Combat Parry QTEs are ruining the combat for me.

[HotSipOfColdTea]

This game was advertised as a turn based JRPG, yet the QTE difficulty is similar to a dark souls or fighting game parry window.

And while there are other turn based rpgs that have quick time mechanics such as Super Mario RPG, or Legend of Dragoon, these both had options for mitigating skill at them and still being able to play. For example, in super mario rpg, offense and level were more important and it was easier to time consistent weapon attacks and you could change to a favorite animation if you liked. Similarly for Legend of Dragoon, you could change your attack to something easier to time if you wanted.

In Expedition 33, the defensive parries are 100 percent damage reduction and a counter attack. Its more offense, way more defense and is so strong it becomes mandatory. The tells for these windows are very small and require memorization.

And while you could turn the difficulty down so that the attacks hit for paltry amounts, this does not make the game engaging.

The game is not enjoyable from a casual perspective of being able to miss parries simply because the performance difference for hitting parries is so high, that it is usually right to go for them and you can fight enemies that one shot you for non parried attacks.

To me, the game is not enjoyable to play because the parries are inconsistent to hit for me. The game needs to either have parries be something more achievable with a bit less in the risk reward department on them or it needs a difficulty mode where there is challenge outside of hitting the parries.

Also I feel like the parry timings are very off from the animations. This is probably not something fixable but because this is such a huge element of the game it needs to be addressed.

[Birdy]

Publicado originalmente por Shadow Wizard Money Gang:

I had to stop. While people may scoff at the "difficulty debates", games like this prove that its a conversation needing to be had. I am an ablebodied person who has mastered Souls-likes and their parry systems. I have played the above mentioned RPGs and this game is the most inaccessible RPG I have ever seen. I can't imagine someone with disabilities being able to complete this game without going to the easiest mode and hoping they can out heal damage they are forced to take.

Ignoring the input lag or general lack of ques for parrying, also forcing party wide parries as the only means to avoid damage is egregious.

Publicado originalmente por HotSipOfColdTea:

As far as I can tell this is offense only. My issue is with the defense parry on medium or high difficulty.

Not only that, you lose out on maximum damage and amount of attacks. If you automate the QTE's it minimizes the damage to the least possible ammount.

Of course people will scoff at difficulty debates, because not every game should be designed to satisfy everyone. Their inspiration was to combine persona with dark souls, this is, as designed, A turn based game, where reactions are important.

Enemies hit you for nothing on Story Mode difficult, that would be the setting for those with disabilities.

All of these discussions revolve around parries, they are meant to be high risk, high reward. If you can't handle it, just dodge.

If none of those solutions satisfy your needs or ego, then the game isn't to your taste, time to move on.

[Kibak]

Publicado originalmente por Necrilem:

This discussion about the parry system in this game is ridiculous and typical discussions brain rot.
I do play soulsgames. Very well too.
The parry system in this game is objectively poorly designed. They unrealistically skewer the pacing of attacks to trap you into parrying at the wrong time without any proper telegraph or indicator.
I find parrying in sekiro to be much easier than in this game.
That said, they can fix this by simply adding a visual indicator showing the moment to perfect parry, you know, the thing that games have been doing for literal ages? A visual blink with glow or something that helps you find the correct timing.
From the little I played before this system and the 30 fps locked, supercompressed fixed low res cutscenes with visual artifacts in gradients put me off completely, I have seen attacks with slow pacing only to attack instantly so quickly, you cannot physically react. This is just weird and the animations feel unnatural. Have the attacks flow naturally instead of fuffing with their pacing on purpose and add a visual indicator.

It is a poorly done parry/dodge system that can be improved a lot.

some attack has some indicator, its a little slowdown before you press parry. other has sound cues, and other has glow attack. sekiro is easier because if you fail it can become block and no damage taken and you can always run to regain focus. anyway just dodge if you cant parry or you know, git gud

[vadash🐉♞]

https://www.nexusmods.com/clairobscurexpedition33/mods/28

[NightHowler81]

Yeah, I'm already sick of the Dark Soul kids all over this trying to put down people who would rather this be more turn-based. Grow up. I can play it just fine, but in the early going, I'm not sold on the QTE stuff really adding much for me, and I think it might have been better without it. Maybe they will add something so everyone can be happy, but if not, it's a great overall game, and I will enjoy it. Again, please stop being nasty to each other. We are all here to try and have fun with this game.

[Darren Evans]

Publicado originalmente por JCKLNTRN:

If you find a particular enemy or attack too difficult to parry, use dodge instead, as the timing window for that is much more generous, and while it doesn't give you a counterattack, it still negates the damage and you can equip a passive that gives you extra AP for perfect dodges.

It's also a safer way to learn the attack patterns of some enemies until you can become familiar enough with them that you can start using Parry.

[Dagný]

Why oh why are people bringing up Dark Souls in the conversation as if that series is the pineacle of precise dodge/parry?
I finished DS 1,2,3 and Elden Ring without parrying. You can play even as a type of range character as pyromancer, sorceress... there are BUILDS, you don't have to parry anything. What are you all on about here?

[Walrus Beard]

Why are you people talking about accessibility? There are always going to be some things that disabled people simply cannot do because they lack the ability to do them. Should normal people miss out on certain experiences just so disabled people can be catered to? NO!!! My reflexes are not as good as some people's reflexes, and I enjoy some games that require good reflexes, like Bayonetta for example. Should that game be made easier to accommodate me? I don't think so. The world does not exist to coddle you. You make do with what you have. That's life.

[Maniac]

Publicado originalmente por Walrus Beard:

Why are you people talking about accessibility? There are always going to be some things that disabled people simply cannot do because they lack the ability to do them. Should normal people miss out on certain experiences just so disabled people can be catered to? NO!!! My reflexes are not as good as some people's reflexes, and I enjoy some games that require good reflexes, like Bayonetta for example. Should that game be made easier to accommodate me? I don't think so. The world does not exist to coddle you. You make do with what you have. That's life.

or you just add extra features for those ppl while not removing the default features for the ppl who want to use them.

would it hurt you if they would add something to the game to make it easyer for those ppl?

[Nihil]

For me it's totally the oppiste.
Gameplay is awesome and i'm scared of the fact you can trivialized the game.

I didn't spend any points in attributes I only play with parry mechanichs and since you can memorize the pattern of the bosses you can destroy them easily. I had to spend points in aptitudes because after the second biome my damage was too weak.

i m playing in expert and just with one character, just after the second biome, parry if you manage pictos do 9999 damage after this second biome with one specific character. I guess others characters can do a lot of damage too, but the one I am playing right now is insane.

Of course you have to like the fact you have to memorize patterns, but if it's the case and you like to spend tiime to understand how the game works, the game becomes easy.

It totally depends how you want to invest time to understand the mechanics and retry mobs and bosses to understand their patterns.

[Dac87]

sometimes we just have to accept that some games are not for us.
I hate the combat mechanics of Final Fantasy 7 Remake or Final Fantasy 16 for example, so I had to quit those games after some time.

With Clair Obscur I personally don't feel like the parry system is bad and I have fun with trying bosses several times to get the timings right, which is strange for me bc I can't stand souls-like games^^

[Moon Rabbit]

The problem is the tells are awful and the animation for attacks is unintuitive with a lot of lame staggered and delayed attacks that require timing that may not line up directly with the attack being met directly. according to Reddit post I saw you need to use sound as a signal as visually the attacks are unreliable.

This game apes games such as Legend of Dragoon. Xenoblade Chronicles, Super Mario RPG/Paper Mario and Shadow Hearts. But those games did the QTE system better, more intuitively and with better UIs. I'm good with the QTE system as a thing, but this game doesn't do it particularly well, and it seems like only the masochistic Dark souls players are appreciating it as some revelation of game design.

[Grahor]

Publicado originalmente por Nihil:

Gameplay is awesome and i'm scared of the fact you can trivialized the game.

Nobody is going to "trivialize" anything - it's a key mechanic, it can't be changed at this point. It just needs to be clearly shown how key this mechanic is. If I knew how much focus parry/dodge mechanics have in the game, I would never have bought it. I have no trouble whatsoever with timing, I usually can guess a pattern without even losing once, it's just it's so boring for me that I don't care to return to game. Right now it's idling in the background and I kind of try to force myself to switch it back.

[Nihil]

Publicado originalmente por Grahor:

Publicado originalmente por Nihil:

Gameplay is awesome and i'm scared of the fact you can trivialized the game.

Nobody is going to "trivialize" anything - it's a key mechanic, it can't be changed at this point. It just needs to be clearly shown how key this mechanic is. If I knew how much focus parry/dodge mechanics have in the game, I would never have bought it. I have no trouble whatsoever with timing, I usually can guess a pattern without even losing once, it's just it's so boring for me that I don't care to return to game. Right now it's idling in the background and I kind of try to force myself to switch it back.

You have three difficulties, I didn't tried the two others but I red the easiest one is easy so if you want to play the game without that parry mechanichs bothering you, just go for it. you don't have to play the game with maximum difficulty to enjoy it.

[Apoc]

Usually I'm not a fan of parry but in this game I actually like it, enemies have enough hints about what attack they are about to do that it's easy to know what to look for, like the text prompt will mention what attack is coming, slow, quick, projectile and so on.

Also maybe it's not the same later in the game, but I feel like even if you mess up all the prompts, the regular enemies and bosses can be done the "regular" way, only the optional bosses require mastery of the parry system. If you invest in some defense they won't do that much damage and I think all character have some way to heal and the items are refreshed at the flags.

[Mrbubbles153]

Skill issue, or set it to easy and grind xp to be overleveled. Most if not all of it is rhythm based also. Part of the game is to explore and figure it out. No hand holding needed