Is it just me or does combat lack depth?

[WhiteWolf]

Asking an honest question. I was too young to get hyped into the BT series, but instead played it's sister games raging blast 1 and 2. especially 2.
if SZ supposed to be a sequal to BT and RB shouldn't we have more of the RB mechanics?
I'm noticing the combat is significantly watered down.
follow ups just send people flying to do damage rather than selected combo extension that let you cancel into a rush or a stomach stun, or even a reversal.
I understand the basic parry and block system which even then is watered down. in RB2 I liked having to time the light attack input into a smash counter if i read my opponent correctly. it added more to the game imo.

Supers are just beam and dash now instead of the plethora of differing attack types like input specials that let you stop the combo if you'd rather extend vs do more guarunteed damage. counters don't exist and even more oddball things like signature moves for each character to give the base movesets some flare. I can't even find ways to effectively cancel into other attacks/ combos that aren't the exact same for every character.
even sparking mode is just mash 1 button for a super long combo vs RB2 raging soul mechanic that is mostly identical except you need to learn differing combo extenions for each character to get the heavy damage maneuver off.

Were the tenkaichi games that bare bones or was RB2 more deep in the combat by comparison. I love the game visually, but after beating half of the story mode roster and playing a few hours online i'm starting to feel buyers remorse.

is it just me not playing the game right?

[TheHuskyGT]

The biggest problem with these games is when you get comfortable with a play style. You find yourself repeating the same pattern that works and it will get boring really soon. The game is not super deep, but it gives you enough variations that you can play the game differently every time if you really get into the mechanics.

The game is a lot of fun once you memorize everything. However, it's still far from being the most complex fighter. It will get flat very quick.

[WhiteWolf]

Originally posted by TheHuskyGT:

The biggest problem with these games is when you get comfortable with a play style. You find yourself repeating the same pattern that works and it will get boring really soon. The game is not super deep, but it gives you enough variations that you can play the game differently every time if you really get into the mechanics.

The game is a lot of fun once you memorize everything. However, it's still far from being the most complex fighter. It will get flat very quick.

I feel you that we eventually optimize and it gets flat. I just expected it to be "more" for lack of a better term. across multiple modes every character feels the same with minor exceptions(android passive charge and giants) It got flat so quick and I'm out of the refund period, so I feel ripped off kind of. I expected the hype of budokai tenkaichi with Rb depth to the gameplay, just with more mechanics and a giant roster. it didn't have to be RB2 or XV2 clones. I just wanted layers to the combat. once you learn what parry counters what it got flat fast.
If i were to pinpoint what has me uneasy I think it's that every character plays dang near 100% identical. there are no unique combos for anyone so other than raw stats it's just a visual mask for 1 character.
I was hoping I was wrong and just completely missing something. you kind of confirmed I wasn't:(

[HaleTheFreeVoice]

Originally posted by WhiteWolf:

Asking an honest question. I was too young to get hyped into the BT series, but instead played it's sister games raging blast 1 and 2. especially 2.
if SZ supposed to be a sequal to BT and RB shouldn't we have more of the RB mechanics?
I'm noticing the combat is significantly watered down.
follow ups just send people flying to do damage rather than selected combo extension that let you cancel into a rush or a stomach stun, or even a reversal.
I understand the basic parry and block system which even then is watered down. in RB2 I liked having to time the light attack input into a smash counter if i read my opponent correctly. it added more to the game imo.

Supers are just beam and dash now instead of the plethora of differing attack types like input specials that let you stop the combo if you'd rather extend vs do more guarunteed damage. counters don't exist and even more oddball things like signature moves for each character to give the base movesets some flare. I can't even find ways to effectively cancel into other attacks/ combos that aren't the exact same for every character.
even sparking mode is just mash 1 button for a super long combo vs RB2 raging soul mechanic that is mostly identical except you need to learn differing combo extenions for each character to get the heavy damage maneuver off.

Were the tenkaichi games that bare bones or was RB2 more deep in the combat by comparison. I love the game visually, but after beating half of the story mode roster and playing a few hours online i'm starting to feel buyers remorse.

is it just me not playing the game right?

it completely lacks depth because all you need to do is master one rush combo thats unblockable and you win the fight easily its so dumb

[ｃｏｏｌｄｏｗｎ]

RB is not considered in the same series, it's why this game doesn't have things from those games.
The combo system is just not the same between the two. I never really liked how it worked in rb2, it just felt very clunky to use. If you really want to, combo videos are already everywhere for this game.

[The22nd]

Im sure it wasn't intentional, but Tenkaichi was all about movement. They tried to make movement more fluid and natural in SZ, and botched it, which made offense weaker in the process.

At some point, they increased the game speed to make it look appealing to casuals who mash.

[Buster]

Lol the BT people it's pretty clear this is built off RB2 then went another direction with the combat, even the assault system is still here if you want to use it.

As for the name Why isn't called BT4 then? Its because it had the same licencing issues RB1 and 2 did with the name. Atari fragments still somehow hold the rights to it. Do you think they would of named Raging Blast, Raging Blast if they could of kept using the name? No they would of named it BT4.

[ｃｏｏｌｄｏｗｎ]

Originally posted by Buster:

Lol the BT people it's pretty clear this is built off RB2 then went another direction with the combat, even the assault system is still here if you want to use it.

As for the name Why isn't called BT4 then? Its because it had the same licencing issues RB1 and 2 did with the name. Atari fragments still somehow hold the rights to it. Do you think they would of named Raging Blast, Raging Blast if they could of kept using the name? No they would of named it BT4.

It was always called Sparking in Japan. It was only called BT outside for advertising purposes, to piggyback off of the Budokai games. We just have parity between regions now.

[SuperCrumpets]

SZ has infinitely more depth than raging blast RB was always just a mindless button masher with fake depth

BT3 had more deep movement though

[Pachislot Rockman Ability]

The combat is deceptively deep but none of that comes through when fighting the AI because a lot of the depth comes via resource management and using the melee combat to get more resources. The single player teaches you to stop trying to play the game and go into sparking every few seconds, do a 20 hit combo and then your ultimate, repeat. Because trying to do anything else will make you spend 15 seconds in a combo because the AI can perfectly counter every defensive option you have against their melee game by reading your inputs. (unless you have explosive wave or a similar skill but that's character-dependant)

[WhiteWolf]

Originally posted by Pachislot Rockman Ability:

The combat is deceptively deep but none of that comes through when fighting the AI because a lot of the depth comes via resource management and using the melee combat to get more resources. The single player teaches you to stop trying to play the game and go into sparking every few seconds, do a 20 hit combo and then your ultimate, repeat. Because trying to do anything else will make you spend 15 seconds in a combo because the AI can perfectly counter every defensive option you have against their melee game by reading your inputs. (unless you have explosive wave or a similar skill but that's character-dependant)

I'll give the game another chance with this mindset. Most of my time was in pve mastering ths parry system because what you said was 100% true with the ai. Could you maybe help me with one other issue a friend and I discovered last night playing together. We noticed the ai can melee counter when you spin them around and attack from behind. Neither of us could get the parry to work unless we were front facing. Is that a bug or just something we couldn't find in the tutorials?

[Circe!]

Originally posted by WhiteWolf:

Originally posted by Pachislot Rockman Ability:

The combat is deceptively deep but none of that comes through when fighting the AI because a lot of the depth comes via resource management and using the melee combat to get more resources. The single player teaches you to stop trying to play the game and go into sparking every few seconds, do a 20 hit combo and then your ultimate, repeat. Because trying to do anything else will make you spend 15 seconds in a combo because the AI can perfectly counter every defensive option you have against their melee game by reading your inputs. (unless you have explosive wave or a similar skill but that's character-dependant)

I'll give the game another chance with this mindset. Most of my time was in pve mastering ths parry system because what you said was 100% true with the ai. Could you maybe help me with one other issue a friend and I discovered last night playing together. We noticed the ai can melee counter when you spin them around and attack from behind. Neither of us could get the parry to work unless we were front facing. Is that a bug or just something we couldn't find in the tutorials?

You can do Super Counters even while backwards! It's only Revenge Counters that it turns off. It's just a matter of staying calm and trying to time it.

[rawf]

Originally posted by WhiteWolf:

Asking an honest question. I was too young to get hyped into the BT series, but instead played it's sister games raging blast 1 and 2. especially 2.
if SZ supposed to be a sequal to BT and RB shouldn't we have more of the RB mechanics?
I'm noticing the combat is significantly watered down.
follow ups just send people flying to do damage rather than selected combo extension that let you cancel into a rush or a stomach stun, or even a reversal.
I understand the basic parry and block system which even then is watered down. in RB2 I liked having to time the light attack input into a smash counter if i read my opponent correctly. it added more to the game imo.

Supers are just beam and dash now instead of the plethora of differing attack types like input specials that let you stop the combo if you'd rather extend vs do more guarunteed damage. counters don't exist and even more oddball things like signature moves for each character to give the base movesets some flare. I can't even find ways to effectively cancel into other attacks/ combos that aren't the exact same for every character.
even sparking mode is just mash 1 button for a super long combo vs RB2 raging soul mechanic that is mostly identical except you need to learn differing combo extenions for each character to get the heavy damage maneuver off.

Were the tenkaichi games that bare bones or was RB2 more deep in the combat by comparison. I love the game visually, but after beating half of the story mode roster and playing a few hours online i'm starting to feel buyers remorse.

is it just me not playing the game right?

I do feel the same about SZ. It's pretty dull after few hours of gameplay.
Every character plays nearly the same and the combos are no fun to learn as they are so limited.
Can agree on the AI statement tho. Spam sparking mode in story makes it even more boring...

[SetSubarashii]

Originally posted by WhiteWolf:

Asking an honest question. I was too young to get hyped into the BT series, but instead played it's sister games raging blast 1 and 2. especially 2.
if SZ supposed to be a sequal to BT and RB shouldn't we have more of the RB mechanics?
I'm noticing the combat is significantly watered down.
follow ups just send people flying to do damage rather than selected combo extension that let you cancel into a rush or a stomach stun, or even a reversal.
I understand the basic parry and block system which even then is watered down. in RB2 I liked having to time the light attack input into a smash counter if i read my opponent correctly. it added more to the game imo.

Supers are just beam and dash now instead of the plethora of differing attack types like input specials that let you stop the combo if you'd rather extend vs do more guarunteed damage. counters don't exist and even more oddball things like signature moves for each character to give the base movesets some flare. I can't even find ways to effectively cancel into other attacks/ combos that aren't the exact same for every character.
even sparking mode is just mash 1 button for a super long combo vs RB2 raging soul mechanic that is mostly identical except you need to learn differing combo extenions for each character to get the heavy damage maneuver off.

Were the tenkaichi games that bare bones or was RB2 more deep in the combat by comparison. I love the game visually, but after beating half of the story mode roster and playing a few hours online i'm starting to feel buyers remorse.

is it just me not playing the game right?

Just you, quit mashing square. Their are entire combo strings you can practice and utilize, you just have to put the time in and try. Mix them up with air combos and dash supers. Possibilities are endless that's why the word combo is there.