Why Exactly Were The Original Games Removed?

[AlphaZeroX96]

There was no need to delist the standalone games. It's Metro 2033 all over again. An original version of a game removed in favor of a remaster and/or version with many differences you can't turn off or do something about. In some cases, the original being delisted in favor of a inferior version. Why keep doing this? Just keep the original available for purchase or make it free. Have it stand alongside the new version. That's something Bethesda got right with Doom 3. Instead of removing the original, it's kept along with the BFG edition. The original Shadow Warrior got a redux version, but you can still get the classic version for free on Steam. Sega could have done the same thing with the original trilogy.

[Tanoomba]

They "could have", sure, but they didn't. Circumstances are different.
We can only speculate, but my guess is that because the originals hadn't been selling for years, Sega wanted to effectively replace them with Origins. After the time, effort and resources that went into developing and marketing Origins, if people would have been inspired to get the originals instead, then Sega would have been shooting themselves in the foot.

[Ness_and_Sonic]

Originally posted by Tanoomba:

We can only speculate, but my guess is that because the originals hadn't been selling for years, Sega wanted to effectively replace them with Origins. After the time, effort and resources that went into developing and marketing Origins, if people would have been inspired to get the originals instead, then Sega would have been shooting themselves in the foot.

Meanwhile Capcom's still got Devil May Cry 3 Special Edition and Devil May Cry 4 up along side the HD Collection and Devil May Cry 4 Special Edition. Wayforward has Shantae Half-Genie Hero still up along side the Ultimate Edition. Strangely enough, we've not heard anything about them staying on the store being bad for their counterpart. Some how, Sega's the one that seems paranoid about this kind of thing. Skunkape has the Original Sam & Max Save the World series available as a free download for those who bough the remastered version where they revised Bosco's voice and dialogue. Even Duke Nukem 3D World Tour is in the original format as Duke Nukem 3D Atomic Edition so it could be played in Eduke 32 aside from the latest batch of levels that were released in recent years not working properly. I'm kind of surprised Sega didn't add the Genesis/Mega Drive versions to the Steam libraries of everyone that bought Origins that didn't have them as a sign of good faith similar to how they gave everyone that bought Sonic Generations on Steam the Casino Nights DLC for free after a while if that's their reason for delisting them.

[Tanoomba]

Originally posted by Ness_and_Sonic:

Meanwhile

Like I said, circumstance are different.

[supermichael]

There was no need to remove the original games, seeing that the original games has functions that Sonic Origin doesn't have. For one thing the original has Steam Workshop and all the benefits of Sega Mega Drive and Genesis Classic extras.

Anyone that buys Sega Mega Drive and Genesis Classic now, it will be incomplete with a achievement that is impossible to get 100%.

If they don't want to sell the Sonic original games, why not include them to Sonic Origins? They are not losing anything by including the originals.

[Ness_and_Sonic]

Originally posted by Tanoomba:

Originally posted by Ness_and_Sonic:

Meanwhile

Like I said, circumstance are different.

Right, so want to clear up how it's different from Sam & Max Save the World (Season 1) and they chose to offer those versions for free with the game?

Originally posted by supermichael:

There was no need to remove the original games, seeing that the original games has functions that Sonic Origin doesn't have. For one thing the original has Steam Workshop and all the benefits of Sega Mega Drive and Genesis Classic extras.

Anyone that buys Sega Mega Drive and Genesis Classic now, it will be incomplete with a achievement that is impossible to get 100%.

If they don't want to sell the Sonic original games, why not include them to Sonic Origins? They are not losing anything by including the originals.

Ding! If they were adding those versions to the steam library of everyone that bought Origins that didn't have them, it would just be another reason to get Origins. You're also right that both versions have their own advantages and disadvantages.

[JustSomeLego]

Because if you STILL don't own copies of the original games then you probably never would've
Those games get rereleased so much that I'm convinced it's an actual law somewhere

To give a serious answer, probably because Origins is the definitive way to play these games, so having the old copies up is just redundant.
And Ness, before you chime in with "but shantae and dmc" all I have to say is, good for them. Those aren't Sega games. It's almost like publishers can differ in how they want to distribute their games or something.

[NBOX21]

Originally posted by JustSomeLego:

To give a serious answer, probably because Origins is the definitive way to play these games, so having the old copies up is just redundant.

If they really were the "definitive" versions like you say they are, then SEGA wouldn't be
de-listing the original versions to begin with as they would know everybody would be buying these versions instead despite being more expensive.

Originally posted by JustSomeLego:

before you chime in with "but shantae and dmc" all I have to say is, good for them. Those aren't Sega games. It's almost like publishers can differ in how they want to distribute their games or something.

I get what you're trying to say here, but we're talking about different publishers making decisions under very similar circumstances - that being they put out a new, remastered version of an older game, that already exists for dirt cheap on Steam. Hence why we can still criticise SEGA's decision making on this.

That said, I do think bringing up DMC is a flawed argument, but for a completely different reason. It's only DMC3 where the original is available to buy; the HD Collection comes with 1 and 2 which were never previously released on Steam, as well as 3 which was already on Steam. That collection is the only way for people to buy the first two games on Steam and costs as much as two games if DMC3 by itself is anything to go by.

[supermichael]

I want to correct something about Devil May Cry 3 Special Edition on Steam, that version is a bad port. Everything about it is bad, including the control button which is mapped wrong.

(Devil May Cry HD Collection Devil May Cry 3 Special Edition) version is superior than Devil May Cry 3 in every way possible.

Devil May Cry 4 Special Edition is superior compared to Devil May Cry 4 in every way possible.

[NBOX21]

One example I can think of where a similar situation was handled properly where the remaster and the original are able to co-exist alongside each other instead of the former replacing the latter is one of my favourite childhood classics available on Steam and GOG - RollerCoaster Tycoon.

Atari made the decision to charge more than the original games combined for the remastered version of the game labelled "Classic" and features all the maps from the original two games. However, I found it much more buggy and prone to crashing, as well as the user interface being outright garbage, like it was made for a smart phone or something. A lot of things I could do in the originals I can't do as easily or at all in the remaster and very well could've been an Origins situation in this case.

However; the original versions of those two games, despite being overall cheaper for both, are much more stable and having a far better UI, will always be available. And if players buy both versions, such as myself, that's more money for the publisher than if they were only able to buy one. Even in the worst case scenario, they may have to buy the games a second time to experience a better or more preferable version. In any case, customers have a choice.

Originally posted by supermichael:

I want to correct something about Devil May Cry 3 Special Edition on Steam, that version is a bad port. Everything about it is bad, including the control button which is mapped wrong.

So in this case, you may as well buy the HD Collection instead?
If what you're saying is true, then the original version of DMC3 must be pretty obsolete, then. So why hasn't that been de-listed?

[Ness_and_Sonic]

Originally posted by JustSomeLego:

And Ness, before you chime in with "but shantae and dmc" all I have to say is, good for them. Those aren't Sega games. It's almost like publishers can differ in how they want to distribute their games or something.

Not a good excuse. Sega's done free giveaways with their games before by automatically adding the Casino Nights Pinball DLC for Sonic Generations, so I can't think of a valid reason why it would be impossible for them to do the same the same for everyone that bought Sonic Origins, especially seeing as they showed it was possible for them able to give away one of those games when they delayed the Steam release of Sonic Mania for two weeks.

Edit: Also, are you using an alternate account, Tanoomba?

[supermichael]

Originally posted by supermichael:

I want to correct something about Devil May Cry 3 Special Edition on Steam, that version is a bad port. Everything about it is bad, including the control button which is mapped wrong.

Originally posted by NBOX21:

So in this case, you may as well buy the HD Collection instead?
If what you're saying is true, then the original version of DMC3 must be pretty obsolete, then. So why hasn't that been de-listed?

That is correct, it is better to buy the HD Collection instead of DMC 3 Special Edition. There are no advantages to to getting DMC 3 at all.

Same with Devil May Cry 4 Special Edition, it is better to get that game over Devil May Cry 4.

DMC 3 Special Edition and DMC 4 are obsolete. Plus people that buys or has DMC 4, they can't upgrade to DMC 4 Special Edition. They have to pay the full price to buy DMC 4 Special Edition.
It isn't like Sonic Origin, those who has it can upgrade for $10 to Plus version.

[Tanoomba]

Originally posted by Ness_and_Sonic:

Right, so want to clear up how it's different from Sam & Max Save the World (Season 1) and they chose to offer those versions for free with the game?

It's different because it's from a different publisher with a different marketing department who had a different approach with a different game at a different time for a different price aimed at a different audience for different reasons and different results.

Originally posted by Ness_and_Sonic:

Sega's done free giveaways with their games before by automatically adding the Casino Nights Pinball DLC for Sonic Generations, so I can't think of a valid reason why it would be impossible for them to do the same the same for everyone that bought Sonic Origins, especially seeing as they showed it was possible for them able to give away one of those games when they delayed the Steam release of Sonic Mania for two weeks.

"They gave us free stuff before, so I want free stuff NOW!"
But also:
"Don't you DARE use the word entitlement!"

[Tanoomba]

Originally posted by NBOX21:

If they really were the "definitive" versions like you say they are, then SEGA wouldn't be
de-listing the original versions to begin with

Non sequitur. You're assuming that the way you see it must be the way they see it. it doesn't work that way.

Originally posted by NBOX21:

I get what you're trying to say here, but we're talking about different publishers making decisions under very similar circumstances

Those "circumstances" being a select few superficial variables that you chose and have have assigned importance to, based on your subjective values, with no knowledge or acknowledgement of the many other variables at play (most of which we will never be privy to).

[JustSomeLego]

Originally posted by Ness_and_Sonic:

Originally posted by JustSomeLego:

And Ness, before you chime in with "but shantae and dmc" all I have to say is, good for them. Those aren't Sega games. It's almost like publishers can differ in how they want to distribute their games or something.

Not a good excuse. Sega's done free giveaways with their games before by automatically adding the Casino Nights Pinball DLC for Sonic Generations, so I can't think of a valid reason why it would be impossible for them to do the same the same for everyone that bought Sonic Origins, especially seeing as they showed it was possible for them able to give away one of those games when they delayed the Steam release of Sonic Mania for two weeks.

Edit: Also, are you using an alternate account, Tanoomba?

I don't really see how a free dlc that was made for a game (casino nights gens) is similar to origins' relation to the games its trying to upgrade.

Also no, I'm not Tanoomba.

[Ness_and_Sonic]

Originally posted by Tanoomba:

It's different because it's from a different publisher with a different marketing department who had a different approach with a different game at a different time for a different price aimed at a different audience for different reasons and different results.

"They gave us free stuff before, so I want free stuff NOW!"

And yet, all these companies doing it look better than Sega.

You said it yourself. They're the same games, so the only thing you'd be getting would emulator friendly versions of the same games and Steam Workshop support, which Sonic Origins lacks going for paying twice the price. If they don't want to compete with the older versions, then they can add them to the library of the people who got Origins, but don't already have those versions to give more people a reason to buy Origins. I don't see how it's any different than asking for them to do the same thing Skunkape did. Heck, it's probably easier on Sega than it was on Skunkape given that Sam & Max is a license, but Sonic is not.