no tanks

[Many-Named]

I am very surprised that there won't be any tanks considering this is a Cold War era game in an european setting. What is the rationale do you think behind it?

Ty

[Infallible Kitten]

The same reason we dont have alot of assets.
Engine isnt ready to support it and likely not within their support scope for this title.

[SundownUK]

Were just testing the bare bones atm it seems, infantry combat and the conflict multiplayer mode. It might be we don't get anything significant in terms of assets until they solve the fundamental problem with server disconnects.

[-OrLoK- Слава Україн]

I'm old enough to remember a time before kinder eggs and although it would be nice to have everything timelined and detailed there are very good reasons to keep things vague although I do attribute much of what we know and don't know to translation/context/etc issues.

in the distant past I was given a firm "No!" by someone close to the centre of BI about something I wanted changed in A3 etc but 6 months later it was announced as coming.

my vague point is, never say never.

don't expect tracked vehicles any time soon if at all but don't discount them either.

they'll have to test em out at some stage so we may well get our dirty paws on them sometime.

however, bear in mind that the current vehicles are very basic in their handling, collision and damage models etc and hopefully/likely the devs will work on them to get the basics right before moving on to more complex vehicles.

[ItIsntJack]

I think if we get anything, maybe an M113 (as an opposite to the soviet armour) would happen later on. I wouldn't be surprised to see some kind of tracked vehicle to test the tracked physics for A4, especially after the 1st release of tracked in arma 3. Yes it was funny sliding around uncontrollably but still.

[Biggus Dickus]

Originally posted by tomofren:

might be an issue of miscommunication or translation based on a gamestar interview, and they're not being 100 % clear on this imo


"How is the full version planned to differ from the early access version?
The early access version might lack some features and have a limited amount of assets (such as no tracked vehicles). These features will be continuously added throughout the early access period via content updates."
https://reforger.armaplatform.com/faq
so this tells me the FAQ announced tracked vehicles as part of the continuously added content updates during EA, whether that includes MBTs or only IFV and APC isn't stated.

then there is the gamestar article where the "no tanks" is suggested by GS
GS:"There wont be tanks for Reforger, however you hinted at helicopters [...]"
JD: "aside from helicopters we have at the moment no plans for big expansions with the vehicle classes of reforger"

GS: "is there a roadmap for the early access of arma reforger?"
JD: "yes, but we do not plan for the duration of the early access phase to deliver large [??] content expansions, because we want to focus more on the core-platform. the game is still completely extendable through the intern workshop."
(translation by me)
https://www.gamestar.de/artikel/der-lange-weg-zu-arma-4-wie-geht-es-jetzt-mit-reforger-weiter,3381140.html

so what does this really mean? is the suggestion that there is no tanks for reforger in general, even after EA phase, a mistake by gamestar? was the response "at the moment" a bad attempt at negating that suggestion?
they need to clarify this. or i am missing other interviews where they answered this. i've watched their streams and read what i got my fingers on but haven't come across more yet.

maybe someone can jump on their discord or forum and ask them to clarify because what i have here is conflicting with each other.
"updates during EA" and "for the duration of the EA no (large) content expansions planned".
do we get a "little" content expansion with tracked vehicles then as promised in the FAQ?
i don't like this level of vagueness on the actual content, i'm too old for kinder surprise eggs.

Well the problem is that the response is a flat "No", not a "Maybe" or a "We're working on it", just plain denial of it. I know you might say that doesn't mean much, but remember, in an interview where you're trying to sell your game's main features, why would you UNDERSELL its coming features. Maybe for stuff that's way out there like I dunno grappling, or fully destructive environments they could say "not right now", but tanks? Considering how core tanks are to the gameplay of the Arma series, especially since one of the main drives for Flashpoint was combined arms warfare since no other game did that properly at the time, it's insane how the BI dev responded with a "No", so that alone should be a red flag.

And when they say "For the duration of the Alpha" does that mean it will be developed past the Alpha? When is the product 'done' then if it lacks core features like combined arms? I don't know if BI has amnesia but their infantry only version of Arma 3, Argo, flopped super hard, so while they can focus on the infantry and serverside stuff for right now, it better have full tanks, helis etc by the time it's out of Alpha. And the other thing is I'm fine with it not having tanks right now, heck I played the Arma 3 beta when the only vehicle was the ifrit, but if BI is already giving firm denial of tanks in the future I'm worried.

[Biggus Dickus]

Originally posted by tomofren:

i don't agree that it's a "flat no" from BI, instead it's a lack of fully denying gamestar making this claim.
it can be read as him relativizing it, but if that was his intention he should have stated clearly that this statement "no tanks for reforger fullstop" is in that form wrong.
i'm more on your sides interpretation of BI acknowledging what gamestar said and deliberately generalizing in response to not address them really not adding tanks. but i can see how you could interpret it differently, i just don't see why you'd give them the benefit of a doubt in that situation.
what i'd want from them is clarification.

Yeah but why not come out and clarify that's not what the dev meant with all the backlash from the community over the response? Plus lack of confirmation/denial and instead dodging around the issue is fishy in its own right, besides 'no further expansions of vehicles' seems pretty definite at least until past the Alpha stage, which is up in the air itself.

[-OrLoK- Слава Україн]

it's not worth confirming or denying really.

imho and experience, don't expect tanks.

simple as that.

but also, never say never. if they come then it's all groovy and we get to play with fun new stuff.

bonus!

if they state, "no ranks" then implement them a vocal subsection of the community will grab hold of the fact and will weaponise it anyway they possibly can just because. Doubly so the other way round. *shudder*

the best policy is to officially say nothing until they're close to going "gold" with a mechanic/addition etc.

obviously this is all my pov and not a confirmation of any BI policy.

yes, to us it would be nice to have a confirmation as we humans like binary results but this isn't about us.

[jbonesmd]

Originally posted by Many-Named:

I am very surprised that there won't be any tanks considering this is a Cold War era game in an european setting. What is the rationale do you think behind it?

Ty

I just watched an interview with the Bohemia guys behind Reforger on PC Gamer and they never said anything about the game being limited as far as future assets and what would be available. They did however make it VERY clear that the platform is basically brand new and they are limited at the moment to what you see in there currently. Reforger is in it's infancy right now. Try giving the game some time to grow and expand a little before being critical about where things stand at the moment. BTW, there's a major war going on really close by and they probably are a little more concerned about even being ABLE to produce a game with the current situation. And who could blame them?

[BRAN]

No tanks without working 3D interior, that is fine with me. I am sick of uboat style 2D periscopes. Not in a sim.

[-OrLoK- Слава Україн]

but it's *not* an Arma game.

to think of it as such will lead to frustration.