Digital Devil Saga did it better.

[托尼·索普拉诺]

Act II ending has killed most of my interest in this games narrative. I understand what it's going for, but to be frank going from what the story started as-to what it became: I am disappointed. Characters are still great but I can no longer take the stakes seriously.

Ended up playing Digital Devil Saga again and realized the setting and plot are almost exactly the same as Clair Obscur, except DDS is done better, at least with the setting.
Can't say much else without spoiling but iykyk

[IvoryTemplar]

Cool story.

Your cookie is in the mail.

[TripSin]

Sucks for you that you can't enjoy it

[Paradroid78]

You should probably finish the game before judging it. You're only on act two of a three act story. No spoilers, but it gets very intense.

[托尼·索普拉诺]

Originally posted by Paradroid78:

You should probably finish the game before judging it. You're only on act two of a three act story. No spoilers, but it gets very intense.

I will at some point, but from what I've seen I can pretty much already tell what the ending is going to be. I think its completely valid to be disappointed in the twist. The consequences of it are interesting but also needlesly alienating. The story could have had its cake and eaten it too.

[Yew Nough]

I agree that it's too heavy of a plot twist, but the story is still worth exploring.
That's all I can say.

[This PC]

Originally posted by 托尼·索普拉诺:

Originally posted by Paradroid78:

You should probably finish the game before judging it. You're only on act two of a three act story. No spoilers, but it gets very intense.

I will at some point, but from what I've seen I can pretty much already tell what the ending is going to be. I think its completely valid to be disappointed in the twist. The consequences of it are interesting but also needlesly alienating. The story could have had its cake and eaten it too.

The twist is fine ? Kinda new and different, just, it all comes at once and it's a bit jarring, but once you get over it and you start functioning in the new state of things, it quickly feels natural, Maelle is a much more pleasant character from that point onwards and the gameplay itself becomes much more interesting, challenging, nuanced and open ended.

I don't feel there's anything alienating, on the contrary, the game felt alien to me until that point and I think it's by design. Even the track on the world map feels more comforting and hopeful.

[托尼·索普拉诺]

Originally posted by This PC:

Originally posted by 托尼·索普拉诺:

I will at some point, but from what I've seen I can pretty much already tell what the ending is going to be. I think its completely valid to be disappointed in the twist. The consequences of it are interesting but also needlesly alienating. The story could have had its cake and eaten it too.

The twist is fine ? Kinda new and different, just, it all comes at once and it's a bit jarring, but once you get over it and you start functioning in the new state of things, it quickly feels natural, Maelle is a much more pleasant character from that point onwards and the gameplay itself becomes much more interesting, challenging, nuanced and open ended.

I don't feel there's anything alienating, on the contrary, the game felt alien to me until that point and I think it's by design. Even the track on the world map feels more comforting and hopeful.

Revealing that the world is simply a painting after selling us on the life or death of these characters is incredibly alienating. Especially after Maelle brings Sciel and Lune back to life like it's nothing.
It doesn't quickly feel natural. Everyone easily moves on once they realize Maelle is a God and can bring people back to life.

I'm not trying to convince you to agree with me but you should acknowledge that there are those who played and enjoyed the game up until ActII like myself and lost interest. Acting like the game isn't flawed doesn't make me take you seriously.

[Knightspace]

Originally posted by 托尼·索普拉诺:

Originally posted by This PC:

The twist is fine ? Kinda new and different, just, it all comes at once and it's a bit jarring, but once you get over it and you start functioning in the new state of things, it quickly feels natural, Maelle is a much more pleasant character from that point onwards and the gameplay itself becomes much more interesting, challenging, nuanced and open ended.

I don't feel there's anything alienating, on the contrary, the game felt alien to me until that point and I think it's by design. Even the track on the world map feels more comforting and hopeful.

Revealing that the world is simply a painting after selling us on the life or death of these characters is incredibly alienating. Especially after Maelle brings Sciel and Lune back to life like it's nothing.
It doesn't quickly feel natural. Everyone easily moves on once they realize Maelle is a God and can bring people back to life.

I'm not trying to convince you to agree with me but you should acknowledge that there are those who played and enjoyed the game up until ActII like myself and lost interest. Acting like the game isn't flawed doesn't make me take you seriously.

I mean, it's not like it's explained why and how she could bring Sciel and Lune back from the Gommage.

Also, if Renoir isn't stopped, everyone from the painting will disappear forever. Complete and utter annhililation. I'm not sure how people can say that the stakes aren't as high.

[托尼·索普拉诺]

Originally posted by Knightspace:

Originally posted by 托尼·索普拉诺:

Revealing that the world is simply a painting after selling us on the life or death of these characters is incredibly alienating. Especially after Maelle brings Sciel and Lune back to life like it's nothing.
It doesn't quickly feel natural. Everyone easily moves on once they realize Maelle is a God and can bring people back to life.

I'm not trying to convince you to agree with me but you should acknowledge that there are those who played and enjoyed the game up until ActII like myself and lost interest. Acting like the game isn't flawed doesn't make me take you seriously.

I mean, it's not like it's explained why and how she could bring Sciel and Lune back from the Gommage.

Also, if Renoir isn't stopped, everyone from the painting will disappear forever. Complete and utter annhililation. I'm not sure how people can say that the stakes aren't as high.

Explaining how she brings them back doesn't magically make it deep. It's still cheap and ruined the stakes for me.

This is has potential to be interesting but falls flat. My view is that it's just a painting, ♥♥♥♥ em. Unless the story shows that the people in the paintings are REAL or have the ability to appear outside the painting then it's a dumb argument. The painting is clearly bad for the only real people in the story who are abusing it.

[Knightspace]

Originally posted by 托尼·索普拉诺:

Originally posted by Knightspace:

I mean, it's not like it's explained why and how she could bring Sciel and Lune back from the Gommage.

Also, if Renoir isn't stopped, everyone from the painting will disappear forever. Complete and utter annhililation. I'm not sure how people can say that the stakes aren't as high.

Explaining how she brings them back doesn't magically make it deep. It's still cheap and ruined the stakes for me.

This is has potential to be interesting but falls flat. My view is that it's just a painting, ♥♥♥♥ em. Unless the story shows that the people in the paintings are REAL or have the ability to appear outside the painting then it's a dumb argument. The painting is clearly bad for the only real people in the story who are abusing it.

Ok, so an analogy for you

Let's say that in the next couple of decades a group of scientists creates a genuine AI, capable of independent thought, invention and creativity. Would you say that it's not a real intelligence?

The painting in the game isn't just a painting, it's an entire pocket dimension, created by the only son of a family that grieves his passing. The beings and people inside that painting ARE real, they are just trapped within their creator's vision, animated by a metaphorical (or literal) soul of an artist.

I genuinely cannot understand why it's so hard for some people to get that.

[托尼·索普拉诺]

Originally posted by Knightspace:

Originally posted by 托尼·索普拉诺:

Explaining how she brings them back doesn't magically make it deep. It's still cheap and ruined the stakes for me.

This is has potential to be interesting but falls flat. My view is that it's just a painting, ♥♥♥♥ em. Unless the story shows that the people in the paintings are REAL or have the ability to appear outside the painting then it's a dumb argument. The painting is clearly bad for the only real people in the story who are abusing it.

Ok, so an analogy for you

Let's say that in the next couple of decades a group of scientists creates a genuine AI, capable of independent thought, invention and creativity. Would you say that it's not a real intelligence?

The painting in the game isn't just a painting, it's an entire pocket dimension, created by the only son of a family that grieves his passing. The beings and people inside that painting ARE real, they are just trapped within their creator's vision, animated by a metaphorical (or literal) soul of an artist.

I genuinely cannot understand why it's so hard for some people to get that.

Your pretentious ass is showing dude.

The problem isnt that people don't understand it. The problem is that it's a bad twist and a bad narrative. Again, i was all on board with the game until ActII. I'm not some hater. The setting is not complicated to understand in the slightest.

I genuinely cannot understand why it's so hard for some people to realize that others think differently.

[Yew Nough]

Originally posted by 托尼·索普拉诺:

The problem isnt that people don't understand it. The problem is that it's a bad twist and a bad narrative.

You thinking the twist is bad is your opinion.

Your opinion isn't objective truth.

Not sure what you're even trying to argue? You want people to agree with you?

[This PC]

Originally posted by 托尼·索普拉诺:

Revealing that the world is simply a painting after selling us on the life or death of these characters is incredibly alienating.

You could spoiler that out of respect, but no, like, the setting is initially alienating, because of these revelations, you have the option to fix it and to bring back the people that gommaged and you get the opportunity to protect that world. Instead of seeing it like a painting, see it like an entire world of its own, and painters being something like gods. It's a better outcome than even what you set out to initially achieve from that perspective.

Not our fault if you're unwilling to engage beyond "it's bad".

[托尼·索普拉诺]

Originally posted by Yew Nough:

Originally posted by 托尼·索普拉诺:

The problem isnt that people don't understand it. The problem is that it's a bad twist and a bad narrative.

You thinking the twist is bad is your opinion.

Your opinion isn't objective truth.

Not sure what you're even trying to argue? You want people to agree with you? :lunar2019crylaughingpig:

I'm not claiming it as objective but the fact is that there are players who share my opinion who are not simply blind haters or "didnt get it." That's all I'm saying here.

[This PC]

Originally posted by 托尼·索普拉诺:

I'm not claiming it as objective but the fact is that there are players who share my opinion who are not simply blind haters or "didnt get it." That's all I'm saying here.

Have you considered the people that disagree with you in that judgment ? Are the people that agree with you a significant number of people ? If you're gonna use other people to validate your judgment, you better have numbers. :P