Liked the game, shame they use AI-generated images

[Rhudda]

I played one campaign as the dwarfs, then decided I wanted to play ratkin. Went to the store page to see what they get and found a notice that the devs use AI to generate images.

AI art is trained on existing art, often without asking for content.
AI uses huge amounts of water and energy, so is terrible for the environment.

For these reasons I'm sad to say that I cannot endorse this game, even though I liked it a lot. Won't even be playing more of the free version.

[CWOgarrison]

I think people are jumping the gun on the AI hate here. Sure there are programs and companies that have "stolen" art to train. Do we know which one was used for this game?
Do we know if that AI has a history of "stealing" content?
Has any creator made any claims against that AI or this game?

i will say i am surprised that the AI used has not been named, or if it has its not somewhere obvious.

[Daergar]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Jonlissla:

Never thought I'd see so many people willing to defend AI art, that's a bad sign of the future to come. Hopefully the dev team will be able to scrounge up a artist to give the game a distinct style.

The dev team? The lone guy providing a free game? You're just a clueless little fella jumping on the bandwagon, arent't ya? Adorable.

[76561199100143607]

I don't really get these AI art complaints. Everything is built on what others have done before. The game uses Unity as the game engine, Per (the dev) did not pay someone to develop a new game engine for this. Why is no-one complaining about that? He also uses the Steam, and did not hire someone to build a plattform to distribute the game. Why is no-one complaining about that? Both Steam and Unity are based on previous people ideas and concepts, and they have not payed for those ideas to those before them.
Everything builds on things people have been doing earlier, and very seldom anyone is payed for that. Why is AI art different from that?

[Darkfine]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Daergar:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Jonlissla:

Never thought I'd see so many people willing to defend AI art, that's a bad sign of the future to come. Hopefully the dev team will be able to scrounge up a artist to give the game a distinct style.

The dev team? The lone guy providing a free game? You're just a clueless little fella jumping on the bandwagon, arent't ya? Adorable.

Why does that matter? It is one guy doing questionable things instead of a group?

The use of AI art for anything greater than prototyping and frameworks for the efforts of actual people is, well tragic really. If it becomes okay to use AI art for everything then the entire discipline will disappear. Not super excited about the prospect of living in an AI generated world myself.

If the DLC were free then you'd have a great point and I'm pretty sure no one would be saying anything but dude is charging money for work he didn't do.

[Seanography]

Offt thanks for the heads up, I was thinking of dropping some cash on this, just put the difference of detail down to hero vs normal units but after seeing the inconsistent art style with other hero units its pretty obvious AI.

Saw some folks pulling the 'poor indie dev' can't afford to hire artists, that's a pity. Never stopped other Devs like Dwarf Fortress or Rimworld making due with what they could do.

If you don't care about AI art in games then that's fine, enjoy your slop.

[i_kill_pikachus]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Seanography:

Offt thanks for the heads up, I was thinking of dropping some cash on this, just put the difference of detail down to hero vs normal units but after seeing the inconsistent art style with other hero units its pretty obvious AI.

Saw some folks pulling the 'poor indie dev' can't afford to hire artists, that's a pity. Never stopped other Devs like Dwarf Fortress or Rimworld making due with what they could do.

If you don't care about AI art in games then that's fine, enjoy your slop.

"I thought the art was fine, and then someone said 'AI', and then I saw that the art was slop."

It's fascinating that you would so freely admit that you don't make your own decisions or think for yourself.

[i_kill_pikachus]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Darkfine:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von i_kill_pikachus:

You're not an artist and no one will ever pay you. I know you think you're virtuous and just oh-so-talented, but you're not. You're no one and nothing.

ugh, Unfortunately I have loads of free time, but I was a commission painter for years as it happens. I was hurt on the day job so badly that am physically unable to do that particular side hustle anymore and have spent the last while trying to learning digital art and cad. Even if none of that were true though, I still wouldn't want people cut out of the way they earn a living because of theft.

While your assertion that I am nothing and no one isn't far off the mark (I am a dad) I don't really see how that should make my measure of ethics any less relevant. Seems like a dangerous game to allow only successful people to dictate what we should and shouldn't keep as reasonable ethical standards.

Uh huh. Exactly as predicted. A failed would-be self-appointed "artist" convinced that AI is out to get him and he totally isn't just a loser. No, you just suck.

[Bladeheart]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Seanography:

If you don't care about AI art in games then that's fine, enjoy your slop.

Thank you, we will. Bye

[CrazyC]

"AI uses large amounts of water and energy" Well buddy I hate to break it to you but you should probably get off the internet for the rest of eternity if thats a deal breaker for you because everything online, google for instance, is way worse than some indie studio using an AI image. Also its always the talentless "artists" who could never compete that cry about AI art. People who have the skills to pay the bills will always find a way to earn a living.

[StepBattleBrother]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von i_kill_pikachus:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Darkfine:

Why does that matter? It is one guy doing questionable things instead of a group?

The use of AI art for anything greater than prototyping and frameworks for the efforts of actual people is, well tragic really. If it becomes okay to use AI art for everything then the entire discipline will disappear. Not super excited about the prospect of living in an AI generated world myself.

If the DLC were free then you'd have a great point and I'm pretty sure no one would be saying anything but dude is charging money for work he didn't do.

You're not an artist and no one will ever pay you. I know you think you're virtuous and just oh-so-talented, but you're not. You're no one and nothing.

Damn dude. Please go see a psychologist, because the projection is off the charts here. It's okay. You matter.

[Quasibobo]

Generally speaking using resources is not a bad thing, you know that right?

[Seanography]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von i_kill_pikachus:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Seanography:

Snip

Amazing how you were able to read what I wrote then decided to completely make up something else to fit your arguement. Then again you've been banned which is hardly surprising.

My comment on the arts quality was that it was inconsistent from the 30 mins I have played, after looking up all of character cards; my opinion is that each one by itself is passable but together pretty terrible as there's no art direction.

My issue with AI art is never the quality of what it produces, its the fact that other peoples hard work has been fed into the machine without their consent & is now being used to put working artists out of work in parts of the industry.

Know there'll be some people in this thread that won't care that its happening & I sincerely hope you end up on the receiving end one day so you can learn empathy the hard way.

[♔ Affable 7th Wave Teaboo ♔]

Stop focusing on image scraping. This is a proliferation of tech that is designed to collect all kinds of data on industrial scale without needing anyone's permission.

You are insane if you think that's not a problem and that it will not impact you.

[Alhazred]

It's funny how people are hella defensive around this topic. "Whining this, whining that", almost feels like AI art is very difficult to actually defend with actual arguments.

Thumbs up to everyone who actually contributes to the discussion.

[Yancke]

The concerns are around ai art aren't about how "it's just sensible", "devs cant afford", itsjust "a one day project". Of course stolen goods are more efficient to use than stuff you paid for. DUH. That's why ppl used to own ppl. Its about the ethics of it and how it exploits legal grey areas due to the technology's newness. TLDR it rips ppl off, dont use it.