To everyone saying this is a ``skill issue".

[elbentzo]

It's not. I mean, it could be, but it's deeper than that. It's a *marketing* issue. There's a reason why Sekiro or Elden Ring don't have reviews and discussions threads saying they should get rid of dodge mechanics. It's because everyone who plays these games knew what they were getting into. With E33, the devs made it clear there are realtime mechanics in the game, but they didn't make it clear that they are more or less the focus of the entire game. They didn't make it clear that there are instances where failing to dodge/parry results is a game over, and that there is no way to turn off these QTE's or make them easier (only the offensive QTE's). They didn't make it clear that the gameplay loop of the game is to meet an enemy (or a boss), fight it, die 5 or 10 or 15 or 50 times (depending on how good you are, what difficulty, etc.) until you learn its animations, then beat it. This gameplay loop is reminiscent of soulslike games and that's why people are calling it soulslike (even though it's not really soulslike). It is COMPLETELY different from the gameplay loop of TBRPG's and JRPG's (which is what the game is described as in formal publicity material).

If this were marketed as a turn-based soulslike, people who hate (or who are bad at) quick hand eye coordination and learning timing on enemy animations would not buy it, and would not complain. The problem here is the devs left a very big open window for classic TBRPG lovers who thought they could play it like FF8 where you can time your attack to get a crit, not realizing they were going to have to do frame perfect parries or get 1-shot.

[Ratsplat]

My suggestion is a pure vitality/defense build (will still suffer in the beginning though) Hopefully, this makes the game into a standard jrpg.

[Pandada-sensei]

Like ratsplat said, you have the option to literally build the characters and play it like a standard JRPG

Having more options for everyone is good, make sure you use the ones that fit you better if QTE is not your type of icecream :D

[Xoctal]

just turn it on story mode, if its bothering you, you dont even have to dodge or parry in that mode, been playing on expert myself and ive been 1 shot a few times rofl

[Brocknoth]

I really think people are over blowing this. If you're getting one shot, on normal, on a regular basis than you, the player, are doing something VERY wrong. The only things one shoting me are optional bosses. And the occasional silly gimmick like the fight against Francois. Even then the game is very forgiving. It auto saves frequently so it's not like dying is an issue.

[Noelemahc]

If you raise your Defense first the penalty for missing dodges suddenly becomes way less strenuous, at least on Explorer difficulty. I fumbled most of them with the flowers miniboss in the second biome and still managed to crush it on my second try.

[causality]

Originally posted by elbentzo:

There's a reason why Sekiro or Elden Ring don't have reviews and discussions threads saying they should get rid of dodge mechanics.

Except there are but Steam isn't the proper platform in the first place to communicate with the devs. I wanted to replace dodge roll with chambering for example, of course that never got added because Souls fanboys would cry foul if they had to learn new gameplay mechanics instead of flopping around on the ground like fish.

[SkacikPL]

I don't oppose the idea but to me it feels like it's not reliable at all.
In essence, in normal JRPG you have just hidden 5-20% chance to dodge an attack.
In this game it's also random but you gotta press a button to roll the dice.

I assume it's deliberately unreliable enough to the point of being random or the game would flat out have no way of harming the player.

[Lambi]

Pretty much EVERYWHERE they make sure to mention that it has real-time mechanics. I don't know who in their right mind would see how incredibly often they make sure to bring it up, and not think it's a core part of the game. That's not on the devs. Not to mention that they have sections going into it deeper, they have gameplay videos showing it. At what point can we stop blaming the devs and start blaming the people who went in with the wrong expectations? Do the dev need to scream of the top of their lungs "HEY, YOU NEED TO DODGE IN THIS GAME. LIKE IT'S ACTUALLY A CORE PART OF THE GAME. NO FOR REAL, YOU ACTUALLY NEED TO UTILIZE THE DODGE MECHANIC. I KNOW WE ALREADY SAID IT'S REAL-TIME MECHANICS, BUT WE WANT TO EMPHASIZE THAT THIS GAME HAS REAL-TIME MECHANICS AND IT'S MECHANICS THAT ARE IN THIS GAME AND THEY ARE REAL-TIME AND DID I MENTION THAT THESE REAL-TIME MECHANICS ARE IMPORTANT TO THE GAME".

[elbentzo]

I appreciate everyone's advice, but y'all missed the point of this thread. I'm not complaining about the game. I'm trying to explain the reason so many people are complaining is because it was not marketed properly. Most complains are from people who bought the game without realizing how substantial the QTE's are. And honestly, I can't blame them. If you look at the trailers and promotional material it doesn't look like the realtime elements are a big deal. And in reality, they are.

[Lambi]

Originally posted by SkacikPL:

I don't oppose the idea but to me it feels like it's not reliable at all.
In essence, in normal JRPG you have just hidden 5-20% chance to dodge an attack.
In this game it's also random but you gotta press a button to roll the dice.

I assume it's deliberately unreliable enough to the point of being random or the game would flat out have no way of harming the player.

It's not unreliable though. For enemies I have had time to practice a bit on, I can reliably 100% dodge all their attacks. Proving that it is indeed a reliable system. There's no "deliberate unreliability" to it.

[elbentzo]

Originally posted by Lambi:

Pretty much EVERYWHERE they make sure to mention that it has real-time mechanics. I don't know who in their right mind would see how incredibly often they make sure to bring it up, and not think it's a core part of the game. That's not on the devs. Not to mention that they have sections going into it deeper, they have gameplay videos showing it. At what point can we stop blaming the devs and start blaming the people who went in with the wrong expectations? Do the dev need to scream of the top of their lungs "HEY, YOU NEED TO DODGE IN THIS GAME. LIKE IT'S ACTUALLY A CORE PART OF THE GAME. NO FOR REAL, YOU ACTUALLY NEED TO UTILIZE THE DODGE MECHANIC. I KNOW WE ALREADY SAID IT'S REAL-TIME MECHANICS, BUT WE WANT TO EMPHASIZE THAT THIS GAME HAS REAL-TIME MECHANICS AND IT'S MECHANICS THAT ARE IN THIS GAME AND THEY ARE REAL-TIME AND DID I MENTION THAT THESE REAL-TIME MECHANICS ARE IMPORTANT TO THE GAME".

Great job not reading what I wrote!
If you had read it, you'd know that I wrote the devs were very clear there is realtime gameplay in the game. But the problem was they didn't communicate properly how important it is and how it is conducted. Like I wrote, FF8 also have realtime elements. The FF7 remaster also has realtime elements. Even RTwP games like the oldschool crpg's have realtime gameplay elements. But in none of these games you can repeatedly lose because you're not quick enough, or have bad hand-eye coordination. In none of these games you have to spend your gameplay loop learning patterns and boss animations. It's not enough to write ``there are dodge mechanics". Honestly, I know you wrote the all-cap rant as a joke, but you just proved my point. You repeated a million times there are realtime elements but not even once did you make clear the important aspects of them.

[Lambi]

Originally posted by elbentzo:

Originally posted by Lambi:

Pretty much EVERYWHERE they make sure to mention that it has real-time mechanics. I don't know who in their right mind would see how incredibly often they make sure to bring it up, and not think it's a core part of the game. That's not on the devs. Not to mention that they have sections going into it deeper, they have gameplay videos showing it. At what point can we stop blaming the devs and start blaming the people who went in with the wrong expectations? Do the dev need to scream of the top of their lungs "HEY, YOU NEED TO DODGE IN THIS GAME. LIKE IT'S ACTUALLY A CORE PART OF THE GAME. NO FOR REAL, YOU ACTUALLY NEED TO UTILIZE THE DODGE MECHANIC. I KNOW WE ALREADY SAID IT'S REAL-TIME MECHANICS, BUT WE WANT TO EMPHASIZE THAT THIS GAME HAS REAL-TIME MECHANICS AND IT'S MECHANICS THAT ARE IN THIS GAME AND THEY ARE REAL-TIME AND DID I MENTION THAT THESE REAL-TIME MECHANICS ARE IMPORTANT TO THE GAME".

Great job not reading what I wrote!
If you had read it, you'd know that I wrote the devs were very clear there is realtime gameplay in the game. But the problem was they didn't communicate properly how important it is and how it is conducted. Like I wrote, FF8 also have realtime elements. The FF7 remaster also has realtime elements. Even RTwP games like the oldschool crpg's have realtime gameplay elements. But in none of these games you can repeatedly lose because you're not quick enough, or have bad hand-eye coordination. In none of these games you have to spend your gameplay loop learning patterns and boss animations. It's not enough to write ``there are dodge mechanics". Honestly, I know you wrote the all-cap rant as a joke, but you just proved my point. You repeated a million times there are realtime elements but not even once did you make clear the important aspects of them.

Great job not reading what I wrote!

You said this:

Originally posted by elbentzo:

but they didn't make it clear that they are more or less the focus of the entire game. They didn't make it clear that there are instances where failing to dodge/parry results is a game over, and that there is no way to turn off these QTE's or make them easier (only the offensive QTE's). They didn't make it clear that the gameplay loop of the game is to meet an enemy (or a boss), fight it, die 5 or 10 or 15 or 50 times (depending on how good you are, what difficulty, etc.) until you learn its animations, then beat it.

Which is mainly what I was tackling. At what point can we stop blaming the devs for not making these things clear.

[Acestar]

Originally posted by elbentzo:

It's not. I mean, it could be, but it's deeper than that. It's a *marketing* issue. There's a reason why Sekiro or Elden Ring don't have reviews and discussions threads saying they should get rid of dodge mechanics. It's because everyone who plays these games knew what they were getting into. With E33, the devs made it clear there are realtime mechanics in the game, but they didn't make it clear that they are more or less the focus of the entire game. They didn't make it clear that there are instances where failing to dodge/parry results is a game over, and that there is no way to turn off these QTE's or make them easier (only the offensive QTE's). They didn't make it clear that the gameplay loop of the game is to meet an enemy (or a boss), fight it, die 5 or 10 or 15 or 50 times (depending on how good you are, what difficulty, etc.) until you learn its animations, then beat it. This gameplay loop is reminiscent of soulslike games and that's why people are calling it soulslike (even though it's not really soulslike). It is COMPLETELY different from the gameplay loop of TBRPG's and JRPG's (which is what the game is described as in formal publicity material).

If this were marketed as a turn-based soulslike, people who hate (or who are bad at) quick hand eye coordination and learning timing on enemy animations would not buy it, and would not complain. The problem here is the devs left a very big open window for classic TBRPG lovers who thought they could play it like FF8 where you can time your attack to get a crit, not realizing they were going to have to do frame perfect parries or get 1-shot.

Not that bad once you get your 3rd party member. You should have decent gear, enough stats into def and or hp, and healing skills to manage, and a grasp of timing dodge and parry, with auto saves and bonfires to hold your progress.

[Bran]

there is picto that give +1AP per hit (enemy you) but no AP when parry, there are waepons that scaling with vitality and defence and you can grind
parry and dodge is not for you, ok just adapt and overcome it

ohh and Maelle 3rd party member have skill "egida" soo she can tank dmg

soo yes it is skill issue

[4accenter]

It is skill issue. I have no problems playing this game but I'm gaming since 1989 (born 1984). It has nothing to do with soulslikes just because some elements from the genre are represented.