By all means a game should be challenging...but...

[daveyfunk]

when a game has mechanics built into it to forcibly make you change for no reason it's simply not fun. I've played this game A LOT and every time it gets to a point where your tactic magically doesn't work. I changed my tactic again and went a win streak of 17 games and all of a sudden hit a rut...this happens EVERY time!!! The game simply has a built in mechanic that your tactic becomes less impactful after a point and it's simply ridiculous. By all means I like a challenge, but this isn't a challenge as you can't do a damn thing about it and it's inevitable every time that this WILL happen. I outplay the opposition, get way more chances and at some point I start drawing and losing games and my team play like sh*t despite high morale, reacting well to team talks and all the rest

This really needs changing as it's not fun and SO tiresome to the point where there's no point

[Arlen Tektolnes]

The mechanic you're encountering is likely just other teams playing more conservatively against you because you'd been winning. I see it all the time when promoted; they underestimate the newcomers and go on the attack, then get punished for it. Halfway through the season they collectively realise that we're actually a threat and start playing more defensively.

Factor in that most human players generally go for relatively risky offense focused tactics, and it's pretty easy to see how the AI playing more defensively and taking fewer risks means you start losing more.

[zachary.whyte]

As the above user mentioned, initially opposition teams will assess your team’s threat level in terms of your reputation and your pre-season league prediction.

As you play through the season, the game will recalculate your threat level. For example, if your team is performing above expectations, they will react by treating your team as more of a danger. They might play more defensively and hit you on the counter.

This doesn’t mean you have to delete your current tactic. Instead, you might just need to tweak a few things. Also, I would recommend having another tactic ready (a more defensive one for example) to shake things up every now and then.

[daveyfunk]

Originally posted by zachary.whyte:

As the above user mentioned, initially opposition teams will assess your team’s threat level in terms of your reputation and your pre-season league prediction.

As you play through the season, the game will recalculate your threat level. For example, if your team is performing above expectations, they will react by treating your team as more of a danger. They might play more defensively and hit you on the counter.

This doesn’t mean you have to delete your current tactic. Instead, you might just need to tweak a few things. Also, I would recommend having another tactic ready (a more defensive one for example) to shake things up every now and then.

Apart from I'm the top team in the world and I'm favourite every game. As I said in my opening post, I've changed tactics numerous times and this just happens where you hit a wall and it's inevitable...not fun!!! By all means I can change tactics but not just coz it stops working because the game forces you to do it. What's the point in that?

[Kerpal]

Originally posted by daveyfunk:

Originally posted by zachary.whyte:

As the above user mentioned, initially opposition teams will assess your team’s threat level in terms of your reputation and your pre-season league prediction.

As you play through the season, the game will recalculate your threat level. For example, if your team is performing above expectations, they will react by treating your team as more of a danger. They might play more defensively and hit you on the counter.

This doesn’t mean you have to delete your current tactic. Instead, you might just need to tweak a few things. Also, I would recommend having another tactic ready (a more defensive one for example) to shake things up every now and then.

Apart from I'm the top team in the world and I'm favourite every game. As I said in my opening post, I've changed tactics numerous times and this just happens where you hit a wall and it's inevitable...not fun!!! By all means I can change tactics but not just coz it stops working because the game forces you to do it. What's the point in that?

I can fully understand you and seriosuly and that is here the question "is everything really working as SI is us telling"? Or is it a fake simulation of what they are tellung us?
If everything is working as SI is telling us then SI is very welcome to make an video about tactics and counters and what happening if you change your status into a thread or the KI find out you play with the same tactic to long or the tactic is just OP and they start to counter? Just from the KI side. Just like an typical developer video. We have never got deeper information about that important point or what is possible from the KI side in FM23. How strong the KI is just for an example.
I mean I think there is no better way too proove SI that everything is ok with the match-engine and it is for sure a sensible topic every year. I know that alot of players does not trust anymore the features to 100%. And I think some kind of this stuff can change everything into the right way between us the customers and of course SI.
Or even they do not such a video now but for the FM24 alone this would be enough to sort some things out.

Why shouldn't SI just convince us? Many publishers do that before starting a new game for an example or even if they implement a new feature or even strenghtenend the the KI. They show things exactly how they work without going too deep into the subject. Maybe it is just an missunderstanding from both sides?

[Stinboi]

i agree with op, in rl most teams do their research and atleast the worster team try to adapt their gamplay against better team for best result, but ven then they rarely succeed

In FM it comes to a point where its impossible to win after awhile and its tiresome, seems like its bad balancing of that mechanic.

and btw is this a new mechanic for FM 23? didnt notice this in 22.

this season in FM i barely lost any games the first half of the season and was leading the serie like 12-15 point, second half i cant seem to win, ohh except against the top teams, they are fairly easy to beat but dont help mutch when you cant beat any teams below the 8th place, even lost the cup agains a league 2 teams and im a top team in PL.

CL however i have won the last 2 years with my second team, Barcalona, Liverpool etc is easy to beat in CL with my reserves.

i keep playing but damn its alot of strange things in this years FM, seems like they totally failed on balancing the game.

I do understand why SI want to make AI smarter and adapt to the matches, but it seems like its very unbalanced.

[daveyfunk]

Keep getting the same rhetoric from those that represent SI on this forum, but there are definitely mechanics in place that affect your tactic at a given time.

The two posts in reply at the top have nothing to do with it and instead of the game being challenging it just all of a sudden makes your tactic crap haha

I'm the best team in the world and so the team adapting to my 'threat' level makes no sense as I've been the best team in the world for a few seasons and been favourite every game.

I watch games in full when adjusting tactics and all of a sudden players don't mark, stop chasing opposition, pass like they're a pub team, can't control the ball, opposition GK all become Gordon Banks etc

Happens regardless of what you do

[Terminal Velocity]

It's not a "slight" change in your opposition. It causes your tactics to stop working, you start losing, all your players get "sad" and play even worse, and it cascades into a downward spiral that will ruin your team.

Not to mention if you have to change formation and you've hired good players in positions you are no longer fielding a player in, they get "sad" and start trouble because they no longer get to play.

In combination with the morale system which causes players to forget how to play football if they are sad, this just ruins the ingame experience unless you buy the Editor and tick unsackable, because the moment you hit a downward spiral you almost as good as fired unless you re build almost your entire team from scratch.

[zeeb]

An approach that I use sometimes in lower leagues is that if your players have horrible stamina, you can play the first half with a defensive tactic (short passing, time wasting etc), then go full on max Gegenpress during the second half. That way you minimize the damage done to your team during your opponents "phase" and maximize the damage inflicted during yours, which would be the second half.

Hopefully your opponents have lost significant stamina during their attack. But keep an eye on your players morale since it can drop hard if your opponents starts to score.

Take your players into consideration when you build your tactics, also fatigue is a thing, your players will get progressively more tired during the season. You need a Sports Scientist to monitor this, which is what I always try and hire first along with a Performance Analyst so I can see what my team is good or bad at and adjust accordingly with tweaks and signings.

Always try and have 3 tactics done that your team increases familiarity with.
1 offensive tactic, 1 defensive tactic and 1 balanced tactic. Then you make changes to the tactics on the fly during the game since those changes does not save. Does the opponent have a weak left back? Exploit it by focusing the attack there. Do they have an exhausted or injured player? Add heavy tackles on the dude and force them to take him off or lower his morale. Do their forward have a weak left foot? Force him to rely on it.

I usually always try to press midfielders and go with some rough tackles on them since they're the engine of most (if not all) tactics. Tiring them out or injuring them might alone give you a win. It's not sportsmanlike, but it's professional, you're there to win, not to make friends.

[Gigi Daša]

To the first 2 replies, "they adapt"... Adapt to what?
Same stats as before, like 26:2 shots, 10:1 on target, xG 2.78-0.32, 3-0 CCC.. etc.. But they adapt your bombing and convert a nice 2vs4 counter attack.
Or they press a "FMing" button :)

[Tiberius]

17 games win streak is also often times unrealistic, but obviously you nvr care

[Gigi Daša]

@Tiberius
So true. I often got an incredible winning streak, like 8w, or 12 matches 11w 1d. For no big reason, as mid/bottom table team. It certainly feels more of a scripted than me being that good :)

[Ngoc]

I wish the AI could whine about human players and their OP team it would be funny to listen! humans get pretty boring pretty quickly with their whine i am sure AI would be more entertaining trying to understand all the dirty trick humans use to win 30-40 times in raw.

[daveyfunk]

Originally posted by Ngoc:

I wish the AI could whine about human players and their OP team it would be funny to listen! humans get pretty boring pretty quickly with their whine i am sure AI would be more entertaining trying to understand all the dirty trick humans use to win 30-40 times in raw.

What? Yes, I'm playing 'dirty tricks'. I'm not saying I should win 30-40 times in a row, but it gets to a point in the game where all of a sudden it seems your tactic is less effective and it's inevitable that happens. Not necessarily that you lose but you hit a slump no matter what. Try replying with some sense or something useful rather than just being a ♥♥♥♥

[Gigi Daša]

In my opinion, due to the all dirty human tricks, exploits and meta, sometimes the game uses scripting to balance the season out.
It is not all against human, many times i ve caught the form, winning streak, which i did not deserve :)

[daveyfunk]

and to add another thing...yes, things in this game are scripted!!! If you load and save in the transfer window you'll find the same clubs will make the same bids for your players. This doesn't necessarily mean things are fixed, but there are certain scripts in the game

The fact of saying 'managers learn your tactics' makes no sense in a game as the game can only replicate this by making your tactic less effective at a certain point. That is the issue