Newbie game tips?

[Lampros]

I reckon it's a high time someone started this thread. Since I am a newbie myself, I have no tips of my own, but please fill in the blanks, folks! ;)

[eturulja]

I've shared a couple in various threads but I love this idea!

A couple for early game:
- Axes are high in damage but low in hit, so your allies with higher dodge can match up very well with them in the early game. I would keep your defenders away from axe users unless absolutely necessary as the fighters will usually have enough speed to double, and axes ignore % of DEF!
- Use shield bash!! It's not counterable by enemies, and the stagger status effect makes them lose 25 AVD and 25 HIT, so on their turn they are much less dangerous. This is especially good when you can't kill the enemy, you can instead just stagger them to increase the chances of surviving the attack on their turn. Remember the damage from the shield bash needs to go through their shield!
- Punch and kick aren't just useful for setting up combos/backstabs/flanks, they're also much higher accuracy than regular attacks. This is especially important early game for your fighters like Marcus since he is an axe user and they tend to have lower HIT. Use punch to finish enemies off when they are low for a much greater chance to hit!!

[Noules]

The most important high level advice I think is to control how many units you are engaging at any given time. This applies to almost any tactics game or anywhere you have the option of using maneuver to deal with the enemy piecemeal.

For this game specifically -
1. Some enemies rush towards you right off the bat, while others will remain in position until you enter their attack range. Unless there's some other pressure, consider waiting for the ones that are rushing towards you and dealing with those before 'waking up' the other units.
2. The stationary enemies will engage as soon as something enters their attack range. Many stationary enemies are 'linked', i.e. as soon as one of them start attacking, the others in that group will also begin rushing your units.

To deal with stationary enemies, whenever possible you will want to 'pull' one group at a time. Try to have at least one dodge tank (high agi, swords/round shields/whatever that increases avoidance) and one defense tank (high def, big shield) on your team. Find a spot that is just within the attack range of one or two units that are countered by that tank (low hit is countered by high avoidance, low damage is countered by high defense), and let them run to you.
3. If there are multiple groups rushing you, move towards the closest group. You want to fight a steady stream of enemies, just enough that you can defeat them in one turn, rather than engaging all of them at once.

Other notes -
- It's very important to have a few strong units for killing stuff over a bunch of mediocre ones. This is due to the counterattack mechanic; every time you swing at an enemy, unless you have something to turn off counterattack (e.g. backstab) you are simply giving the enemy another attack of their own.
- One of the simplest ways to turn off counterattack is to use a ranged weapon. Bows can make mediocre units still useful. When in doubt, bring more ranged.
- 2hd swords and polearms can hit a second target with their attack. Only the primary target can counterattack. This is another fairly common way to turn off counterattack.

[roogun]

about forging:

at the beginning, don't invest in +1 DMG or +1 HIT with iron/steel weapons. You will find special/better weapons in the chapters which are more worth to upgrade than the shop weapons. And money is scarce!

it's better to invest in Refinements. These can be forged in weapons without cost AND the can be removed as well. So it's possible to switch refinements from one weapon to another.


Archer:
I can really recomment this setup wiht Abigail (archer):
EDIT: Steel Bow +3 DMG (exception to my forging advice)
+ enduring refinement (damage based on END instead of STR)
+ sharp refinement (+3 DMG), later hero refinement (+1 attack)
Equip her with the Endurance Ring

[HangarPilot]

*First-strike weapons ... well ... strike first. Position your spear/polearm characters strategically and they will get an "attack of opportunity" when someone comes into the ZoC (unless that character also has a first-strike weapon). It's also worth keeping this in mind for how combat will play out ... attacking WITH a first-strike weapon means you can kill them before they can counter. Striking AGAINST a first-strike weapon means they will get to go first and you'll take damage even if you're able to kill them (unless you attack from behind).

*Kick the enemy to a different terrain tile (out of a bush, onto some rocks) to hurt their stats.

*Let the enemy come to you when possible. Okay, I stole this. The dev stated elsewhere and @Noules touched on it too ... but whenever possible you want the enemy to come to you. Letting them walk into your ZoC gets them whacked by your spears. Secondly, you're stationary so you've got support (healers, people covering your flanks, etc.) Rushing up to them is a good way to get flanked. And as the dev pointed out ... they get a chance to counter your attack PLUS attack you again when it becomes their turn. Ouch!

EDIT: One more ... LOOK at the enemy weapons. See that 2H sword? See that polearm? Don't "bunch up" so they can use their weapon on multiple targets. Either stagger your crew or set up a ZoC to keep them from getting a good position on you!

[Lampros]

Originally posted by eturulja:

I've shared a couple in various threads but I love this idea!

A couple for early game:
- Axes are high in damage but low in hit, so your allies with higher dodge can match up very well with them in the early game. I would keep your defenders away from axe users unless absolutely necessary as the fighters will usually have enough speed to double, and axes ignore % of DEF!
- Use shield bash!! It's not counterable by enemies, and the stagger status effect makes them lose 25 AVD and 25 HIT, so on their turn they are much less dangerous. This is especially good when you can't kill the enemy, you can instead just stagger them to increase the chances of surviving the attack on their turn. Remember the damage from the shield bash needs to go through their shield!
- Punch and kick aren't just useful for setting up combos/backstabs/flanks, they're also much higher accuracy than regular attacks. This is especially important early game for your fighters like Marcus since he is an axe user and they tend to have lower HIT. Use punch to finish enemies off when they are low for a much greater chance to hit!!

Thank you so much - a lot of these were not intuitive for my small brains, so you saved me a lot of early grief! ;)

By the way, what makes a character hit twice a turn? You mentioned speed, so I guess more speed than the target? But by how much?

Originally posted by Noules:

The most important high level advice I think is to control how many units you are engaging at any given time. This applies to almost any tactics game or anywhere you have the option of using maneuver to deal with the enemy piecemeal.

For this game specifically -
1. Some enemies rush towards you right off the bat, while others will remain in position until you enter their attack range. Unless there's some other pressure, consider waiting for the ones that are rushing towards you and dealing with those before 'waking up' the other units.
2. The stationary enemies will engage as soon as something enters their attack range. Many stationary enemies are 'linked', i.e. as soon as one of them start attacking, the others in that group will also begin rushing your units.

To deal with stationary enemies, whenever possible you will want to 'pull' one group at a time. Try to have at least one dodge tank (high agi, swords/round shields/whatever that increases avoidance) and one defense tank (high def, big shield) on your team. Find a spot that is just within the attack range of one or two units that are countered by that tank (low hit is countered by high avoidance, low damage is countered by high defense), and let them run to you.
3. If there are multiple groups rushing you, move towards the closest group. You want to fight a steady stream of enemies, just enough that you can defeat them in one turn, rather than engaging all of them at once.

Thanks! So perhaps the archer upgrade with the hamstring-like shot would be useful as well?

Originally posted by Noules:

Other notes -
- It's very important to have a few strong units for killing stuff over a bunch of mediocre ones. This is due to the counterattack mechanic; every time you swing at an enemy, unless you have something to turn off counterattack (e.g. backstab) you are simply giving the enemy another attack of their own.
- One of the simplest ways to turn off counterattack is to use a ranged weapon. Bows can make mediocre units still useful. When in doubt, bring more ranged.
- 2hd swords and polearms can hit a second target with their attack. Only the primary target can counterattack. This is another fairly common way to turn off counterattack.

Thanks for these as well. So having a few "carry" characters are essential. Are there any XP grinding spots? I noticed that you can grind infinitely in the last training map, if you just leave the archer alive. But it's so boring!

Originally posted by roogun:

about forging:

at the beginning, don't invest in +1 DMG or +1 HIT with iron/steel weapons. You will find special/better weapons in the chapters which are more worth to upgrade than the shop weapons. And money is scarce!

it's better to invest in Refinements. These can be forged in weapons without cost AND the can be removed as well. So it's possible to switch refinements from one weapon to another.

Archer:
I can really recomment this setup wiht Abigail (archer):
Iron Bow +3 DMG (exception to my forging advice)
+ enduring refinement (damage based on END instead of STR)
+ sharp refinement (+3 DMG), later hero refinement (+1 attack)
Equip her with the Endurance Ring

Thank you! Refinements being re-usable is indeed game-changing. I was afraid to buy them due to the cost, but I guess no worries!

Regarding Abigail: Why Iron Bow? Isn't Steel Bow better and accessible early? And where do you find the Endurance Ring?

Also, other build advice? ;)

Originally posted by HangarPilot:

*First-strike weapons ... well ... strike first. Position your spear/polearm characters strategically and they will get an "attack of opportunity" when someone comes into the ZoC (unless that character also has a first-strike weapon). It's also worth keeping this in mind for how combat will play out ... attacking WITH a first-strike weapon means you can kill them before they can counter. Striking AGAINST a first-strike weapon means they will get to go first and you'll take damage even if you're able to kill them (unless you attack from behind).

*Kick the enemy to a different terrain tile (out of a bush, onto some rocks) to hurt their stats.

*Let the enemy come to you when possible. Okay, I stole this. The dev stated elsewhere and @Noules touched on it too ... but whenever possible you want the enemy to come to you. Letting them walk into your ZoC gets them whacked by your spears. Secondly, you're stationary so you've got support (healers, people covering your flanks, etc.) Rushing up to them is a good way to get flanked. And as the dev pointed out ... they get a chance to counter your attack PLUS attack you again when it becomes their turn. Ouch!

EDIT: One more ... LOOK at the enemy weapons. See that 2H sword? See that polearm? Don't "bunch up" so they can use their weapon on multiple targets. Either stagger your crew or set up a ZoC to keep them from getting a good position on you!

Yeah, I nearly got killed the first few maps by rushing into reach weapons! Thanks much!

[roogun]

Ouch. I meant Steel Bow, of course

[Lampros]

Originally posted by roogun:

Ouch. I meant Steel Bow, of course

Ah! ;)

[Lampros]

Originally posted by roogun:

Ouch. I meant Steel Bow, of course

By the way, what's the best class upgrade for the archer?

[roogun]

depends on your playstyle, but for Abigail I would say Archer - Longbowman - Sniper

[Lampros]

Originally posted by roogun:

depends on your playstyle, but for Abigail I would say Archer - Longbowman - Sniper

Thanks!

[Noules]

- If one combatant has 4 or more speed than the other, they will attack twice (often referred to as 'doubling').
- Hunter with the root is potentially pretty good, but it's still a secondary resort; killing the enemy is obviously better. It only works on one unit and it can get removed by things that remove debuffs (specifically, fortified). Most enemies should die in 1-2 attacks if you are hitting them with the right attackers, so spending the attack to root the enemy is rarely worth the cost. When it's useful it can literally be lifesaving though.
- There are a fair number of maps where you can stall and beat on a stationary defender with lots of shield. That said, I didn't find grinding that necessary in this game. I did some about halfway through (around stage 10) but overall just the natural xp gain was sufficient. What I really mean though is you want to concentrate your gear on a few people, rather than trying to make everyone equally viable. The xp part comes pretty naturally since your killy folks will tend to get the most kills anyway.

[Lampros]

Originally posted by Noules:

- If one combatant has 4 or more speed than the other, they will attack twice (often referred to as 'doubling').

Thanks!

Originally posted by Noules:

- Hunter with the root is potentially pretty good, but it's still a secondary resort; killing the enemy is obviously better. It only works on one unit and it can get removed by things that remove debuffs (specifically, fortified). Most enemies should die in 1-2 attacks if you are hitting them with the right attackers, so spending the attack to root the enemy is rarely worth the cost. When it's useful it can literally be lifesaving though.

Hmm, damn. Maybe I should re-start. This is why we need multiple saves!!! ;)

And what alternative advanced class would you suggest then?

Originally posted by Noules:

- There are a fair number of maps where you can stall and beat on a stationary defender with lots of shield. That said, I didn't find grinding that necessary in this game. I did some about halfway through (around stage 10) but overall just the natural xp gain was sufficient. What I really mean though is you want to concentrate your gear on a few people, rather than trying to make everyone equally viable. The xp part comes pretty naturally since your killy folks will tend to get the most kills anyway.

My healer was 20-plus after the last training map! ;) And the archer was 10-plus. It sure made subsequent map easy ;)

[Lampros]

Originally posted by Noules:

- If one combatant has 4 or more speed than the other, they will attack twice (often referred to as 'doubling').

By the way, how do you increase speed? Mousing over speed doesn't tell you what affects it.

[roogun]

Originally posted by Lampros:

Originally posted by Noules:

- If one combatant has 4 or more speed than the other, they will attack twice (often referred to as 'doubling').

By the way, how do you increase speed? Mousing over speed doesn't tell you what affects it.

AGL is the base stat

[Lampros]

Originally posted by roogun:

Originally posted by Lampros:

By the way, how do you increase speed? Mousing over speed doesn't tell you what affects it.

AGL is the base stat

Ah, okay. Thanks!