GoT EGO for Gregor just dropped and boy is it a weird one. As its a WAW EGO is should be quite strong and this will be a strong EGO. So long as you have Res going.
The theme of the EGO is Res, mimicking to a degree its Abno caring about sinners sins.

Attack Weight
Both sides gain Attack weight based on Res, while also having a Max amount. This is most likely 7 judging from the video so. So its base is most likely greater than 1 due to it being Res- X. Considering that a full Res with a team of 6 would only grant a total of 6.
So moving onto the effects, first with awakening.

Awakening
So this is quite a neat one. Your Res grants Power up and Damage up based on highest Sin Res to up to X Res of allies.
What this means is that say I have 5 wrath skills in my skill slots. On use of this EGO it will grant a Damage up for Wrath and power up for Wrath to 5 allies. So as this is a Lust EGO if you did Lust instead it would grant this EGO attack the extra damage too.
Now its keen to note that having a bigger Res [Not A-Res] grants more damage up and power up. With then an A-Res care to grant the same buffs next turn.
Next his after attack grants healing to some of his low health allies for % health. While a highest Res clause grants more allies to be healed.
Most EGO are known for being strong due to grant healing effects or SP heals to allies. While this doesn't do SP. Mass heals are still sought after in harder Focused fights to stave off losing a sinner as losing one can spiral into loosing more.

Corrosion
This one on the other hand unlike its awaken side, seems a tad weaker at first glance.
While inflicting a straight Damage Down and Bind next turn. The attack inflicting Fragile and Power Down based on the sin of the highest Res is straight odd. Not often are you going to be keen on using a Sin that enemies tends to unless outside of non Focus encounters. So only really Fragile will work out.
Meanwhile it does the same as the awakening does, inflicting more based on Res and on A-Res, next turn.
But the issue comes to awakening happens straight away and can effect Gregor before he deals damage, meanwhile this attack needs to hit to then grant the debuffs.
Hopefully numbers will make up for this lack of care.

Still speed for both Awakening and Corrosion, as the effects unless A-Res only apply that turn.So you will want your Gregor ID going first using this EGO.
Thankfully Gregor normally has a good 3-7 range on average, with his Zwei having the best at 4-8, factoring in a good way of tanking and team buffing, he should work well unless the Sin cost of this EGO makes things iffy.

Passive- Crown of Thorns
So this passive is the EGO Gift 'Crown of Rose' pushing out random Rupture Potency, while this passive only needs A-Res of any kind to give all enemies units Rupture Potency. Thankfully Gregor does have ID that care about Rupture, but Potency inflicts can be rather lackluster without a big focus with it. Most likely a Gluttony Res.

Final Thoughts
I don't often do a review of EGO, but considering this is the first "Gacha" WAW, I felt it makes sense to give my two cents.
While both sides seem strong. The awakened side seems far greater than the corrosion side. Offering healing and buffs to teams that want a focus on Resonance rather than strictly effects. Its SIn cost will factor heavily how well teams can make the most of this EGO and while Gregor Ids can fit any group needed. The fact that his EGO is Lust means you will rather want to use this EGO in such a team rather than say Pride, to make the most of its effects.
Meanwhile the passive will most likely be their only for extra damage, but could fit him in a Less Lustly group and play on other Res to gain the most from it.

[Demonking]

Originally posted by Orliminecraft:

so tl;dr is this worth boxing or should I just wait the 6 months

I would box it, mostly because you'll lose half your boxes anyway.

[SpearOfLies]

Originally posted by Angela:

Those team sucks because I will just runs Charge/Bl with Bo and do same thing but I can use it at any time and it will not limit what skill im using while also being cheaper, trying to runs 5 res team with multiple ids S3 for effect that Bo can do at any time is less than ideal.

Are you arguing about blind obsession awakening or corrosion? If you are arguing about awakening, it's a much smaller buff that is not even guaranteed. The biggest thing is the sp regen. If you are arguing about corrossion, the cheaper argument go out of window, the buff is more or less on par at Res 4 for Thorns Gregor but Blind Obsession buff is still not guaranteed.

Originally posted by Demonking:

Hmm, I wouldn't say that's a point against it. It's a massive heal with either a debuff or buff attached to it that you won't always need. As a result, if you don't want the debuff or buff you might as well use fluid sack or any of the other healing ego instead. That said it doesn't make you choose between a good ego or itself. It's not like say, soup sinclair that has an objectively better option for 99% of teams and situations if you care about optimizing. It exists in a slot that has no other egos that could take up and on a character that doesn't already have a good mass heal option. So while it's probably not always worth using I could certainly imagine situations in which +2 power and a 22% heal would be more useful than SP heal.

I don't know if you misunderstood me or misquote as half arguments are the same as mine.
I also on the stance that more options is better than no options. This EGO can shine on a situation that you need both healing and more damage or in a situation that the rest of team have no healing EGO.

[Minh]

Originally posted by Orliminecraft:

so tl;dr is this worth boxing or should I just wait the 6 months

Yes. No.

[Birp]

If you plan on buying the battlepass next season, then this is worth sharding since you'll just end up with too many crates and not enough stuff to use it on at some point.

If you're f2p then maybe not, unless you already boxed all the other [Season 3] ids/egos.

[Demonking]

Originally posted by SpearOfLies:

Originally posted by Demonking:

Hmm, I wouldn't say that's a point against it. It's a massive heal with either a debuff or buff attached to it that you won't always need. As a result, if you don't want the debuff or buff you might as well use fluid sack or any of the other healing ego instead. That said it doesn't make you choose between a good ego or itself. It's not like say, soup sinclair that has an objectively better option for 99% of teams and situations if you care about optimizing. It exists in a slot that has no other egos that could take up and on a character that doesn't already have a good mass heal option. So while it's probably not always worth using I could certainly imagine situations in which +2 power and a 22% heal would be more useful than SP heal.

I don't know if you misunderstood me or misquote as half arguments are the same as mine.
I also on the stance that more options is better than no options. This EGO can shine on a situation that you need both healing and more damage or in a situation that the rest of team have no healing EGO.

I guess I wasn't doing either. I was talking about the fact that comparing them to other ego isn't necessarily a reason not to use it given it's relative opportunity cost is minimal. Maybe I misunderstood you since a lot of people seem to be hating on the ego, but I'm not going to look at a WAW gregor ego and base my opinion on whether to run it or not on a HE Faust ego. I find doing so to be silly because that HE Faust ego can't be used to save gregor if he's the one facing an attack from a boss. In that situation the only egos that matter are the ones you have equipped onto gregor, which this ego actually blows out of water in terms of reliability in a clash. (That being because its base power is 20, so even on a tails its beating plenty of boss attacks easily. I'm also pretty sure it 30 is the highest coin power anything he can produce, but I might be wrong on that.)

Realistically I just think people are being too harsh on the ego because of how universally good Sun shower and blind obsession are, but I think people forget the fact both of those are BP EGO and there there isn't a single other ego in the game that can restore as much total hp as this ego can. Like, fluid sack is great but if you use this in tandem with it you're hitting all of the enemies, buffing fluid sack's damage, and healing everyone for 36% of their maximum HP.

[voidlich666]

Originally posted by Demonking:

In that situation the only egos that matter are the ones you have equipped onto gregor, which this ego actually blows out of water in terms of reliability in a clash. (That being because its base power is 20, so even on a tails its beating plenty of boss attacks easily. I'm also pretty sure it 30 is the highest coin power anything he can produce, but I might be wrong on that.)

While I agree with your overall point, this is just straight up false. Gregor AEDD actually has a higher base of 22, and the corrosion straight outrolls it at 24-31 for 10/15 less sanity. The main drawback is that you would be using AEDD instead of literally anything else, and application of 15 Spark Discharge makes it difficult to use the corrosion consecutively, even off of a charge team, without triggering the "Prioritizes units with Charge" condition.

[Reptiloid]

Originally posted by voidlich666:

Originally posted by Demonking:

In that situation the only egos that matter are the ones you have equipped onto gregor, which this ego actually blows out of water in terms of reliability in a clash. (That being because its base power is 20, so even on a tails its beating plenty of boss attacks easily. I'm also pretty sure it 30 is the highest coin power anything he can produce, but I might be wrong on that.)

While I agree with your overall point, this is just straight up false. Gregor AEDD actually has a higher base of 22, and the corrosion straight outrolls it at 24-31 for 10/15 less sanity. The main drawback is that you would be using AEDD instead of literally anything else, and application of 15 Spark Discharge makes it difficult to use the corrosion consecutively, even off of a charge team, without triggering the "Prioritizes units with Charge" condition.

People use AEDD for it's passive? Not to clash something w Gregor wher Legerdemain won't cut it?

[Iggy the Unwise]

Originally posted by Reptiloid:

People use AEDD for it's passive? Not to clash something w Gregor wher Legerdemain won't cut it?

Wait, isn’t AEDD a just a glorified rupture setup tool?

[Demonking]

Originally posted by Iggy the Unwise:

Originally posted by Reptiloid:

People use AEDD for it's passive? Not to clash something w Gregor wher Legerdemain won't cut it?

Wait, isn’t AEDD a just a glorified rupture setup tool?

I'm pretty sure if you use uh... The rupture/charge/tremor group AED is actually really good for building up their stuff quickly. I sometimes use it in mirror dungeon to make use of charge based ego gifts on non-charge teams as well, but that's never really a planned thing.

[SpearOfLies]

Originally posted by Demonking:

Originally posted by SpearOfLies:

I don't know if you misunderstood me or misquote as half arguments are the same as mine.
I also on the stance that more options is better than no options. This EGO can shine on a situation that you need both healing and more damage or in a situation that the rest of team have no healing EGO.

I guess I wasn't doing either. I was talking about the fact that comparing them to other ego isn't necessarily a reason not to use it given it's relative opportunity cost is minimal. Maybe I misunderstood you since a lot of people seem to be hating on the ego, but I'm not going to look at a WAW gregor ego and base my opinion on whether to run it or not on a HE Faust ego. I find doing so to be silly because that HE Faust ego can't be used to save gregor if he's the one facing an attack from a boss. In that situation the only egos that matter are the ones you have equipped onto gregor, which this ego actually blows out of water in terms of reliability in a clash. (That being because its base power is 20, so even on a tails its beating plenty of boss attacks easily. I'm also pretty sure it 30 is the highest coin power anything he can produce, but I might be wrong on that.)

Realistically I just think people are being too harsh on the ego because of how universally good Sun shower and blind obsession are, but I think people forget the fact both of those are BP EGO and there there isn't a single other ego in the game that can restore as much total hp as this ego can. Like, fluid sack is great but if you use this in tandem with it you're hitting all of the enemies, buffing fluid sack's damage, and healing everyone for 36% of their maximum HP.

I see. Well, I'm on the side that is more positive about the EGO. I just don't want to deny that they are downside to it. While slot in there is not opportunity cost, justifying using it on battle does make you consider the sin resources you consume that my deny the use of other EGOs so it's an opportunity cost.

Outside of that there isn't only Fluid Sac Faust as healing EGO. Both persuance EGOs are pretty great for that and Lantern Sinclair is the best HP healing in the game. Someone may argue that is not healing EVERYONE but more often than not you use healing EGO for healing only one or two greatly in danger characters while the rest of party is probably at full hp or have some chip damage. Outside of that they only cost 7 sin resources. Are we going to pay an extra 7 sin resources to heal chip damage?

I personally feel people understimate the buff side of this EGO. People compare it to sunshower and blind obsession but they do a side by side comparison without considering what is around them. How much sloth nuke we have compared other sins? How much damage +2 power up and damage up bring to the team?

Also people want to bring this on a heavy res team, but I believe this EGO was designed to be used on a light res team. A more generalist team which the cost is more affordable. PM probably want to give support to generalist team without further buffing too much heavy res team. This season they gave so much love to heavy res team to make people build team around them but they probably also want it to not the only way to play the game.

Originally posted by Iggy the Unwise:

Originally posted by Reptiloid:

People use AEDD for it's passive? Not to clash something w Gregor wher Legerdemain won't cut it?

Wait, isn’t AEDD a just a glorified rupture setup tool?

How an average of 9 rupture count is a glorified rupture setup tool? Even with the worst luck you should still get around 6 rupture count out of it. It also have great synergy with LCCB Ishmael so you can take advantage of her S3 while S2 will not destroy all the rupture count you were trying to build it up. Maybe it's not great for MD but that is because MD EGO gift for rupture are broken anyway.
As far I know, people use it for low turn count RR3. Maybe only once but that is still far for being a glorified rupture setup tool.

[Reptiloid]

Originally posted by Demonking:

Originally posted by Iggy the Unwise:

Wait, isn’t AEDD a just a glorified rupture setup tool?

I'm pretty sure if you use uh... The rupture/charge/tremor group AED is actually really good for building up their stuff quickly. I sometimes use it in mirror dungeon to make use of charge based ego gifts on non-charge teams as well, but that's never really a planned thing.

Ooh, okay. After I discovered that lucky pouch can make my BL faust roll a 40 on it's S3 I don't realy bother with other teams, waiting til something catches up to that lvl.

[Iggy the Unwise]

Originally posted by SpearOfLies:

Outside of that there isn't only Fluid Sac Faust as healing EGO. Both persuance EGOs are pretty great for that and Lantern Sinclair is the best HP healing in the game. Someone may argue that is not healing EVERYONE but more often than not you use healing EGO for healing only one or two greatly in danger characters while the rest of party is probably at full hp or have some chip damage. Outside of that they only cost 7 sin resources. Are we going to pay an extra 7 sin resources to heal chip damage?

Counter argument Sunshower (which is more consistent damage wise) +Sack (also restores sp) is only 5 res more. Don’t get me wrong, if we could choose not to spend 7 res to not get the healing it would be good, but by your logic only 5 more resources give me a lot more benefits (and they are less restrictive sin wise).

Originally posted by SpearOfLies:

Originally posted by Iggy the Unwise:

Wait, isn’t AEDD a just a glorified rupture setup tool?

How an average of 9 rupture count is a glorified rupture setup tool? Even with the worst luck you should still get around 6 rupture count out of it. It also have great synergy with LCCB Ishmael so you can take advantage of her S3 while S2 will not destroy all the rupture count you were trying to build it up. Maybe it's not great for MD but that is because MD EGO gift for rupture are broken anyway.
As far I know, people use it for low turn count RR3. Maybe only once but that is still far for being a glorified rupture setup tool.

Ok, so it`s just the rupture tool then.

[Snecchi]

The main opportunity cost in harder content is the sheer resources spent. Instead of doing this one ego, you could use two Teths and a Zayin (5 + 5 + 4) to guarantee winning 3 clashes instead of hoping the +2 power that you give your team after attack is enough (and lets face it, these resonance teams usually force you to use some sketchy skills just to candy crush 4 or 6 colors in a row). If this ego costed 10 or 11 I don't think people would be complaining nearly as much.

[SpearOfLies]

Originally posted by Iggy the Unwise:

Originally posted by SpearOfLies:

Outside of that there isn't only Fluid Sac Faust as healing EGO. Both persuance EGOs are pretty great for that and Lantern Sinclair is the best HP healing in the game. Someone may argue that is not healing EVERYONE but more often than not you use healing EGO for healing only one or two greatly in danger characters while the rest of party is probably at full hp or have some chip damage. Outside of that they only cost 7 sin resources. Are we going to pay an extra 7 sin resources to heal chip damage?

Counter argument Sunshower (which is more consistent damage wise) +Sack (also restores sp) is only 5 res more. Don’t get me wrong, if we could choose not to spend 7 res to not get the healing it would be good, but by your logic only 5 more resources give me a lot more benefits (and they are less restrictive sin wise).

What exactly the argument you are countering? I cannot grasp the connection between your post and mine. My only argument on the part you decided to cut is if it's worthy to pay 14 sin resources just for healing when there are many much cheaper options that do the job fine.

We use EGOs out of necessity, either because we need to win a clash, inflict a important status, healing, force a sin chain or/and amplify damage.
If we reduce thorns to just healing, it's absolute not worth the cost.
If we reduce thorns to just damage amplification, it's still very expensive.
If we can use it for both, can it actually be useful?
One of team I propose run both Dieci Rodion that love taking damage and W Ryoshu that self inflict damage with skill3. It have also Brother Sault and Zwei Gregor that can afford taking damage. It's so unreasonable to give a huge boost to R Cliff skill 3, W Don skill 3, W Ryoshu skill 3, Dieci Rodion skill 2 while healing the team for 14 sin resources?

[Angela]

Originally posted by SpearOfLies:

Are you arguing about blind obsession awakening or corrosion? If you are arguing about awakening, it's a much smaller buff that is not even guaranteed. The biggest thing is the sp regen. If you are arguing about corrossion, the cheaper argument go out of window, the buff is more or less on par at Res 4 for Thorns Gregor but Blind Obsession buff is still not guaranteed.

wdym smaller buff who not even guaranteed? its pretty much the same but with less cost and 4 allies can be manipulate with slots, and you pretty much will only missing 1 by defaut since it wont target ishmael after using ego.