Stage quality

[Jontk]

i m a great fan of dr2 and loved every bit of it. honestly seeing the last gameplays the stage design and the graphic itself seems all kind of flat. i mean it seems they made the tarmac section, snow section, dirt section and then it s mostly procedural generated. do you have same feeling?

[James]

Originally posted by Tripokaridos1980:

snip

The handcraft that went into the stages are focused on delivering "similar feel". If there is a 1:1 replication on (even) one stage, I would like to kow about it. The only serious attempt to replication is done in RBR by using GIS-data and local knowledge. Unfortunately, this is not what we see in EA WRC 2023. But, it can be fun nonetheless, especially for thumb-driving.

At least in DR2, the "feel" did/do deliver quality stages at many locations without feeling "Disneyland". Actually, DR2 is fantastic, especially in VR.

I hope to be pleasantly surprised by the undulations/road surface once the VR is released.

[stburr91]

Originally posted by James:

No, no, no, the stages are far from "laser-scanned", lol. Just looking at the videos from Finland stages - it suggest a Disneyworld interpretation of Scandinavia, lol.

All gravel roads/stages (irl) in Finland (and Sweden) comes with a road bank, elevated from the surrounding ground surface meaning a ditch on each side - like RBR or partly like in DR2. Slapping a road texture onto a flat topography is simply poor research and a cheap shortcut. It looks horrible and will never count as a Nordic stage.

I hope I have seen only the worst parts of Finland in the preview videos. DR2 is a lot better in those terms at current knowledge 😁.

That's a good point, there are a lot fewer ditches on the side of the roads in this game compared to DR2. I guess that's to make the game easier for casual players.

Originally posted by Tripokaridos1980:

I thought that these stages are the most true to life stages ... thats what devs said , and thats what beta testers said ... some are 1to1 and some other tracks very close to real.
When i play Greek stages i can say for sure because i know most of them.

Yes, be sure to let us know if you think the Greek stages are a good representations of the real roads.

[James]

If you are looking for real-to-life stages, RBR is the best there is.
The DR2 and now EA WRC 2023 is just a proxy simulation in terms of stages.

Really sad to see the stages in "Finland" being nothing like the real thing. Reminds me of Outrun on the Amiga 30 years ago...

[Socks with jandals]

Originally posted by James:

No, no, no, the stages are far from "laser-scanned", lol. Just looking at the videos from Finland stages - it suggest a Disneyworld interpretation of Scandinavia, lol.

All gravel roads/stages (irl) in Finland (and Sweden) comes with a road bank, elevated from the surrounding ground surface meaning a ditch on each side - like RBR or partly like in DR2. Slapping a road texture onto a flat topography is simply poor research and a cheap shortcut. It looks horrible and will never count as a Nordic stage.

I hope I have seen only the worst parts of Finland in the preview videos. DR2 is a lot better in those terms at current knowledge 😁.

Oh wow, that s definitely what it looks like to me too. All the locations are just flat with a road texture and objects scattered around in the distance. There are very little objects or undulations/bumps, camber, reverse camber, rocks, etc. Roads are not lat, they are rounded so water drains off them. And then where does that water drain to? That's right, the ditches on either side. This is stuff that dr2 got right. We need roads that are not just boring and flat, we need roads with ditches

[Slate]

Some of the stages are 1:1, most are slightly altered however according to the SCD. I'm more curious about the updated stage degradation they discuss. Makes it easier to find your lines.

https://youtu.be/8FGmWTeGR7A

DR2 stages were decent but too short imo. Codemasters new WRC stages are on average twice the length of DR2 stages and even some are 30km long.

[Mattmattmatt]

Stage degradation was just an adjustment on the grip parameter.

[stburr91]

Originally posted by Mattmattmatt:

Stage degradation was just an adjustment on the grip parameter.

That's not the case with the new game, the stage develops ruts in the racing line.

[AndreyKa]

DR2 stages flat, ugly, not interesting, hope WRC stages will be better

[Mattmattmatt]

Originally posted by stburr91:

Originally posted by Mattmattmatt:

Stage degradation was just an adjustment on the grip parameter.

That's not the case with the new game, the stage develops ruts in the racing line.

Thought i saw a couple of videos saying grip/handling was the same even when the car is completely off track.

Im very sceptical on this aspect. Always have been. I still remember DR2 first came out and i saw ghosts cutting through some of the routes entirely not even attempting to stay on the track. Maybe i jumped to conclusions and those ghosts were hacking? But i was able to follow the ghosts through the same lines so... idk

It was a long time ago since i played it already.

[Atavachron]

Originally posted by Mattmattmatt:

Originally posted by stburr91:

That's not the case with the new game, the stage develops ruts in the racing line.

Thought i saw a couple of videos saying grip/handling was the same even when the car is completely off track.

Im very sceptical on this aspect. Always have been. I still remember DR2 first came out and i saw ghosts cutting through some of the routes entirely not even attempting to stay on the track. Maybe i jumped to conclusions and those ghosts were hacking? But i was able to follow the ghosts through the same lines so... idk

It was a long time ago since i played it already.

Do you see any ghost right now, somewhere ?

[stburr91]

Originally posted by AndreyKa:

DR2 stages flat, ugly, not interesting, hope WRC stages will be better:barricade::setup::haystack::haystack:

Unfortunately, most of the stages, the roads are very flat, and not all that interesting.

I saw someone driving a stage from Croatia, the roads were flat, perfectly smooth, no jumps over crests, and no cuts anywhere, it was a big disappointment.

[borororo]

I don't really understand what the argument is about. This is an official WRC game. And it finally has real special stages. The fact that they are flat, etc. - it's not the fault of the game developers, it's the fault of the countries where the stages are held. They have to dig up the roads, pile earth, dig holes to keep you satisfied. Don't forget that rally is not a suicide race, it's a sport of speed, not who will stay alive.
Most of the special stages in the latest versions of KT's WRC have been fictionalized, and personally I'm not happy with that.

[Paradox1126]

Originally posted by borororo:

I don't really understand what the argument is about. This is an official WRC game. And it finally has real special stages. The fact that they are flat, etc. - it's not the fault of the game developers, it's the fault of the countries where the stages are held. They have to dig up the roads, pile earth, dig holes to keep you satisfied. Don't forget that rally is not a suicide race, it's a sport of speed, not who will stay alive.
Most of the special stages in the latest versions of KT's WRC have been fictionalized, and personally I'm not happy with that.

one of the draws to when i got into dr2 was that they were real stages. i liked that, however they suck. when i played KT's games i realized real quick how much more engaging they were. for a rally game i would rather have fictional stages that were expertly crafted to make the game challenging and fun opposed to boring stages with little to no technical diversity

[stburr91]

Originally posted by borororo:

I don't really understand what the argument is about. This is an official WRC game. And it finally has real special stages. The fact that they are flat, etc. - it's not the fault of the game developers, it's the fault of the countries where the stages are held. They have to dig up the roads, pile earth, dig holes to keep you satisfied. Don't forget that rally is not a suicide race, it's a sport of speed, not who will stay alive.
Most of the special stages in the latest versions of KT's WRC have been fictionalized, and personally I'm not happy with that.

The problem is some of the stages aren't real, they are recreations of the real stages using data from other roads. Also, some of the stages are flatter, and smoother than the real stages, and lack many of the road details the real stages have.

Lastly, almost all of the people that will play the game wouldn't know if they were driving a real stage, or a fictionalized one, they just aren't familiar enough with the real stages to know the difference.

[borororo]

Originally posted by stburr91:

Lastly, almost all of the people that will play the game wouldn't know if they were driving a real stage, or a fictionalized one, they just aren't familiar enough with the real stages to know the difference.

I think if they want to know, they will know :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tKxmqCr3rxI