Kite builds are not fun to fight

[Nicholas Angel 04]

Change my mind.

[ImHelping]

I am one of the rare "My 380 speed build can literally walk away. You hit me with a chainsaw while staggered and I just kinda wiggled loose and shot you in the face. This is nuts. You deserve better" players. *recovers from stagger and walks out of the way faster than a majestic bazooka can reach him.*

I love lights being good. I am still sad heavies keep getting kicked in the ♥♥♥♥ while people screech they are still OP. The most fun I had with heavies was before they neutered the heaviest thruster's capability of "Longest burn super fast assault boost" to marathon run vs the sprinters.

Which is why I'm just above average in total performance because I keep wanting to kick heavies in the face with my "three different missile launchers and a shotgun" light anyways. Then tanking my ranking trying to give dual rifles another chance when I was still poking at ranked.

It also had the side effect of making phase 1 of the true final boss more awkward. Buffs to those player parts and nerfs to kicks mean iggy boy and the mass produced mob recover from stagger SUPER fast now. My S rank replays heavy or light just ignore kicks entirely in the campaign these days.

[Taberone]

I wish ACVI had the missile-interceptor extensions from old-gen (ex. AC2/AC3)
Their lack of inclusion is what makes those missile-rat builds really frustrating. Old-gen let you counter missile spam by installing extensions to shoot down incoming missiles.

[Nicholas Angel 04]

Originally posted by Taberone:

I wish ACVI had the missile-interceptor extensions from old-gen (ex. AC2/AC3)
Their lack of inclusion is what makes those missile-rat builds really frustrating. Old-gen let you counter missile spam by installing extensions to shoot down incoming missiles.

While it would be much more useful if it was an extension, isn't this what the jamming rounds gun does?

[Citizen of Zozo]

Originally posted by Nicholas Angel 04:

Originally posted by Taberone:

I wish ACVI had the missile-interceptor extensions from old-gen (ex. AC2/AC3)
Their lack of inclusion is what makes those missile-rat builds really frustrating. Old-gen let you counter missile spam by installing extensions to shoot down incoming missiles.

While it would be much more useful if it was an extension, isn't this what the jamming rounds gun does?

Not really. As you have to stay in the cloud for it to be effective *and* you get your targeting scrambled as well. Which regulates the Jammer gun to gimmick builds.

[ImHelping]

Originally posted by Taberone:

I wish ACVI had the missile-interceptor extensions from old-gen (ex. AC2/AC3)
Their lack of inclusion is what makes those missile-rat builds really frustrating. Old-gen let you counter missile spam by installing extensions to shoot down incoming missiles.

This is part of my growing ire with one-sided design. Because one of the more annoying (not hard, annoying) enemies in this game is a jetpack PCA suit with infinity flare launchers.

Spend a solid minute chasing down one of those jerks for their combat log, then thank god Freud is a legitimate classic AC build instead of an input reading jerk to crush him in thirty seconds.

Originally posted by Citizen of Zozo:

Originally posted by Nicholas Angel 04:

While it would be much more useful if it was an extension, isn't this what the jamming rounds gun does?

Not really. As you have to stay in the cloud for it to be effective *and* you get your targeting scrambled as well. Which regulates the Jammer gun to gimmick builds.

Also this. The campaign mission handing you one is a super close combat only trash bot so you might not realize at the time. But once you try using it on anything farther than uzi distance? welp!

[TGHoly]

I also hate rat build but kind of understand why it exist when another options is Immortal tank and One shot Zimmerman build.

[Gerbera]

Originally posted by Citizen of Zozo:

Originally posted by Nicholas Angel 04:

While it would be much more useful if it was an extension, isn't this what the jamming rounds gun does?

Not really. As you have to stay in the cloud for it to be effective *and* you get your targeting scrambled as well. Which regulates the Jammer gun to gimmick builds.

I have yet to see a goofy but somehow effective gameplay for the jamming bombs.

[Nicholas Angel 04]

Just realized I didn't explain why I think this, so;

Basically I find that when fighting kite builds fights are drawn out and overall boring imo. All the opponent does is constantly backpedal and pepper you with machine gun fire or some missiles.

[Plus Escapee]

I think the reason they aren't fun to fight is because you don't actually fight them. You chase them, then you catch them. You can either hit them or you can't, and if you can hit them, there's very little fight. If you can't hit them, again, there's very little fight.

There's no intense "oh, what a good dodge, he caught me with that kick, I baited him to shoot his weapon and punished" actual fighting. It's just a chase, often with no payout. You can get AP lead and take cover, or they take AP lead and stay away, so it's often not a fight, it's a tactical siege with no adrenaline-pumping melee moments, no core-theory.

I think they are fun to catch and destroy, but whether you win or lose it wasn't a fight, and that's the big problem.

[PreventerWind]

I'm starting to feel like a lot of builds aren't fun to fight. I think a lot of has to do with the netcode, but that's partially because of how dodging and breaking lock works. Not to mention stagger extension and the weird micro stutters that wont let you fire your cannon even when not staggered. all this on top of weapons that remain unbalanced like the shotgun and etsujin to a lesser degree.

Missiles rats aren't fun. Cannon heavies aren't fun. kite rifle or etsujen builds aren't fun, Piles are fun but stagger extension is frustrating to watch and if they lined up right you watch in agony as they fly over bunk you. almost every time. double shotgun builds aren't fun for the some reason, two hits and a few missile will stagger you then get ready for shoot kick shoot kick. almost nothing you can do.

What I want is for variety to be king and no build to be "untouchable" but dodging to be sophisticated than elevator action or running left faster than bullets can fly, or hold stick back to win. I don't want to be stuck in micro stutters I want a continuous exchange of fluent action as both players position for victory

[Nicholas Angel 04]

Originally posted by PreventerWind:

What I want is for variety to be king

I completely agree with this

[TGHoly]

Yeah not code is another reason I should I take the win/lost serious when the game still count my perfect dodge as a hit even I'm far from opponent like half of the map. Some time I saw my opponent seem to shoot at random place like madman just to notice my AP slowly decrease. And most of the time my active warning sound delay like 5 second after opponent already hit me with their shoulder weapon and even carry to the beginning of next round when I die. XD

[nubi]

PvP in AC6 is at its most fun when playing around cover, the game has multiple cool mechanics that interact with cover and make playing around cover fun, the game feels like PvP was designed to be played around cover, however, for some reason, devs forgot to actually add any cover to most PvP maps.

[ImHelping]

Originally posted by nubi:

PvP in AC6 is at its most fun when playing around cover, the game has multiple cool mechanics that interact with cover and make playing around cover fun, the game feels like PvP was designed to be played around cover, however, for some reason, devs forgot to actually add any cover to most PvP maps.

Everyone loves trying to be the first to hide behind the invulnerable fuel tanker in the cramped sweeper arena.

AKA "Oh wow the earshot grenade is actually useful on this map" time. With special surprise friend "They spend the whole match up against the ceiling...Oh that poor fool" but you don't get accidental multi stagger/kills that way.

[Citizen of Zozo]

Originally posted by Gerbera:

Originally posted by Citizen of Zozo:

Not really. As you have to stay in the cloud for it to be effective *and* you get your targeting scrambled as well. Which regulates the Jammer gun to gimmick builds.

I have yet to see a goofy but somehow effective gameplay for the jamming bombs.

I've seen two.
One is all about free-aiming plasma weapons in manual aiming mode, counting on the airburst to ballpark the shots so they don't have to be perfectly aimed.
The other relies on the 'demon blade' technique with the Coral Oscillator. The demon blade is when you turn your AC at a sharp angle while free-aiming so that the charged Oscillator begins its rotation close to or directly on top of the enemy. Takes a lot of practice.

Granted, these still aren't especially meta builds. They can win fights though.