My silly theory about Gustave and Sophie (spiler alert past act 2 ending)

[kingofnone]

I have finished a few days ago my journey in expedition 33 and I have seen many people annoyed at the cut development of key character such as Sciel and Lune.
I do have a theory about the main cast that could be overreaching, but I like enough to put out for everyone to comment on.

We know that every citizen of Lumiere is a figment of Aline memory or imagination, but I think in every generation we have people deeply resembling the Dessendre family.

Let's take Gustave and Sophie.
To me they are nothing than a young Renoir and Aline couple, or how they would have been if they would not have been painters nor had sons. Sophie seems to incarnate the fear of loss that Aline has, prefering not to be a mother rather than to have a son and lose them or be unable to see them grow.
In addition to that we have her showing a bit of Aline moveset in the prologue, not to mention fighting with a painting brush, just like "Maman" does at the end of act two.

Gustave could easily be a young Renoire, fully enamoured with his significant other and ready to wage war for her. I think painted Renoire does see that too, since he says killing him is not cruelty, but kindness.
He may want to spare him living without Sophie, knowing full well how awful a broken marriage is, or straight up does not want for gustave to become like he is, depending on a rapidly dacaying bond and keeping up a cause which no longer feels his own.

As for the last two characters (I'll exclude Monoco, painted by the young Verso and a stand in for his fickle, joyful and faithful dog -love for shoes included), I do think Lune was painted by Aline with Clea in mind: the little we see of the eldest Dessendre daughter is a objective-driven person, laser focused on her personal crusade, one her parents are unable to continue, destroyed by their mourning.
Lune is mostly similar: analytical at the point of being detatched, but loving music (Verso's art) so much she could smile about it in the midst of grief. Her parents have perished too as casualties of a war that has begun long before they did. Their passion? Music, just like her (Just like Clea and her parents shared the passion and the talent for painting).
In addition to that, she is always analyzing and reporting her findings on her enemy, just like Clea does for the Writers.

Sciel, on the contrary, is another stand-in for Aline. Or better, Aline's mourning.
She is the version that not only has lost her husband, but also lost her son while grieving.

The result is her accepting the finality of living, just like the paintress (this is my speculation) in her core wishes to do.
Even Sciel has an inkling of hope to bring her husbad back from death (an accident, not "natural" like the Gommage she was prepared for) that ends up driving her forward -just like Aline resurrects Verso in his old painting- she is also saved by Esquie, maybe (and this is really reaching) like Maman was driven to her son's only artwork due the plushie he so dearly loved.

Of course, these are only conjectures birthed by a whole month spent playing only this game and working, but I hope you will find some element worth salvaging.

[Forza Piadina]

Only the cut development of key character such as Sciel and Lune? And what about clea, the twisted plot, WTF are the writers, WTF are the painters and the missing key plot informations? They let you play fake characters for the whole game with no grow at all.

[kingofnone]

Originally posted by Forza Piadina:

Only the cut development of key character such as Sciel and Lune? And what about clea, the twisted plot, WTF are the writers, WTF are the painters and the missing key plot informations? They let you play fake characters for the whole game with no grow at all.

Yes, and I think it is by design. The whole game is an allegory about mourning. the main people who are unable to let go of Verso are Aline, Renoire and Alicia.
Clea manages to find her path, even though it hs been severely influenced by external events

[Beefcake8]

Originally posted by Forza Piadina:

Only the cut development of key character such as Sciel and Lune? And what about clea, the twisted plot, WTF are the writers, WTF are the painters and the missing key plot informations? They let you play fake characters for the whole game with no grow at all.

They aren't fake. They have consciousness and have real experiences/feelings. The writer/painter war thing has nothing to do with the story of this game other than Verso's death, and leaves room for future development if they choose. And no growth? Did we play the same ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ game? Just admit you want to hate the game for some reason only you know. I don't think you are emotionally intelligent enough to actually understand the point of the story tbh.

[HellDuke]

Originally posted by kingofnone:

Originally posted by Forza Piadina:

Only the cut development of key character such as Sciel and Lune? And what about clea, the twisted plot, WTF are the writers, WTF are the painters and the missing key plot informations? They let you play fake characters for the whole game with no grow at all.

Yes, and I think it is by design. The whole game is an allegory about mourning. the main people who are unable to let go of Verso are Aline, Renoire and Alicia.
Clea manages to find her path, even though it hs been severely influenced by external events

I'd say Clea is not so different. To me an intreresting comparison is with the 5 stages of grief.

Denial — Aline is in denial and escapes to the painting to live with Verso and a made up family amongst made up people.
Anger — this is where Clea jumps in. She is angry at mother for running away, her father trying to save her, Alicia for allowing herself to be tricked (I wonder if the typewriter in Alicias room is a hint there) and Verso for sacrificing his life, but she shows that she cares for everyone in different moments
Bargaining — clearly Renoir, trying to bargain with Aline to return. Success here means that they all can continue to remember Verso with the canvas.
Depression — Alicia, she feels guilty of Versos death, lost and as if there is no meaning in life.
Acceptance — depends... Verso with his sacrifice and wish to end it in the canvas, or it could be Aline moving on, as she uses her power to allow painted Verso to save his soul fragment and move on.

[kingofnone]

Originally posted by HellDuke:

Originally posted by kingofnone:

Yes, and I think it is by design. The whole game is an allegory about mourning. the main people who are unable to let go of Verso are Aline, Renoire and Alicia.
Clea manages to find her path, even though it hs been severely influenced by external events

I'd say Clea is not so different. To me an intreresting comparison is with the 5 stages of grief.

Denial — Aline is in denial and escapes to the painting to live with Verso and a made up family amongst made up people.
Anger — this is where Clea jumps in. She is angry at mother for running away, her father trying to save her, Alicia for allowing herself to be tricked (I wonder if the typewriter in Alicias room is a hint there) and Verso for sacrificing his life, but she shows that she cares for everyone in different moments
Bargaining — clearly Renoir, trying to bargain with Aline to return. Success here means that they all can continue to remember Verso with the canvas.
Depression — Alicia, she feels guilty of Versos death, lost and as if there is no meaning in life.
Acceptance — depends... Verso with his sacrifice and wish to end it in the canvas, or it could be Aline moving on, as she uses her power to allow painted Verso to save his soul fragment and move on.

I think Sciel is acceptance, since she states that if there is an afterlife she'll be with her loved ones, and even if it does not exist she would be together with them in death.
Even in the end she understands Verso's choice and she seems to bear no ill will.

[The Gray Fox]

Originally posted by Beefcake8:

Originally posted by Forza Piadina:

Only the cut development of key character such as Sciel and Lune? And what about clea, the twisted plot, WTF are the writers, WTF are the painters and the missing key plot informations? They let you play fake characters for the whole game with no grow at all.

They aren't fake. They have consciousness and have real experiences/feelings. The writer/painter war thing has nothing to do with the story of this game other than Verso's death, and leaves room for future development if they choose. And no growth? Did we play the same ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ game? Just admit you want to hate the game for some reason only you know. I don't think you are emotionally intelligent enough to actually understand the point of the story tbh.

what growth is there for Lune and Sciel? It's not hating the game nor does it require a lack of emotional intelligence to point out that they completely get put to the side in Act 3 with no growth or arc in favor of the family drama. Literal NPC characters

[kingofnone]

Originally posted by The Gray Fox:

Originally posted by Beefcake8:

They aren't fake. They have consciousness and have real experiences/feelings. The writer/painter war thing has nothing to do with the story of this game other than Verso's death, and leaves room for future development if they choose. And no growth? Did we play the same ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ game? Just admit you want to hate the game for some reason only you know. I don't think you are emotionally intelligent enough to actually understand the point of the story tbh.

what growth is there for Lune and Sciel? It's not hating the game nor does it require a lack of emotional intelligence to point out that they completely get put to the side in Act 3 with no growth or arc in favor of the family drama. Literal NPC characters

To me they don't grow during the development of the game because they actually are already developed: most of what they are is what they went through: the hate for the parents, the grief for a loved one that poisoned a new life.
They are paintings: they have a story, but they are fixed in time, unable to move forward.

That, or being pretty much a year away from death before being brought back to life by an unexperienced paintress (so we can assume a not-so-perfect copy of an altready imperfect creation) make their feeling dull, because they have pretty much resigned to death (the former shows it by obsessing over the notes she has to leave for the next expedition -almost like she can't see her own succeed -, the latter by saying basically flat-out that death would be a way to be together with her loved ones, so she does not fear it, but accepts it and, in the end, even welcomes it. .

Of course, this is only my opinion and maybe I am overlooking something to paint my picture over the game.

[Portico]

You're reading too much into Gustave and Sophie.

The simple explanation as to why Gustave and Sophie matters is that Maelles subconscious (Amilia) simply recognised traits and appearances of Verso in Gustave. Gustave is only important because he serves as a stand-in for Verso. Gustave is only there to be killed that we may see a reflection of Maelles relationship to Verso, and the irrational behaviour that comes with her grief.

Sophie is there to showcase Gustave grieving for her in a much more healthy way than Maelle ever could until the end of the game. Creating contrast and comparison.