Clair Obscur: Expedition 33

Clair Obscur: Expedition 33

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Kylvan May 28 @ 5:16pm
Accessibility - For minor deaf or hearing impaired
Hello,
It could be great to add accessibility options for minor deaf or hearing impaired, so more people could enjoy the game.

Thanks.
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Showing 1-10 of 10 comments
Please specify what accessibility options you are requesting. We can't read your mind.
MrQun May 28 @ 5:52pm 
I am also hard of hearing and I am of the firm belief that there should be more Pictos that can either widen or narrow the window for dodges/ parries with a possible drawback.

Example 1: The window to dodge/ parry is increased by 30% but counter damage is reduced by 30%.
Example 2: The window to dodge/ parry is decreased by 30% but counter damage is increased by 30%

This will give casual and hardcore players more build options.
This PC May 28 @ 6:22pm 
The patterns are learnable - you can approach the game that way, mobs only have a couple each, and eventually, you will have other defensive layers than parries/dodges, this game is mostly played from the menu before you enter battles rofl.

You have mods to help yourselves out as well. This isn't a problem about being deaf or not, as I don't use sound cues and plenty of people with ears struggle with the parries as well. ^^''

I understand it sucks to be impaired, but no one has to be responsible for that ?
You can however help yourself. ^^
Last edited by This PC; May 28 @ 6:25pm
Speaty May 28 @ 6:26pm 
I think Kylvan have problem with dodge/ parry... and saying it in other way :)
Originally posted by MrQun:
I am also hard of hearing and I am of the firm belief that there should be more Pictos that can either widen or narrow the window for dodges/ parries with a possible drawback.
Example 1: The window to dodge/ parry is increased by 30% but counter damage is reduced by 30%.
Example 2: The window to dodge/ parry is decreased by 30% but counter damage is increased by 30%
This will give casual and hardcore players more build options.

Ok, so more visual indications rather than audio cues when it comes to timings for dodge/parry. That's reasonable enough. There are currently mods for the PC version that can adjust these things until official adjustments can be made. However, given how long the game has been out and how the devs seem to think everyone should be able to perform a dodge or parry in a window of time ranging from 150 to 350 milliseconds.

And fortunately for those of us who require accessibility, mods can make up the difference. I hope that at least for the Dodge/Parry stuff you consider using mods; many of them can be found on Nexus Mods :)

Originally posted by This PC:
The patterns are learnable - you can approach the game that way, mobs only have a couple each, and eventually, you will have other defensive layers than parries/dodges, this game is mostly played from the menu before you enter battles rofl.
You have mods to help yourselves out as well. This isn't a problem about being deaf or not, as I don't use sound cues and plenty of people with ears struggle with the parries as well. ^^''
I understand it sucks to be impaired, but no one has to be responsible for that ?
You can however help yourself. ^^
You need to stop. You are not helping and only seem like more of a hateful person than anyone needs to be. You are the very stereotype of an egotistical 'gamerbro' who doesn't know the difference between accessibility and difficulty. Expressing discrimination against those who have different necessities to enjoy video games doesn't help anyone.

Originally posted by Speaty:
I think Kylvan have problem with dodge/ parry... and saying it in other way :)
This isn't about having an issue with dodge/parry alone, this is about the game's over-reliance on audio cues for performing dodge/parry properly within the narrow time window.
Last edited by Daedalus007; May 28 @ 6:32pm
Kylvan May 28 @ 7:00pm 
Originally posted by Daedalus007:
Please specify what accessibility options you are requesting. We can't read your mind.
Little twinkle light when you should use parry button or dodge for example on the move, attach to the attack visual (spell coming at you or part of the monster hitting you) and diffrents colors for daltonism.

My friend can play ZZZ without effort, but cannot parry or dodge without making a huge effort on CO:33.
Last edited by Kylvan; May 28 @ 7:02pm
This PC May 28 @ 7:08pm 
Originally posted by Daedalus007:
You need to stop. You are not helping and only seem like more of a hateful person than anyone needs to be. You are the very stereotype of an egotistical 'gamerbro' who doesn't know the difference between accessibility and difficulty. Expressing discrimination against those who have different necessities to enjoy video games doesn't help anyone.

ironic that you call me a hateful person and you go off on me because you disagree with me, I haven't hated on anyone, I have my own disability issues and I don't impose them on anyone, and usually when I try, I get exactly that kind of response, and you know what, I think it's fair, no one has to be responsible for my situation, even if I'm not responsible for it myself. ^^''

The problem I see with this is that these options might not align with the experience the devs want to provide, and I value their creative freedom over them needing to check arbitrary boxes. Not everything has to be made for me or anyone else in particular, and that is fine.

I don't feel I'm being any kind of mean, I'm sorry you perceive it like that. I'm actually treating everyone like adults and respecting everyone here. ^^''

Life is unfair sometimes, and that's fine. It's about making the most you can out of the hand you've been dealt, less about like, coaxing other people's hands because you have a bad one. I'm sorry my opinion offends you.
Last edited by This PC; May 28 @ 7:14pm
Originally posted by Kylvan:
Little twinkle light when you should use parry button or dodge for example on the move, attach to the attack visual (spell coming at you or part of the monster hitting you) and diffrents colors for daltonism.
My friend can play ZZZ without effort, but cannot parry or dodge without making a huge effort on CO:33.

These sound like fantastic ideas! I believe the devs might have a feedback form somewhere in the main pinned thread that may get them to consider this kind of feedback without having it be buried in the rest of the forums. Even though I am neither Deaf nor HoH, I can appreciate and respect both those communities as fellow gamers and welcome any accessibility adjustments that the devs can provide so we can all enjoy things together :)

Originally posted by This PC:
ironic that you call me a hateful person and you go off on me because you disagree with me, I haven't hated on anyone, I have my own disability issues and I don't impose them on anyone, and usually when I try, I get exactly that kind of response, and you know what, I think it's fair, no one has to be responsible for my situation, even if I'm not responsible for it myself. ^^''
The problem I see with this is that these options might not align with the experience the devs want to provide, and I value their creative freedom over them needing to check arbitrary boxes. Not everything has to be made for me or anyone else in particular, and that is fine.
I don't feel I'm being any kind of mean, I'm sorry you perceive it like that. I'm actually treating everyone like adults and respecting everyone here. ^^''
Life is unfair sometimes, and that's fine. It's about making the most you can out of the hand you've been dealt, less about like, coaxing other people's hands because you have a bad one. I'm sorry my opinion offends you.

(Un)fortunately for you, being a jerk isn't a disability. :P
There are no 'arbitrary boxes' to check. Accessibility in gaming is championed by everyone with any amount of empathy or emotions beyond their own tiny bubble.
Every major gaming company and tech company you can think of generally considers the cost and implementation/testing of accessibility options at one point or another. This is a small indie studio that managed to knock out a massive successful amazing game. There will be absolutely zero detriment to their 'artistic vision' by providing some additional accessibility options.
I will always champion accessibility over the misguided ramblings of a lunatic frothing at the mouth to exclude others from a hobby that everyone can otherwise enjoy.
To be perfectly frank, if you lack empathy for others then this game and this community are not for you. The entire premise and point of CO:E33 is 'for those who come after' and the entire game's storyline is built upon that premise. If you missed that point then perhaps you can find more sympathetic ears in whatever dredges of the internet you came from.

I grew up in a time where rapidly-flashing backgrounds and effects were the norm. On a smallish CRT (at least by modern standards) with the fuzziness and other artifacts of the time, it wasn't an issue for my young eyes. But as time passes it helps to not have rapidly-flashing full-screen effects. It helps to not have the entire screen shake like the characters are in the middle of an earthquake every time an attack happens. It helps to have separate audio sliders for voices, music, and sound effects.

I remember when the Japanese creators of the Pokemon anime from the 1990s 'forgot' that disabilities existed and caused hundreds of Japanese schoolchildren to get severe epileptic attacks when watching the infamous 'Porygon' episode. I'm not epileptic but trying to watch the scene in question that caused the issues at anything above 33% speed makes my eyes hurt. I can't believe that they were that stupid not to do a test of the episode before airing it. If there was any justice they should've faced severe fines and penalties for doing so. But nowandays we know better and we account for stuff like epilepsy, colorblindness, and so on.

One key aspect of game design from the retro days is to use environmental cues and the gameplay to teach the player and to convey the story outside of specific cutscenes (since they were limited by cartridge sizes and storage). There's no valid reason that CO:E33 can't incorporate some environmental and visual cues for dodge/parry timings.
Last edited by Daedalus007; May 28 @ 7:40pm
This PC May 28 @ 8:53pm 
you are entitled to your opinions, like, the game has a plethora of cues, I am a music producer and I don't even use the sounds, I don't know what to tell you, but I don't think every game has to be accessible to everyone, to me, if you think that, that makes you the jerk ><

sandfall will ultimately decide, I defer to them and their creative freedom myself, as it should be, this is still my opinion, and I don't let randos on the internet tell me I have a problem, sorry. >//<

Road to hell is paved with good intentions ^^''
"lunatic frothing at the mouth", mhmm, sure. ^^''
Almost like you're predisposed to tribal politics and biased.
I gave solutions and I remained cordial throughout, I don't know what's the problem here. It's also not a matter of gatekeeping, I'm not saying deaf people aren't allowed to play this at all. Is all even more ironic considering it comes from someone who doesn't own the game. ><

Also props to the OG's out there that overcome despite things like this. Y'all are warriors. <3
Last edited by This PC; May 28 @ 9:29pm
Originally posted by This PC:
*inane rambling snip*
If you are unable to change your mind for any reason, then a discussion is not possible. Every game, regardless of type, can absolutely incorporate at least SOME kinds of accessibility options[gameaccessibilityguidelines.com]. Every game without exception can do at least one or more of these[accessiblyapp.com].

It can be something as simple as changing colors around for colorblindness, allowing for more variety via audio and visual-audio replacement options. Something as simple as having captions and/or subtitle options during cutscenes/gameplay. Even at the lowest effort types, a toggle for disabling screen shake, any kind of 'blur' effects, depth of field effects, etc.

Most of these options can be done by games no matter their type or genre. Some more than others (2D games don't really need an FOV slider lmao).

Curious how it is 'creative freedom' only when it suits your purpose. Then you and others like you cry 'woke' whenever it doesn't. How naive and silly to believe that hiding behind a sense of 'creative freedom' will justify your discrimination of others.

CO:E33 has a pretty good modding community already digging around and taking things apart; there's a LUA-based scripting system that can probably do most of what we need for accessibility.

However despite that, none of those will work on consoles for obvious reasons and I feel native developer-provided accessibility options will be the ideal solution. Considering how much money and sales they've already made, the devs can take a bit of time to help 'those who come after' if they have any sense of empathy or true belief in the story they created. After all, if they were just another company and another corporation we wouldn't be talking about artistry would we?
Last edited by Daedalus007; May 29 @ 2:30am
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