Brief History of the setting.

[Toblm]

Seems like some people are lost concerning Egyptian history, which understandable since most it gets hand waved in most education systems.
(Bolding the playable faction character.)

The game is starts staring down the barrel of the Bronze Age Collapse which occurs ~1200-1150 BCE.

Pharaoh Merneptah (spellings vary for all Egyptian names) rules at game start as the 4th Pharaoh of the 19th Dynasty. Dying historically ~1203 BCE.

At which point Merneptah's son Seti II and Amenmesse (who might be a son of Merneptah or Ramses II the Great) both declare themselves Pharaoh and go at it. Seti in Lower Egypt and Amenmesse in Upper Egypt.

By 1197 BCE neither Seti II or Amenmesse are Pharaoh. Pharaoh Siptah rules and he might be the son of either Seti II or Amenmesse .

Twosret , Seti's consort succeeds Siptah in 1191 BCE.

Then in 1189 BCE Setnakhte usurps the throne as the first Pharaoh of the 20th dynasty.
Setnakhte is Ramesses III's father and Setnakhte likely comes from a minor but uncertain Ramesside line. (From Ramses II the Great). Setnakhte rules until 1186 BC.

After which Ramesses III becomes Pharaoh during whose rule two great battles against the Sea People of were fought. The Battle of Djahy (1178 or 1175 BC) and the Battle of the Delta (Between 1178 and 1175 BC). Ramesses III rules until 1155 BC and generally regarded as having saved Egypt from the worst of the Bronze Age Collapse.

The remaining 8 Pharaohs of the 20th Dynasty of Egypt are all named Ramesses and that dynasty ends with the ascension of Pharaoh Smendes in 1077 BC.

[Hanok]

Thank you for this :)

[Elitewrecker PT]

DO you mean 1191 for Twosret?

[Toblm]

Originally posted by Elitewrecker PT:

DO you mean 1191 for Twosret?

Yes. Thank you.

[Fyrnir]

Originally posted by Toblm:

The remaining 8 Pharaohs of the 20th Dynasty of Egypt are all named Ramesses

Lmao, bet that makes learning the history hard. At least we English had a rotation of like 4 or 5 of the same name to keep things fresh. With something wild like 'Egbert' once in a while for a lil jazz.

[Kendji]

We actually don't know the exact lineage of the Pharaohs, except for Merenptah and Seti II. Other than that Tausert, Amenmesse, Setnakht, Siptah where related to the 19th Dynasty. Thus Ramesses III who is from the 20th, is probably also a 19th dynasty decendant.

[Toblm]

Originally posted by Kendji:

We actually don't know the exact lineage of the Pharaohs, except for Merenptah snd Seti II. Other than that Tausert, Amenmesse, Setnakht, Siptah where related to the 19th Dynasty. Thus Ramesses III who is from the 20th, is probably also a 19th dynasty decendant.

Like most royal families, a new dynasty doesnt preclude family relations.
English Royal Families are an excellent example of this. Windsor was related to Hanover which was related to Stuart.
The Egyptian Dynasties just represent a break with the official succession,

[Kendji]

Originally posted by Toblm:

Originally posted by Kendji:

We actually don't know the exact lineage of the Pharaohs, except for Merenptah snd Seti II. Other than that Tausert, Amenmesse, Setnakht, Siptah where related to the 19th Dynasty. Thus Ramesses III who is from the 20th, is probably also a 19th dynasty decendant.

Like most royal families, a new dynasty doesnt preclude family relations.
English Royal Families are an excellent example of this. Windsor was related to Hanover which was related to Stuart.
The Egyptian Dynasties just represent a break with the official succession,

Those Dynasty definitions actually go back to Manetho and are more an way to organize Ancient Egypt into periods than actusl lineage.

Having read books on this, almost every Egyptologist states something completly different about some of these last rulers of the 19th. It's very confusing. Usually you can tell what book an author or youtuber has read by how they describe Amenmesse or Tausret etc. it's funny :D

[Toblm]

Originally posted by Kendji:

Originally posted by Toblm:

Like most royal families, a new dynasty doesnt preclude family relations.
English Royal Families are an excellent example of this. Windsor was related to Hanover which was related to Stuart.
The Egyptian Dynasties just represent a break with the official succession,

Those Dynasty definitions actually go back to Manetho and are more an way to organize Ancient Egypt into periods than actusl lineage.

Having read books on this, almost every Egyptologist states something completly different about some of these last rulers of the 19th. It's very confusing. Usually you can tell what book an author or youtuber has read by how they describe Amenmesse or Tausret etc. it's funny :D

It's history. Things are rarely as clean cut as one hopes. Tausret in particular depends on how one wants to frame her rule. 'queen' dowagers are technically not dynastic if they are ruling in their own name. And the only gets more complicated if its more of a consort role.

[Kendji]

Originally posted by Toblm:

Originally posted by Kendji:

Those Dynasty definitions actually go back to Manetho and are more an way to organize Ancient Egypt into periods than actusl lineage.

Having read books on this, almost every Egyptologist states something completly different about some of these last rulers of the 19th. It's very confusing. Usually you can tell what book an author or youtuber has read by how they describe Amenmesse or Tausret etc. it's funny :D

It's history. Things are rarely as clean cut as one hopes. Tausret in particular depends on how one wants to frame her rule. 'queen' dowagers are technically not dynastic if they are ruling in their own name. And the only gets more complicated if its more of a consort role.

Yeah, true, though this period has more uncertanity attached to it, because Amenmesse destroyed traces of Seti when he invaded and Seti later returned the favour. A lot of the stuff that gives us clarity previously and later isn't there. I think this is why CA those this period. So Seti might have wiped the bulletproof evidence on who's kid Amenmesse was. Some think he was Seti's own son even.

The Egyptian Dynasties aren't quite the same as later. The last Pharaoh of the 17th is the founder of the 18th, though he would not have thought so, to him they would have been the same. Manetho created them as an after construction in the Ptolemaic period. This is unlike medieval europe where every one was aware of their dysasties in real time and thus recorded it so then.

Srry, I'm a huge history nerd :)

Edit: Tausert took the male title Pharaoh, there was a different title for pharaohs wife etc. There was no queen title, though pharaohs wife is seen as a cognate. Hapshetsut did this differently, not as boldly as Tausert

[Toblm]

Originally posted by Kendji:

Originally posted by Toblm:

It's history. Things are rarely as clean cut as one hopes. Tausret in particular depends on how one wants to frame her rule. 'queen' dowagers are technically not dynastic if they are ruling in their own name. And the only gets more complicated if its more of a consort role.

Yeah, true, though this period has more uncertanity attached to it, because Amenmesse destroyed traces of Seti when he invaded and Seti later returned the favour. A lot of the stuff that gives us clarity previously and later isn't there. I think this is why CA those this period. So Seti might have wiped the bulletproof evidence on who's kid Amenmesse was. Some think he was Seti's own son even.

The Egyptian Dynasties aren't quite the same as later. The last Pharaoh of the 17th is the founder of the 18th, though he would not have thought so, to him they would have been the same. Manetho created them as an after construction in the Ptolemaic period. This is unlike medieval europe where every one was aware of their dysasties in real time and thus recorded it so then.

Srry, I'm a huge history nerd :)

Except it is like medieval Europe, we just need another 2000 years and a couple major disasters. There are similar amounts of uncertainty during the early medieval period, where some lineages are simply fabricated to suit the current ruling house.

But no need to be sorry. I made the post as an overview to help those whose knowledge of Ancient Egypt begins and ends with Pharaoh and Pyramids.

[Kendji]

There are this YTer called Oldest Stories that have good 'lore' videos on this topic and there is also an wiki article on how the 19th dynasty ended, also thete is a good history guide here on steam twp guides. For those interested in further research ;)

[Kendji]

Bump. I feel the forum is filled with people more interested in arguing which side of the zero sum game is best.
Forgetting this topic/op in all this controversy.
A good guide related to this topic
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3043204315

The setting is actually kinda interesting the more one reads up on it imo.