Suikoden I - Minimum stars?

[Tatra]

I was just wondering; has anyone ever looked into what happens if you try to finish S1 with as few surviving stars as possible?

"Surviving" is the trick here; it's simple enough to just not pick up any optional stars I suppose, but I was thinking about also having characters die during the major battle scenes. How low can it go, and what does the ending look like?

Relatedly, is it possible to kill off seemingly plot-critical characters, and if so, what winds up happening? Trying to imagine that final escape from the castle without Viktor and/or Flik for example.

[WookieToucher]

!!!!!WARNING SPOILERS!!!!!

Well, seeing as the entire game is scripted with very little actual variation, there is no way for plot critical characters to die. There are no scripted events in which flik or victor die so it cannot happen. Sure, Pahn can die, but that event happens no matter what and he is essentially superfluous to the plot after that point so his death only matters when it comes to Gremio's revival. Deaths in war battles only matter for Gremio. Deaths of enemy generals only matter for the final scene with the emperor and, again, Gremio.

[weiss]

Originally posted by Tatra:

I was just wondering; has anyone ever looked into what happens if you try to finish S1 with as few surviving stars as possible?

"Surviving" is the trick here; it's simple enough to just not pick up any optional stars I suppose, but I was thinking about also having characters die during the major battle scenes. How low can it go, and what does the ending look like?

Relatedly, is it possible to kill off seemingly plot-critical characters, and if so, what winds up happening? Trying to imagine that final escape from the castle without Viktor and/or Flik for example.

S1 has only 2 endings.
nothing will change the alternate ending ... doesnt matter how few characters you have hired. flik and viktor for example cant die in battle (i believe they arent even listed ever when in field battle).

with other words, characters which are crucial for the mainstory can and will not die.
you will have aswell always your nearly 20000 troups at the final battle regardless of how much characters you have recruited.

suikoden 2 has 4 outcomes:
a really bad ending.
2 standard endings.
and a good ending (all 108 stars+nanami alive required).

[Ray Rook]

Originally posted by weiss:

hired. flik and viktor for example cant die in battle (i believe they arent even listed ever when in field battle).

Yes, they are.

And there are more than 2 endings. if you don't recruit someone they will not get a entry at the end.

I think that subtlety is what they're asking.

OP, I've never seen Flik or Viktor die in the major battles. But they can be sent. I also never tried to get characters to die.

[Zeo]

Originally posted by Tatra:

I was just wondering; has anyone ever looked into what happens if you try to finish S1 with as few surviving stars as possible?

"Surviving" is the trick here; it's simple enough to just not pick up any optional stars I suppose, but I was thinking about also having characters die during the major battle scenes. How low can it go, and what does the ending look like?

Relatedly, is it possible to kill off seemingly plot-critical characters, and if so, what winds up happening? Trying to imagine that final escape from the castle without Viktor and/or Flik for example.

Big Dan have a series where he makes the worst possible future in certain games, I had Luc dying in a war battle in Suiko 1 (I loaded the game of course) so I was wondering what a Suiko 2 would like if we:

1. recruit only stars that can go through suiko 2
   
2. try killing as many suiko 1~2 units as possible

[weiss]

Originally posted by Zeo:

Originally posted by Tatra:

I was just wondering; has anyone ever looked into what happens if you try to finish S1 with as few surviving stars as possible?

"Surviving" is the trick here; it's simple enough to just not pick up any optional stars I suppose, but I was thinking about also having characters die during the major battle scenes. How low can it go, and what does the ending look like?

Relatedly, is it possible to kill off seemingly plot-critical characters, and if so, what winds up happening? Trying to imagine that final escape from the castle without Viktor and/or Flik for example.

Big Dan have a series where he makes the worst possible future in certain games, I had Luc dying in a war battle in Suiko 1 (I loaded the game of course) so I was wondering what a Suiko 2 would like if we:

1. recruit only stars that can go through suiko 2
   
2. try killing as many suiko 1~2 units as possible

luc isnt important for the story after he got recruited, just saying.

Originally posted by Ray Rook:

Originally posted by weiss:

hired. flik and viktor for example cant die in battle (i believe they arent even listed ever when in field battle).

Yes, they are.

And there are more than 2 endings. if you don't recruit someone they will not get a entry at the end.

I think that subtlety is what they're asking.

OP, I've never seen Flik or Viktor die in the major battles. But they can be sent. I also never tried to get characters to die.

stop spreading things which arent true ...
https://game8.co/games/Suikoden-1/archives/493248 <-- link is a spoiler
there are only 2 endings in suikoden 1
the alternate ending where tir leaves alone
and the ending where gremio gets revived due to having all 108 stars and havent lost any during battles and leaves at the end with tir together gregminster or how they get named in the guide, normal and golden ending.
why do you say things which are simply NOT true?
are you doing this intentionally? ya gonna call me a child again because am proving you wrong?
if you count the entries as ending at the end would the game have 108 different endings, the entries do not count ... lol.
oh yea, and before you try to correct me with suikoden 2 aswell
https://game8.co/games/Suikoden-2/archives/496394 <-- link aswell a spoiler.

boing, merged both posts =w=.

[Ray Rook]

Originally posted by weiss:

Originally posted by Zeo:

Big Dan have a series where he makes the worst possible future in certain games, I had Luc dying in a war battle in Suiko 1 (I loaded the game of course) so I was wondering what a Suiko 2 would like if we:

1. recruit only stars that can go through suiko 2
   
2. try killing as many suiko 1~2 units as possible

luc isnt important for the story after he got recruited, just saying.

Originally posted by Ray Rook:

Yes, they are.

And there are more than 2 endings. if you don't recruit someone they will not get a entry at the end.

I think that subtlety is what they're asking.

OP, I've never seen Flik or Viktor die in the major battles. But they can be sent. I also never tried to get characters to die.

stop spreading things which arent true ...
https://game8.co/games/Suikoden-1/archives/493248 <-- link is a spoiler
there are only 2 endings in suikoden 1
the alternate ending where tir leaves alone
and the ending where gremio gets revived due to having all 108 stars and havent lost any during battles and leaves at the end with tir together gregminster or how they get named in the guide, normal and golden ending.
why do you say things which are simply NOT true?
are you doing this intentionally? ya gonna call me a child again because am proving you wrong?
if you count the entries as ending at the end would the game have 108 different endings, the entries do not count ... lol.
oh yea, and before you try to correct me with suikoden 2 aswell
https://game8.co/games/Suikoden-2/archives/496394 <-- link aswell a spoiler.

boing, merged both posts =w=.

The banners are what I'm referring to. If you don't get the subtlety, that's fine. Stay blocked. I only replied to you to help OP.

[weiss]

Originally posted by Ray Rook:

The banners are what I'm referring to. If you don't get the subtlety, that's fine. Stay blocked. I only replied to you to help OP.

stop making excuses ...srsly.
there are no different banners. you got proven wrong and you can (yet again) not accept it.
and you called me a child? maybe you should really look into a mirror how you sit there grumblng about it.
and you have me blocked? i´d recomment you to not click the show button then if you have peoples blocked. it doesnt helps OP either if you tell them false informations.
(or you trying to get me temp banned, could be aswell aka trying to tickle an insult out of me torwards you).
btw, again, the banners at the end which telling what every char does after the events do not count as ending. otherwise would the game have 108 endings+the normal and golden ending. (110)
they do not count!
or if you would go even further when you count the banners as ending (which do not count) over 130 endings since a dozen characters can die in battle and get a "has fallen in battle" instead.

[Tatra]

Originally posted by Ray Rook:

Originally posted by weiss:

hired. flik and viktor for example cant die in battle (i believe they arent even listed ever when in field battle).

Yes, they are.

And there are more than 2 endings. if you don't recruit someone they will not get a entry at the end.

I think that subtlety is what they're asking.

Yes, pretty much that. I'm not expecting profound storyline diversions, but I was wondering about how empty that list can be and other little things like, for example, how empty the room can be during the cutscene where, if you have everyone, Gremio comes back.

I do appreciate everyone's confirmation that plot-critical characters can't be lost during the major battle scenes; I assumed that was the case, but I was amused by the idea of key characters just not being there later on and cutscenes not making a lot of sense as a result, and I wondered how the dev's had accounted for that. With invincibility flags, apparently! :)

[weiss]

gremio doesnt comes back tho. you need a perfect game in order to get him revived like, even if you have all 108 stars but 1 died during battle will there be no gremio comming back to life.

[Tatra]

Originally posted by weiss:

gremio doesnt comes back tho. you need a perfect game in order to get him revived like, even if you have all 108 stars but 1 died during battle will there be no gremio comming back to life.

Yeah, I know. The bit where I said "if you have everyone" was the clue, there. I was saying, in the version of the cutscene where you don't have everyone and so Gremio doesn't come back, I'm wondering just how sparse it can be; it's hard to get info on that, because everyone focuses on the 100% path.

Unless you're saying that cutscene doesn't occur at all, in which case, cool, thanks for the info. Swap in any/all late game cutscenes where optional/killable characters appear, that one was just an example (which is why I said "for example").

[weiss]

Originally posted by Tatra:

Originally posted by weiss:

gremio doesnt comes back tho. you need a perfect game in order to get him revived like, even if you have all 108 stars but 1 died during battle will there be no gremio comming back to life.

Yeah, I know. The bit where I said "if you have everyone" was the clue, there. I was saying, in the version of the cutscene where you don't have everyone and so Gremio doesn't come back, I'm wondering just how sparse it can be; it's hard to get info on that, because everyone focuses on the 100% path.

Unless you're saying that cutscene doesn't occur at all, in which case, cool, thanks for the info. Swap in any/all late game cutscenes where optional/killable characters appear, that one was just an example (which is why I said "for example").

nono, the cutscene will happen just no gremio x3.