ROMAN MYTHOLOGY -> Elephant in the Room

[Lord Haart]

Hi all,

So far I would say the obvious omission is Roman mythology.

Roman mythology offers a vast and intricate pantheon, filled with gods, heroes, and legendary creatures that could bring fresh dynamics to the game. Imagine commanding the likes of Jupiter, Mars, and Neptune, each with unique powers and myth units, adding depth and variety to gameplay.

The Romans have left an indelible mark on history, influencing countless aspects of modern civilization. Their myths and legends are no exception, providing a treasure trove of stories and characters that could enrich the narrative and strategic elements.

Begs DLC.

I'd be very interested to hear what you think.

[jonoliveira12]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Thor II:

Ursprungligen skrivet av Thor II:

I can't do full tech three..... but I have some different ideas for the Romans.

Ps: The Romans are not my priority, but if they are going to come anyway, better do it right.

1 - Of course we could do the basics, what everyone expects. and anyone who has a modicum of sanity wants it not to happen. Jupiter, Mars and +1 major gods. Bellona, Juno, and some other gods Exclusive to Roman mythology mixed with Greek gods with Roman names. Aeneid, Romulus and Remus, Big wolves, Legions, lots of copies of what we already have in the Greeks and Atlanteans, etc., etc.

2 - Civic religion, the cult of emperors, were very important in Rome. Instead of traditional mythology, we could use this civic mythology so important in Rome. Julius Caesar, Octavius Augustus and +1 important emperor as major gods, less important emperors as minor gods. The heroes would be the most important Roman generals (a bit like Greek heroes, I know), the divine powers could be a buff for the troops or/and the economy, representing the abilities of on the battlefield and in the administration of these emperors, Julius Caesar, for example, could give the power to build a wall around some enemy construction (reference to the siege of Alesia). Mythical units could be Legions, Auxiliary Troops, Cavalry, etc. which historically achieved many feats and became famous, being much stronger than the normal versions (Reference to being veterans and the weight they carry for being in such a famous Legion). In other words, always trying to maintain the human theme, being a more realistic Civ. This is my favorite option.

3 - In this option, we can solve two problems at once, a Roman Civ and a Christian Civs. "But it's impossible, Christians are monotheistic", no, it's not impossible. We could have Father (God), Son (Jesus )and Holy Spirit as the three Major gods, Or Jesus, Mary and Joseph, or the Archangels Michael, Gabriel and Lucifer (or Raphael if you want to be less controversial), of lesser gods we can have angels or saints ( and they could all date back to the Roman period), or angels can be the lesser gods and the saints the heroes. Anyway, there are several options here. With this resolved, divine powers and Mythic units would not be a problem.

4 - Ultimately, the Romans could be to AOM what the US is to AOE III. Historically, the Romans adopted gods from several pantheons, then we would have Jupiter, Mars and +1 major gods, Bellona, Janus and other gods exclusive to the Romans as minor gods + Minor gods from different pantheons that were adopted by the Romans, such as Isis (as a minor goddess) and Mithra, represented in the Roman way, that is, an Isis, a Dionysus different from the Original. The main difference between this and first option is that first option is a blatant copy of the in game Greeks and Atlanteans, this option is a copy based historically on the way the Romans themselves appropriated of the gods of the conquered peoples. In practice, this brings versatility and makes it seem less like a copy.

Ursprungligen skrivet av jonoliveira12:

Atlanteans already have all the Roman units, and teh Carthaginian navy. There is no point to either of those civs.

Ursprungligen skrivet av -sb- zveroboy:

The Atlanteans already have the Roman aesthetic, and half of Roman mythology is essentially Greek mythology that's been rebadged and expanded on.

Ursprungligen skrivet av Thor II:

I never understood why the Atlanteans covered all the Roman Themes. The only Roman thing that the Atlanteans have, in my opinion, is the Gladiators.

Emperors? No. Civic Religion? No. Legions? No. Tower Shield + Gladius+ Pilum + Lorica Sgmentata? No. Jupiter and Mars as major gods? No. Exclusively Roman gods? No. Roman Architecture? No.

What exactly would these "actual themes" be?

You're basically saying "The Atlanteans have Llamas, an Inca element, so the Incas are already very well represented, it's impossible to add them to the game". Same thing.

The Atlantean Retold units are LITERALLY Roman to the point they actually have Legionairies!

There is no point on making a Romans civ now. Their units would just be EXACTLY the Atlantean ones.

[Thor II]

Is that so? What unit is this that is representing the legionnaire, with Tower Shield, Gladius, Pilum, Lorica and everything else?

All I see are Gladiator inspired units, hardly an adequate representation of the Romans.

Everything that is presented on this subject (Atlanteans = Romans ) is extremely vague. Just repeat the same things over and over again without presenting evidence or refuting arguments to the contrary.

[jonoliveira12]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Thor II:

Is that so? What unit is this that is representing the legionnaire, with Tower Shield, Gladius, Pilum, Lorica and everything else?

All I see are Gladiator inspired units, hardly an adequate representation of the Romans.

Everything that is presented on this subject (Atlantes = Romanos) is extremely vague. Just repeat the same things over and over again without presenting evidence or refuting arguments to the contrary.

Destroyer. Go look up what the new Destroyer, Katapeltes, Turma and Contarius look like. They just look like Roman units point blank.

[Νικόλαος]

As much as I'd love seeing a third Hellenic civilization/pantheon being added into the game, it's not a smart move. There are a ton of other mythologies that can be added and explored here and adding Romans won't do nothing good to the game in my opinion as they pretty much copied a lot of things if not everything from the Greeks.

I'd love to see anything from the Celts to the Japanese or even some Slavic pantheon.

[Thor II]

Dude, they are gladiators, they are all gladiators.

Destroyer: A mixture of secutor with the reriarius.

Murmillo: There is literally a gladiator with that name, with those same characteristics.

Fanatic: Dimachaerus has these same characteristics .

The evidence is clear, the information and references do not lie. I'm not saying there aren't references to Romans, but they're not even remotely revering the right things. It is not even remotely enough to be considered an adequate and sufficient representation of the Roman.

And honestly, the look of all these units and the architecture It doesn't remind me of the Romans at all.

[David McMurdo]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Alexandre:

Ursprungligen skrivet av David McMurdo:

Here's hoping for India next.

No, we don't need more woke crap

How would the inclusion of India be woke? Given the sheer number of gods in Hinduism and the sheer variety among them, it's practically tailor made for the concept of this game. I'd like to see the Celts too. And some kind of Native American nation down the line. I'm assuming they won't be stopping after the second pantheon is revealed, though I guess that depends on sales.

[Keïnos]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Doomed World:

Ursprungligen skrivet av Keïnos:

I don't think Celts are popular enough for a DLC now. For the second extension, I bet on Babylonians, Mayans or Japanese. Maybe Indians but with ancient vedism, not today's hinduism.

Persians

A mazdeist pantheon would be nice but not known enough neither for a next DLC.

Ursprungligen skrivet av Thor II:

Ursprungligen skrivet av Thor II:

I can't do full tech three..... but I have some different ideas for the Romans.

Ps: The Romans are not my priority, but if they are going to come anyway, better do it right.

1 - Of course we could do the basics, what everyone expects. and anyone who has a modicum of sanity wants it not to happen. Jupiter, Mars and +1 major gods. Bellona, Juno, and some other gods Exclusive to Roman mythology mixed with Greek gods with Roman names. Aeneid, Romulus and Remus, Big wolves, Legions, lots of copies of what we already have in the Greeks and Atlanteans, etc., etc.

Jupiter, Juno and Minerva are the Capitolin Triad and can be used as a base for the three main gods, or Quirinus maybe. There's Janus in the Roman gods.

I don't think Christianism is suited for the gameplay. Maybe as a "revolution" like the idea I had with India and Buddhism instead of the mythic age.

[Keïnos]

Ursprungligen skrivet av David McMurdo:

I'm assuming they won't be stopping after the second pantheon is revealed, though I guess that depends on sales.

The second will probably be a tests to see if people are interested and will use popular or know pantheons. China was in the extended edition, so it's just a matter of reworking something already done and improve it.

[Aya]

Roman would just be alternate names for the Greek civilization tbh

[David McMurdo]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Keïnos:

Ursprungligen skrivet av David McMurdo:

I'm assuming they won't be stopping after the second pantheon is revealed, though I guess that depends on sales.

The second will probably be a tests to see if people are interested and will use popular or know pantheons. China was in the extended edition, so it's just a matter of reworking something already done and improve it.

I assume they'll rework the Chinese DLC. As an AoM fan I was going to buy it for AoM, but then I saw the overwhelmingly negative response—apparently it was regarded as a lazy piece of work. Hopefully this new Chinese DLC will be improved.

[Ry]

I'll just say this.

The Titans should have gone by their Roman names, and have the reveal that the new Gods the Atlanteans were worshiping are the Titans after the Mount Olympus mission.

[Lokaror]

Ursprungligen skrivet av David McMurdo:

Ursprungligen skrivet av Keïnos:

The second will probably be a tests to see if people are interested and will use popular or know pantheons. China was in the extended edition, so it's just a matter of reworking something already done and improve it.

I assume they'll rework the Chinese DLC. As an AoM fan I was going to buy it for AoM, but then I saw the overwhelmingly negative response—apparently it was regarded as a lazy piece of work. Hopefully this new Chinese DLC will be improved.

It would be hard for the chinese to be worse this time around.

[Aya]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Lokaror:

Ursprungligen skrivet av David McMurdo:

I assume they'll rework the Chinese DLC. As an AoM fan I was going to buy it for AoM, but then I saw the overwhelmingly negative response—apparently it was regarded as a lazy piece of work. Hopefully this new Chinese DLC will be improved.

It would be hard for the chinese to be worse this time around.

Wonder if a do-over would be more productive than trying to make the AOMEX DLC good? Imagine instead of gods, the player recruited generals from the Three Kingdoms saga that are just as much of a myth as they are man

[Keïnos]

Ursprungligen skrivet av David McMurdo:

apparently it was regarded as a lazy piece of work. Hopefully this new Chinese DLC will be improved.

I wouldn't call it a lazy piece of work. It was made by the same team that gave us the forgotten empire and other DLC for Age of Empire II before the Definitive edition. In my opinion, they tried to make a good extention for Age of mythology but modding a civ for AoE and AoM isn't quite the same, they had to create new units, building, myth units, powers and everything from nothing, when the only specificities in Age of Empire were two techs and one unit

[Lord Haart]

Shortly™