what the hell is that stupid attack helicopter

[carl]

You cannot sword him cuz he runs out of bound
You cannot dodge missiles cuz u dont know where they came from ....
Really is this peak scifi game ?

[Unknown]

Publicado originalmente por Naiba:

Isn't the game supposed to train you incrementally so it can throw things like this at you once you have the controls, moves and capabilities of your AC down?

I don't think any of the bosses are too hard. I just think some are too hard for where they're positioned in the campaign. The tutorial boss is another example of that.

I don't really understand the motivation of going up against hard bosses like this without a training montage. ;)

No. It's just that you are a type of person that can only get things done when you are being lead by hand extensively. People who can't think for themselves deserves to get stomped. Why would a boss, or even another player, conform to your standards? Keep up or stay down.

[Naiba]

Publicado originalmente por Unknown:

No. It's just that you are a type of person that can only get things done when you are being lead by hand extensively. People who can't think for themselves deserves to get stomped. Why would a boss, or even another player, conform to your standards? Keep up or stay down.

...How do you think people learn in the real world?
Do you think heavyweight boxers sit around and then go into a title fight with no preparation, and just do that repeatedly until they stop losing?

I'm saying the game doesn't throw challenges at the player earlier to make sure they understand what they're being told, and that's really really weird.

[Unknown]

Publicado originalmente por Naiba:

...How do you think people learn in the real world?
Do you think heavyweight boxers sit around and then go into a title fight with no preparation, and just do that repeatedly until they stop losing?

Heavyweight boxers aren't trying to gun down the attack helicopter. If you actually have time to come up with long essays regarding irrelevant scenarios to win arguments, you ought to have time to git gud.

[Naiba]

Publicado originalmente por Unknown:

Heavyweight boxers aren't trying to gun down the attack helicopter. If you actually have time to come up with long essays regarding irrelevant scenarios to win arguments, you ought to have time to git gud.

It's called an analogy.

[Naiba]

I'll also say that 'Attitude Control System' is a poor choice of words to bring up around stagger with that particular boss, and makes a lot of players think it's talking about shooting the helicopter's manoeuvring thrusters, which unnecessary and impossible to lock onto. ;)

[Unknown]

Publicado originalmente por Naiba:

Publicado originalmente por Unknown:

Heavyweight boxers aren't trying to gun down the attack helicopter. If you actually have time to come up with long essays regarding irrelevant scenarios to win arguments, you ought to have time to git gud.

It's called an analogy.

And how does that analogy apply to the attack chopper? How many more of your analogies do you plan to spew before you start making effort relevant to the problem in hand?

[Naiba]

Publicado originalmente por Unknown:

Publicado originalmente por Naiba:

It's called an analogy.

And how does that analogy apply to the attack chopper? How many more of your analogies do you plan to spew before you start making effort relevant to the problem in hand?

You work up to a 'big' fight. The helicopter isn't that big a fight, true, but nothing before you reach it needs any skills what so ever that are relevant in fighting it. You can slowly walk up to every enemy shooting with the AR and still reach the helicopter. I'm just saying AC6 should throw something tougher along the way so that the lessons the game tries to explain stick.

[Tustle]

Publicado originalmente por Unknown:

Beating up a tutorial boss that filtered countless wannabe Ravens, especially during the first encounter, isn't a power trip? What constitutes the word "easy" for him, then? I, for one, would bet that he would opt for the least effort exerted for it to count as "easy." In other words, not playing at all. Absolutely no sympathy to these generation of "gamers."

Last Raven, way back in the era of the PS2: first mission. You were timed and had to wipe out a sizable squad of MT's and maybe helicopters on a floating ocean platform. But that was it, and they fell like wheat to the scythe against even the starting AC if you weren't porting anything from Nexus or I think Nine Breaker.

That, in a way, was a power trip: to maximize profit you of course had to play smart to find and take down every MT, but ideally in the process the game made you feel like you were piloting this invincible giant robot death machine, even if you were stuck using a subpar rifle and a missile launcher in addition to the insta-delete sword. Nothing on that first stage posed a real threat to you, just teased future ones in the ending cutscene as other AC pilots came thundering in to try to catch you.

Now at first, the tutorial stage of ACVI does the same thing, and even does it better in giving you varied environments to try and get a grip on the movement controls and combat. The jarring thing comes at the end when we end up having to fight the gigantic death helicopter teased earlier into the mission which, though very handy in showing us what happens when our repair kits run dry and we total our AC, is still very early on when someone completely new to Armored Core is still feasibly getting to grips with the controls and handling of an AC. It's like the game was holding our hand up to that point just to push us into the middle section of the pool and yelling at us "Now swim, you fools!" All while in the deep end there's Ibis waiting with some of the other bosses, smiling creepily while readying big sturdy sticks to push us under the water with.

In this metaphor then, I think it wouldn't have hurt if the game's tutorial boss was instead replaced with, say, the quad MT in the destroy transport choppers mission. The big one, with the laser blade and a bazooka I believe: still a meaty challenge for someone in the piddly starting AC and completely new to Armored Core, but at least this one would organically teach us dodging and stagger while being the metaphorical equivalent of the game pushing us towards the shallow end where a bigger child with a pool noodle is waiting to whack anyone that wanders too close to him. The death copter can come halfway into chapter 1, before we fight Balteus, and this would still be a sufficient ramping up of difficulty without completely losing the ball-tussling challenge.

But again, at least we have checkpoints and repair kits in this game so we're free to continue butting heads with a boss on a run until we win, so that while at times it's herding honey badgers hard it's still forgiving.

[Leonhardt]

I haven't seen people this upset by a helicopter since kobe bryant died

[Unknown]

Publicado originalmente por Naiba:

You work up to a 'big' fight. The helicopter isn't that big a fight, true, but nothing before you reach it needs any skills what so ever that are relevant in fighting it. You can slowly walk up to every enemy shooting with the AR and still reach the helicopter. I'm just saying AC6 should throw something tougher along the way so that the lessons the game tries to explain stick.

So you need something to lead you to help you for whatever is coming up? See, no progress unless being lead by. I suppose standing on your own feet & thinking on the fly is way more difficult than a tutorial boss.

Publicado originalmente por Tustle:

Last Raven, way back in the era of the PS2: first mission. You were timed and had to wipe out a sizable squad of MT's and maybe helicopters on a floating ocean platform. But that was it, and they fell like wheat to the scythe against even the starting AC if you weren't porting anything from Nexus or I think Nine Breaker.

That, in a way, was a power trip: to maximize profit you of course had to play smart to find and take down every MT, but ideally in the process the game made you feel like you were piloting this invincible giant robot death machine, even if you were stuck using a subpar rifle and a missile launcher in addition to the insta-delete sword. Nothing on that first stage posed a real threat to you, just teased future ones in the ending cutscene as other AC pilots came thundering in to try to catch you.

Now at first, the tutorial stage of ACVI does the same thing, and even does it better in giving you varied environments to try and get a grip on the movement controls and combat. The jarring thing comes at the end when we end up having to fight the gigantic death helicopter teased earlier into the mission which, though very handy in showing us what happens when our repair kits run dry and we total our AC, is still very early on when someone completely new to Armored Core is still feasibly getting to grips with the controls and handling of an AC. It's like the game was holding our hand up to that point just to push us into the middle section of the pool and yelling at us "Now swim, you fools!" All while in the deep end there's Ibis waiting with some of the other bosses, smiling creepily while readying big sturdy sticks to push us under the water with.

In this metaphor then, I think it wouldn't have hurt if the game's tutorial boss was instead replaced with, say, the quad MT in the destroy transport choppers mission. The big one, with the laser blade and a bazooka I believe: still a meaty challenge for someone in the piddly starting AC and completely new to Armored Core, but at least this one would organically teach us dodging and stagger while being the metaphorical equivalent of the game pushing us towards the shallow end where a bigger child with a pool noodle is waiting to whack anyone that wanders too close to him. The death copter can come halfway into chapter 1, before we fight Balteus, and this would still be a sufficient ramping up of difficulty without completely losing the ball-tussling challenge.

But again, at least we have checkpoints and repair kits in this game so we're free to continue butting heads with a boss on a run until we win, so that while at times it's herding honey badgers hard it's still forgiving.

That's the point; it's supposed to hurt. Otherwise, if the boss were to be replaced with one as insignificant as the mobs you can easily clear, what sort of morbid effort do you think you'd exert in the first place? You've just grown too accustomed in just mindlessly breezing through games that when an actual boss appears & causes you to actually play, you fall apart.

And what's even more hilarious is that in single player games, enemies have scripted moves & predictable patterns. If you keep getting served by the same. Damn. Thing. Every. Single. Time...

[Tustle]

Publicado originalmente por Unknown:

That's the point; it's supposed to hurt. Otherwise, if the boss were to be replaced with one as insignificant as the mobs you can easily clear, what sort of morbid effort do you think you'd exert in the first place? You've just grown too accustomed in just mindlessly breezing through games that when an actual boss appears & causes you to actually play, you fall apart.

And what's even more hilarious is that in single player games, enemies have scripted moves & predictable patterns. If you keep getting served by the same. Damn. Thing. Every. Single. Time...

...I see you've skipped over what appears to be the entire damn thing I wrote.

Admittedly I get wordy.

That said, I'm saying that we as Ravens had our first missions freaking handed to us as far back as Last Raven and even after that. To just blindly tell anyone unable to surpass that helicopter to just 'git gud' without acknowledging that it's a hard sell for a completely green AC pilot to fight it compared to what we had to tango with on our first sorties smacks of elitism.

So when I say 'it wouldn't have hurt,' I mean it wouldn't hurt the game's difficulty any to have freakin' reordered the encounters around a little, I'm not saying to remove jack. It'd give the green AC pilots time to get used to the controls fully, challenge them on the tutorial stage in the form of a big tetrapod with heavy weapons and armor that shrugs off everything but the starting AC's sword, then when chips are to the wall and players are starting to find loadouts and builds they like from the selection of starting parts: "SURPRISE! Welcome to the middle of the pool, f#$%os!" Drop the death helicopter in the middle of the first chapter. Make it the toe they dip into before they get dumped in to fight Balteus.

that said I imagine in an alternate universe where this does happen, there'd still be people complaining about the BAWS Tetrapod on the tutorial level and our alternate versions are just going to sit there shaking our heads.

[Misuki]

Hahahaha your post has been turned into a parody xD (The Channel has over 1Mil Subscribers)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h05yYq0X3pQ
Good Job :D

[Slice]

I had a hard time beating the helicopter, my mistake was not using the assault boost (cntrl). Once I used the assault boost I actually beat him without getting hit once.

[KingDragoon]

https://youtu.be/h05yYq0X3pQ?si=1J3RSu_IjeTVGM3z

[Young Erusean Officer]

OP got meme'd on