Devs this is pretty unfair

[TTV - Vidavis Prime]

Strike twice needs balance, it is unfair that it can trigger itself, it causes the 3rd card in the row to play 4 times... there is no way to counter it... you need to add text that says it cannot trigger another strike twice... or these multiple strike twice builds are going to kill off the player base, cuz it ain't fair and it ain't fun. The player played a card that gave me 6 weaken... and it only cost him 2 qi to cast it 4 times... should have been 8 qi... unfair...

[Simply Cerberus]

It does not. I have just tested it. Strike twice applies a counter that gets used up. So if you ST a ST (Strike Twice) now you have two counters, meaning the next card gets played twice and the card after gets played twice before all your counters are gone

[Simply Cerberus]

What card weakened you. There is a replay function if you remember which game it was from

[TTV - Vidavis Prime]

Originally posted by Simply Cerberus:

It does not. I have just tested it. Strike twice applies a counter that gets used up. So if you ST a ST (Strike Twice) now you have two counters, meaning the next card gets played twice and the card after gets played twice before all your counters are gone

Doesn't that even seem unfair? I mean how can anyone beat that? So in this case Thousand Evil incantation lvl 3 goes off twice and then within reach goes off twice how is anyone supposed to counter that, let alone survive?

[Simply Cerberus]

Only real counter to something like that would be hexproof in advance. Cause timing a debuff cleanse mid-match is a lot less likely. Sadly there are so few hexproof cards available anywhere
Typically if you see debuff heavy users like him go with Formation Master for reliable denial of their big hits

I will agree that it not taking 2x the qi is a little strange. If it casts twice it should be double cost, same with things like ST into Great Spirit

[TTV - Vidavis Prime]

I don't know how to share a screen shot, but I took a screen shot of his build... I just would like the devs to tell me how is anyone supposed to be able to counter 18 debuffs in one turn, and then the double within reach... it was not fun or fair at all...

[Simply Cerberus]

Originally posted by TTV - Vidavis Prime:

I don't know how to share a screen shot, but I took a screen shot of his build... I just would like the devs to tell me how is anyone supposed to be able to counter 18 debuffs in one turn, and then the double within reach... it was not fun or fair at all...

If the man had tier 3 Evil Incantation then sadly not much can be done. Thats 4 yellow tier cards. Sometimes you just highroll a good build

[TTV - Vidavis Prime]

Originally posted by Simply Cerberus:

Originally posted by TTV - Vidavis Prime:

I don't know how to share a screen shot, but I took a screen shot of his build... I just would like the devs to tell me how is anyone supposed to be able to counter 18 debuffs in one turn, and then the double within reach... it was not fun or fair at all...

If the man had tier 3 Evil Incantation then sadly not much can be done. Thats 4 yellow tier cards. Sometimes you just highroll a good build

Just seems super unfair, he pretty much killed everyone on turn 4... all the time... balance surely comes into question.

[Simply Cerberus]

Originally posted by TTV - Vidavis Prime:

Originally posted by Simply Cerberus:

If the man had tier 3 Evil Incantation then sadly not much can be done. Thats 4 yellow tier cards. Sometimes you just highroll a good build

Just seems super unfair, he pretty much killed everyone on turn 4... all the time... balance surely comes into question.

4 turns of setup is quite some time. Can always go for something like weaken, qi drain, or as said before attempt hexproof. The main killer really is the flaw + Within's extra damage. 40% is nothing to scoff at. I suppose defence also technically could work, but attempting to build up that much that quick can be a problem

[TTV - Vidavis Prime]

Originally posted by Simply Cerberus:

Originally posted by TTV - Vidavis Prime:

Just seems super unfair, he pretty much killed everyone on turn 4... all the time... balance surely comes into question.

4 turns of setup is quite some time. Can always go for something like weaken, qi drain, or as said before attempt hexproof. The main killer really is the flaw + Within's extra damage. 40% is nothing to scoff at. I suppose defence also technically could work, but attempting to build up that much that quick can be a problem

Wow Qi drain is brilliant, that would have certainly worked... sadly I was Dharma, so yeah I died super hard... lol

[Útost Alronbem]

Originally posted by TTV - Vidavis Prime:

I don't know how to share a screen shot, but I took a screen shot of his build...

You can share session code + round number.
Click on your portrait > records > session of interest, there should be Share button in top right corner.
Or you can make a screenshot from there. Session code would be of more use (and significantly more convenient) though.

Originally posted by TTV - Vidavis Prime:

I just would like the devs to tell me how is anyone supposed to be able to counter 18 debuffs in one turn, and then the double within reach... it was not fun or fair at all...

Well, that's combo deck exemplar in a nutshell.

Bodybuilders with self-debuff stacking are usually happy to get extra debuffs so they'll hit much harder in return.
Qi denial decks exist.
Astral Move: Cide is a thing. Especially if your deck's tempo of card playing matches his. Stops combo decks on its tracks just fine.
Musician Astrologers (or Musician Bodybuilder) focused on Internal Injury can finish him off faster than he'll finish his combo.
Same goes for Sword Intent decks. Sword Embryo in particular is strong here.
Max HP stacking decks can outpace it with some luck.
Hexproof stacking is somewhat accessible.
Guard Up soaks any damage regardless of hit strength but is also barely available outside of few very specific decks.

Well, there expected to be no decks capable of winning every single time - that's what Balance in games of this kind is for.

[Simply Cerberus]

Originally posted by TTV - Vidavis Prime:

Originally posted by Simply Cerberus:

4 turns of setup is quite some time. Can always go for something like weaken, qi drain, or as said before attempt hexproof. The main killer really is the flaw + Within's extra damage. 40% is nothing to scoff at. I suppose defence also technically could work, but attempting to build up that much that quick can be a problem

Wow Qi drain is brilliant, that would have certainly worked... sadly I was Dharma, so yeah I died super hard... lol

Depending on round amount and if you had a flaw card perhaps you could have done them in before the weaken kicks off on you. Hard to say for certain

[hyena]

@"..it only cost him 2 qi to cast it 4 times... should have been 8 qi... unfair..."
I've not verified, so not quite sure, but it seems the rule is:
The card playing *in a slot* cost its requirement; card play by *effect* cost nothing unless other wise said.
Otherwise some card may not worth to play at all, eg <devine brush>, <chain sword formation> (for def/qi req of <rule sky*>) etc.

[Útost Alronbem]

Originally posted by hyena:

I've not verified, so not quite sure, but it seems the rule is:
The card playing *in a slot* cost its requirement; card play by *effect* cost nothing unless other wise said.

It is true.
Things like Chase state explicitly that Qi cost (and other assotiated costs TO PLAY the card) should be paid.
Things like Echo Formation - don't and so costs shouldn't be paid.
In case of double-trigger effect, Qi is spent to play the card, not to trigger its effect. So, 2-for-1 bargain, classic...

[BloodyPork]

Honestly if you think it's op, you can try it yourself and easy win no? In practice it really isn't as op as you think. Hepta's winrate is not even above other sects, and only Wu Ce is considered a strong character (by strong I mean someone that can be considered to be nerfed a little) really and she doesn't actually need this card at all.