Stop punishing Spies/Enemy uniform disguising

[Jalapeeno]

This feature only exists in Reforger and in no other game can you masquerade as the enemy as dynamically and engaging as it is featured RIGHT NOW. The next update will punish you for wearing enemy clothing, ok but why is it still in the game then? In Arma 3 and 2 you couldnt easily wear enemy clothes and often this required a mod or a tickbox checked. Also if you really have trouble getting ambushed by spies its more than likely your play style needs work. You shouldnt make eye contact with a friendly farther than their nametag can load from, if you do end up seeing them, the radio exists to IFF. I admit it is annoying getting a TK by shooting your friendly whos dressed in enemy clothes but that could be implemented instead of punishing players dressed as the Enemy.

Also dont give me that Its a war crime BS, War crimes happen in this game all of the damn time. Try surrendering unarmed and see what happens to you. Bohemia stop punishing players for using the features that make this game great.

PS. If it really bothers you that you are getting killed by players in disguise, just try it for yourself and see how much fun you can have being a sapper behind enemy lines. Its like playing Hitman. Also should we penalize players for getting kills as a naked? They are wearing no teams uniform. Plus we are gonna see players attempting to look like the other team with the items still available, like am i gonna get the penalty for wearing a russian vest as a US? If not then players are going to skirt the rules anyway to confuse players, but by doing this you have ruined the Hitman elements that dynamically existed.

[GirthQuake]

War Crimes is always a cheap crutch they rely on until you start pointing out other war crimes and they realized half their gameplay would be penalized/blocked due to war crimes.

[RunsWithScissors]

Not sure where this fixation with masquerading as the enemy comes from but it is so uncommon, let’s concentrate on what DOES happen on the battlefield.

[Jalapeeno]

Originally posted by civdiv:

Not sure where this fixation with masquerading as the enemy comes from but it is so uncommon, let’s concentrate on what DOES happen on the battlefield.

Its fun, being able to sneak around and fool enemies is a helluva lot of fun. I mean dont start talking about what does happen on a battlefield when this game is intentionally missing all of the important parts of both US and Soviet military doctrines, the US sending out 2 dudes in a helicopter to take a major base never happens IRL but it happens all the time in reforger.

[GirthQuake]

Originally posted by civdiv:

Not sure where this fixation with masquerading as the enemy comes from but it is so uncommon, let’s concentrate on what DOES happen on the battlefield.

I enjoy doing it to scout points or set up a ambush for logi/troop transport where I purposefully flip a car on the side of the road and stand near it asking for help.

[|H|H| Fr3ddi3]

I'll bite, and I don't play PvP in the first place so this is entirely pointless on my part.

The ability to wear enemy uniforms is fine as a mecahnic, but it being enabled on every public server is frankly just asking for endless ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ which is why I think BI are doing the right thing.

Public players are, and I won't sugar coat it, dumb, and they will always be dumb, they will NEVER reach the level of skill required to play the game in the manner that it could be played, they don't use the radio, they don't type anything and they sure as ♥♥♥♥ don't PiD anything.

So yes, the official servers? turn it off, the people that wanna troll or lets be honest, farm some noobs with it ... boo hoo.

But for community owned servers where the player base has a higher chance of being able to deal with it? absolutely allow admins the choice.

[Koala]

Encouraging team killing is bad for gameplay.

[GirthQuake]

Originally posted by Koala:

Encouraging team killing is bad for gameplay.

I see more team killing surrounding helicopters/vehicle issues and grudges between players(usually logi and inf), than I do over someone In enemy uniform.

[RunsWithScissors]

Originally posted by GirthQuake:

Originally posted by Koala:

Encouraging team killing is bad for gameplay.

I see more team killing surrounding helicopters/vehicle issues and grudges between players(usually logi and inf), than I do over someone In enemy uniform.

That’s because wearing the other team’s uniform is a bannable offense as is main base camping, ramming, etc. These are rules because they enable better game play.

I’d be fine if they just took away the ability to customize your uniform like they do in Squad. These games are trying to be milsims not Call of Dootie.

[GirthQuake]

Originally posted by civdiv:

Originally posted by GirthQuake:

I see more team killing surrounding helicopters/vehicle issues and grudges between players(usually logi and inf), than I do over someone In enemy uniform.

That’s because wearing the other team’s uniform is a bannable offense as is main base camping, ramming, etc. These are rules because they enable better game play.

I’d be fine if they just took away the ability to customize your uniform like they do in Squad. These games are trying to be milsims not Call of Dootie.

It's not a bannable offense on official servers and on some community servers.

[TheReaper]

Originally posted by civdiv:

Originally posted by GirthQuake:

I see more team killing surrounding helicopters/vehicle issues and grudges between players(usually logi and inf), than I do over someone In enemy uniform.

That’s because wearing the other team’s uniform is a bannable offense as is main base camping, ramming, etc. These are rules because they enable better game play.

I’d be fine if they just took away the ability to customize your uniform like they do in Squad. These games are trying to be milsims not Call of Dootie.

I don't think its being like call of duty allowing the uniforms to be changed/edited. In the American military especially there are different uniforms. MCCUU both in two different patterns, as well as NWU AOR-1 and AOR-2. i believe the ability to customize the uniform shouldn't be scrapped due to misuse.

Armbands are used and should be the only identifying marker. In most servers its against the rules to remove the armband. IMO don't allow people to take them off and make them thinner.

[Jalapeeno]

Originally posted by |H|H| Fr3ddi3:

I'll bite, and I don't play PvP in the first place so this is entirely pointless on my part.

The ability to wear enemy uniforms is fine as a mecahnic, but it being enabled on every public server is frankly just asking for endless ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ which is why I think BI are doing the right thing.

Public players are, and I won't sugar coat it, dumb, and they will always be dumb, they will NEVER reach the level of skill required to play the game in the manner that it could be played, they don't use the radio, they don't type anything and they sure as ♥♥♥♥ don't PiD anything.

So yes, the official servers? turn it off, the people that wanna troll or lets be honest, farm some noobs with it ... boo hoo.

But for community owned servers where the player base has a higher chance of being able to deal with it? absolutely allow admins the choice.

Well yeah this is for the Official servers for the incoming update. Obviously who cares what community servers want to do. I still dont see how players being dumb is a reason to get rid of it. I really think its a vocal minority that are upset about this issue. I have 700 hours and I have been killed by disguised enemies maybe 15 times. Even then I still see it as fair because 1. I can do the same to them. 2. I shouldve been on my guard and noticed a guy in bloody fatigues doesnt have his name tag over him. Like I said " You shouldnt make eye contact with a friendly farther than their nametag can load from" and if its unavoidable radio and check the map, if youre still not sure, but they havent shot at you dont shoot them. If they do well shoot back. Ive had plenty of friendlies try to shoot me (in the same uniform not disguised) because they are new or confused and its not such a big deal.

If the penalty just lowers your rank fine. But it counting as a teamkill is to me a cop out and it destroys so much emergent tactical decision making/gameplay. If you think ambushing a US jeep, taking their clothes and wiring up their car with explosives, driving back to their base and blowing up a bunch of unwitting soldiers should be against the rules. Then frankly I think you are wrong and are in some part playing this game incorrectly.

[Jalapeeno]

Originally posted by Koala:

Encouraging team killing is bad for gameplay.

Thats how the game has worked for its duration and It does not encourage you to shoot your teammates. Implementing the penalties for being disguised isnt gonna solve team killing magically either. Also I wish I could take the data but anecdotally most teamkills are intentional either by trolling players or two players having an argument. Or from being in a opposite faction vehicle. Are we going to be able to drive enemy vehicles still? Wouldnt you then want to get rid of that too? I think any of it is too far.

Either way players arent encouraged to teamkill from enemies being in disguise, the actual "problem" with it is that players ARENT shooting the disguised players and BI sees this as being enough of an issue to start penalizing players.

[RunsWithScissors]

Originally posted by TheReaper:

Originally posted by civdiv:

That’s because wearing the other team’s uniform is a bannable offense as is main base camping, ramming, etc. These are rules because they enable better game play.

I’d be fine if they just took away the ability to customize your uniform like they do in Squad. These games are trying to be milsims not Call of Dootie.

I don't think its being like call of duty allowing the uniforms to be changed/edited. In the American military especially there are different uniforms. MCCUU both in two different patterns, as well as NWU AOR-1 and AOR-2. i believe the ability to customize the uniform shouldn't be scrapped due to misuse.

Armbands are used and should be the only identifying marker. In most servers its against the rules to remove the armband. IMO don't allow people to take them off and make them thinner.

There may be different uniforms, but line units standardize their uniforms. Even Navy attached to USMC units wear USMC combat uniforms, not Navy uniforms. A Marine unit wears MARPAT, an Army unit MultiCam or whatever they call it. Special Operators have more leeway but even they have rules for uniform uniformity. You know why? So they can tell the bad guys from the good guys.

[Zombo]

I think the issue is the looting and equipping. Things like ammo and grenades should be quick to loot, but switching uniforms should take time, and require one to be going through an animation while a progress bar progresses. Both taking the uniform, and putting it on. The looting is unrealistic, in that you can strip an enemy in seconds. And equip it all just as fast.

[ThunderStorm]

I am still playing a old classic game "Wolfenstein Enemy Territory" and there you have have one class soldat (coverops) that can take a enemy uniform.
Maby BI must create a new infantry in the list that can ware a uniform off a enemy.