Two questions from someone on the fence

[Basil]

I know nothing of this game and have two concerns I'd like to ask anyone more knowledgeable about.

1. I don't like P5 and the bits of battle UI I've seen appear to be a direct copycat. Does this also borrow the ideas behind P5's combat in the actual gameplay? Would you think this would be something that I'd be interested in if I don't like the streamlining that's been done to the SMT games over the years?

2. How to ask this... I've not enjoyed French RPGs I've tried in the past. Always some absolutely out there scifi nonsense full of strange inhuman characters and cringy philosophical wankery (very often existential nonsense that I just cannot relate to). Would you say that sounds even remotely related to anything you've seen in this game? I prefer much more low-to-the-ground settings made up of normal people just trying to get by.

[Ratsplat]

Not sure how to answer questions that make assumptions and bad faith. I'll leave it to someone else.

[Ximoltrufia]

In any case, there is the option to request a refund within 2 hours if you don't like it, and this time is more than enough to evaluate the game itself. I wasn't very excited about this release, I played it through GamePass and it surprised me a lot, I played it for 3 days in a row because it is very addictive.

[Basil]

Originally posted by Ratsplat:

Not sure how to answer questions that make assumptions and bad faith. I'll leave it to someone else.

Assumptions are all I have at the moment. Which is why I'm reaching out to people that have actually played it and see what they think about the things I care about.

[Amritadyne]

the game is nothing like Persona, I'd say the game this is most similar to in terms of combat is actually Honkai Star Rail but significantly more complex.

[forestyocean]

Personally I hate this game too. Im hate-playing it right now, 35 hours in, trying to find something, ANYTHING, to hate about this game and I'm coming up empty. It's gorgeous, the soundtrack is beautiful and melancholy, the characters feel like genuine people, the battle system keeps you on your toes and require you to get good at dodging/parrying to stay alive, everything is so good and it makes me seethe.

Grr.

[C1REX]

Originally posted by Basil:

I know nothing of this game and have two concerns I'd like to ask anyone more knowledgeable about.

1. I don't like P5 and the bits of battle UI I've seen appear to be a direct copycat. Does this also borrow the ideas behind P5's combat in the actual gameplay? Would you think this would be something that I'd be interested in if I don't like the streamlining that's been done to the SMT games over the years?

2. How to ask this... I've not enjoyed French RPGs I've tried in the past. Always some absolutely out there scifi nonsense full of strange inhuman characters and cringy philosophical wankery (very often existential nonsense that I just cannot relate to). Would you say that sounds even remotely related to anything you've seen in this game? I prefer much more low-to-the-ground settings made up of normal people just trying to get by.

1. Hard to tell as both are turned based but very different at the same time.
2. The game is not a typical french game and more of a Japanese, strange, inhuman, philosophical type. The setting is far from normal and the team is definitely not made of common people. It was inspired by Japanese games and it embraces weirdness.

My guess is that you won't like the game. It's absolutely amazing piece of art but definitely not for everybody.

[GeminiEclipse]

The combat system isn't like P5. It's not about finding the weakness, hitting said weakness, and getting all out attacks or extra turns. Elemental weakness is just some more damage and a few bonuses if you build for that.

It looks similar but it plays out very differently.

The shooting is actually aiming based on a cursor, and it doesn't end your turn. Parrying and dodging are buttons you have to press when attacks happen to avoid damage. Parrying a full attack string will result in a counter attack.

It's basically a hybrid of turn based and action combat, just with a turn based core instead of something like FF7 remake which is action core with turn based addition.

I would say the motivations of main characters is pretty grounded in reality in some respects. It just might take a while for that to pan out. The world itself is definitely surreal from an aesthetic standpoint.

[Basil]

Thank you, C1REX and GeminiEclipse. That is some valuable information.
It's definitely sounding like the setting/characters might be a red flag based on my usual bias then. But hey I'm always open to hear someone out if they think differently on the matter.

I guess I have a pivot question on the combat if the P5 comparison is skin deep:
How would you guys say this game handles the usual turn based problem of status effects?
To be clear I mean the usual struggle where "the best status effect you can inflict is DEAD".
Is this just a race to lower your enemies numbers with no strategic layers above that? Or does this offer any twists to keep combat interesting over a couple days of play?

[Lain½]

to answer your second question : you will probably hate it. go play the sims or something less phylosophical.

[peter]

Originally posted by Basil:

Thank you, C1REX and GeminiEclipse. That is some valuable information.
It's definitely sounding like the setting/characters might be a red flag based on my usual bias then. But hey I'm always open to hear someone out if they think differently on the matter.

I guess I have a pivot question on the combat if the P5 comparison is skin deep:
How would you guys say this game handles the usual turn based problem of status effects?
To be clear I mean the usual struggle where "the best status effect you can inflict is DEAD".
Is this just a race to lower your enemies numbers with no strategic layers above that? Or does this offer any twists to keep combat interesting over a couple days of play?

Combat in this game is much, much more complicated than P5. Mana is replaced by Action
Points and most characters have special ways of earning extra AP. Each playable character has a unique mechanic and unique abilities. Nearly every enemy type has some kind of weakness you can exploit (but you have to be a little savvy about it as exploiting some can buff other enemies), but that exploit isn't typically spammable (so not like P5 elemental weaknesses). Status effects are often important less because they deal a ton of damage (though they may), but often because you'll need them in place to trigger certain of your character's moves. Frankly, at higher difficulty, I think combat in this game is most like a kind of very short gloomhaven encounter.

[The Dauphin]

Based on your second question, you'll absolutely hate this game. It is full of both strange inhuman characters and philosophical 'wankery,' as the characters must cope with death, grief and loss on a daily basis in their personal lives and in society as a whole. If this seems like 'existential nonsense' to you, don't buy the game because you won't be able to get through the prologue without pressing alt+f4.

[Basil]

Originally posted by peter:

Combat in this game is much, much more complicated than P5. Mana is replaced by Action
Points and most characters have special ways of earning extra AP. Each playable character has a unique mechanic and unique abilities. Nearly every enemy type has some kind of weakness you can exploit (but you have to be a little savvy about it as exploiting some can buff other enemies), but that exploit isn't typically spammable (so not like P5 elemental weaknesses). Status effects are often important less because they deal a ton of damage (though they may), but often because you'll need them in place to trigger certain of your character's moves. Frankly, at higher difficulty, I think combat in this game is most like a kind of very short gloomhaven encounter.

Hey that sounds sort of interesting. Thanks for going into detail!

Originally posted by The Dauphin:

Based on your second question, you'll absolutely hate this game. It is full of both strange inhuman characters and philosophical 'wankery,' as the characters must cope with death, grief and loss on a daily basis in their personal lives and in society as a whole. If this seems like 'existential nonsense' to you, don't buy the game because you won't be able to get through the prologue without pressing alt+f4.

It definitely does at a glance. I guess I just want to narrow things down a bit.
"the characters must cope with death, grief and loss on a daily basis in their personal lives and in society as a whole" doesn't sound that bad on the face of it. Closest comparison I can pull would probably be Final Fantasy Type 0, which while it has problems, that narrative element is probably one of the better bits.

While neither of these are French, the two biggest examples I can think of a game turning me off with "existential nonsense" would be SOMA (the entire core premise of the game fell flat for me) and specifically the character of Marie in Dies Irae.

[A73.14.22]

Originally posted by Basil:

Originally posted by peter:

Combat in this game is much, much more complicated than P5. Mana is replaced by Action
Points and most characters have special ways of earning extra AP. Each playable character has a unique mechanic and unique abilities. Nearly every enemy type has some kind of weakness you can exploit (but you have to be a little savvy about it as exploiting some can buff other enemies), but that exploit isn't typically spammable (so not like P5 elemental weaknesses). Status effects are often important less because they deal a ton of damage (though they may), but often because you'll need them in place to trigger certain of your character's moves. Frankly, at higher difficulty, I think combat in this game is most like a kind of very short gloomhaven encounter.

Hey that sounds sort of interesting. Thanks for going into detail!

Originally posted by The Dauphin:

Based on your second question, you'll absolutely hate this game. It is full of both strange inhuman characters and philosophical 'wankery,' as the characters must cope with death, grief and loss on a daily basis in their personal lives and in society as a whole. If this seems like 'existential nonsense' to you, don't buy the game because you won't be able to get through the prologue without pressing alt+f4.

It definitely does at a glance. I guess I just want to narrow things down a bit.
"the characters must cope with death, grief and loss on a daily basis in their personal lives and in society as a whole" doesn't sound that bad on the face of it. Closest comparison I can pull would probably be Final Fantasy Type 0, which while it has problems, that narrative element is probably one of the better bits.

While neither of these are French, the two biggest examples I can think of a game turning me off with "existential nonsense" would be SOMA (the entire core premise of the game fell flat for me) and specifically the character of Marie in Dies Irae.

The game is hard to describe without spoiling the whole plot of the final. It is philosophic without a doubt, but this not "existential nonsense" or i don't feel like it is the core of the game.

And I also don't know how the game feel in English voice/subtitle, i guess it can change a game completely...

[forestyocean]

Originally posted by A73.14.22:

Originally posted by Basil:

Hey that sounds sort of interesting. Thanks for going into detail!



It definitely does at a glance. I guess I just want to narrow things down a bit.
"the characters must cope with death, grief and loss on a daily basis in their personal lives and in society as a whole" doesn't sound that bad on the face of it. Closest comparison I can pull would probably be Final Fantasy Type 0, which while it has problems, that narrative element is probably one of the better bits.

While neither of these are French, the two biggest examples I can think of a game turning me off with "existential nonsense" would be SOMA (the entire core premise of the game fell flat for me) and specifically the character of Marie in Dies Irae.

The game is hard to describe without spoiling the whole plot of the final. It is philosophic without a doubt, but this not "existential nonsense" or i don't feel like it is the core of the game.

And I also don't know how the game feel in English voice/subtitle, i guess it can change a game completely...

The existential crisis at the heart of the game is in the name Expedition 33. 67 years ago, and cataclysmic event called the Fracture occurred, which dawned an age of a villain named The Paintress, who paints a number on a monolith causes all people that age or above to be Thanos'ed out of existence. Every year she paints the number below that one, essentially counting down from 100 every year and this event of vanishing from existence is called gommage.

So the philosophical wankery is absolutely essential to the story as many characters ,especially the youngest Maelle, have seen countless loved ones either die on one of these expeditions to kill the paintress, or disappear as a result of their gommage. You only get glimpses of each characters' history of losses but it's a pretty bleak world where even newborns, children, teenagers, and adults live with a cloud of death and despair looming over their heads every day.

[The Dauphin]

Originally posted by Basil:

While neither of these are French, the two biggest examples I can think of a game turning me off with "existential nonsense" would be SOMA (the entire core premise of the game fell flat for me) and specifically the character of Marie in Dies Irae.

Yeah so the core premise of this game is going to fall flat for you. Full stop. You're not going to like it, because the characters face a similar philosophical problems to the guy in SOMA. In the prologue, a few people even raise the questions of why we're even trying to do anything because the world is borked and they're all going to die anyways. Nihilism, helplessness, and hopelessness are major themes for the characters.

It seems like you want to give the game a try when everything you're writing says you won't enjoy it. You can refund games on Steam before 2 hours of playtime, so you've got nothing to lose there.

If you do try it, you might want to shake off the anti-French bias you've got going on if you want to give it a go, because the game is French in almost every aspect (names, music, etc.).