Pros say Tekken 8 is "...A Casino"

[SEATEK The_LEFTY]

"Tekken 8 is a casino" - An analysis of Arslan Ash and Kkokkoma's criticism


https://www.reddit.com/r/Tekken/comments/1boik9e/tekken_8_is_a_casino_an_analysis_of_arslan_ash/

[kiteless 凧無し]

People cry about everything

Just have fun with the game, don’t like it, play something else. No shortage of video games out there

Naysayers want to now pretend T7 was perfect because they don’t like the direction of T8. They need to remove those rose tinted glasses

[C1REX]

Originally posted by Sandy:

Originally posted by Hidebehind:

The saltiest player complaining? It's never happened before, and here it is again.
The things people come up with to justify losing their skills.
Tekken has always had a casino, and some fighters had a game plan based on the casino, but it took them so many years to realize it only now? Wow!

So the best gambler is the best tekken player?

You don’t get to the max rank by just a coin flip.

[Forza Piadina]

Originally posted by C1REX:

Originally posted by Sandy:

So the best gambler is the best tekken player?

You don’t get to the max rank by just a coin flip.

But you can't reach max rank by just learning the basics.

[C.C. 折オリ枝 の 夫]

Another thing that people seem to either fully forget or only mention in passing, is that ALL Tekken games were bonkers on their arcade release, but many people may not even had the chance to play that version and just played the console version, which had 1-2 years of balance patches already done prior to it's release.

For Tekken 8, we are currently in that "arcade version" period.

Tekken 6 from what I heard was hell, and just how you're now seeing Dragunov, Victor, Azucena and King because they're easy, in T6 you had Bob as the biggest issue in arcade version and as the most played, followed by Law and Steve, with Bob being the most common one because you didn't really need a lot of brains to play him.

For Tekken 7 we had what in the very early days? Dragunov, Xiaoyu, Kazumi and what? Oh wait, Dragunov and Xiaoyu, two characters who are complained about now and then new comers.

[Sandy]

Originally posted by C1REX:

Originally posted by Sandy:

So the best gambler is the best tekken player?

You don’t get to the max rank by just a coin flip.

Depends on your luck and skill of gambling.

[kiteless 凧無し]

Originally posted by C.C. スパークル:

Another thing that people seem to either fully forget or only mention in passing, is that ALL Tekken games were bonkers on their arcade release, but many people may not even had the chance to play that version and just played the console version, which had 1-2 years of balance patches already done prior to it's release.

For Tekken 8, we are currently in that "arcade version" period.

Tekken 6 from what I heard was hell, and just how you're now seeing Dragunov, Victor, Azucena and King because they're easy, in T6 you had Bob as the biggest issue in arcade version and as the most played, followed by Law and Steve, with Bob being the most common one because you didn't really need a lot of brains to play him.

For Tekken 7 we had what in the very early days? Dragunov, Xiaoyu, Kazumi and what? Oh wait, Dragunov and Xiaoyu, two characters who are complained about now and then new comers.

Despite all this T8 balance is still way better than SF6

There is nothing as egregious as SF6’s JP at launch in Tekken 8. Nothing remotely comes close

Everyone is viable in T8, a few slightly overtuned characters but nothing outright busted

T7 balance was worse, Akuma was literally in a tier of his own. Imagine wanting to play ‘Tekken’ and you spend the entire T7 life span having to deal with a busted street fighter character. Once again Arslan and co need to take off the rose tints.

[C.C. 折オリ枝 の 夫]

Originally posted by kiteless 凧無し:

Originally posted by C.C. スパークル:

Another thing that people seem to either fully forget or only mention in passing, is that ALL Tekken games were bonkers on their arcade release, but many people may not even had the chance to play that version and just played the console version, which had 1-2 years of balance patches already done prior to it's release.

For Tekken 8, we are currently in that "arcade version" period.

Tekken 6 from what I heard was hell, and just how you're now seeing Dragunov, Victor, Azucena and King because they're easy, in T6 you had Bob as the biggest issue in arcade version and as the most played, followed by Law and Steve, with Bob being the most common one because you didn't really need a lot of brains to play him.

For Tekken 7 we had what in the very early days? Dragunov, Xiaoyu, Kazumi and what? Oh wait, Dragunov and Xiaoyu, two characters who are complained about now and then new comers.

Despite all this T8 balance is still way better than SF6

There is nothing as egregious as SF6’s JP at launch in Tekken 8. Nothing remotely comes close

Everyone is viable in T8, a few slightly overtuned characters but nothing outright busted

T7 balance was worse, Akuma was literally in a tier of his own. Imagine wanting to play ‘Tekken’ and you spend the entire T7 life span having to deal with a busted street fighter character. Once again Arslan and co need to take off the rose tints. Adapt or apply for a real job

Yea, from what I heard, Tekken 8 is more balanced at launch than any previous Tekken at launch.

However, there are some things I do agree with the top players, mainly because they gave too many guard breaks and hellsweeps to characters, and now the heat crush, dashes and even engagers give you enough advantage to where a lot of characters get a hard 50-50 on you, and that alone can turn the game around by itself, which honestly, is indeed very fustrating.

[Spardacus]

The Heat system sux

[kiteless 凧無し]

Every Tekken has 50/50 gameplay

Every time you throw out an unsafe on block launcher or an unsafe counter hit looking for that big combo, you are playing the 50/50 game

Every fighting game is guess work heavy. Why all of a sudden are people talking like T8 is the first fighter with 50/50 guesswork when Tekken 7 was filled with it too, it’s really obnoxious and tone deaf

[C.C. 折オリ枝 の 夫]

Originally posted by kiteless 凧無し:

Every Tekken has 50/50 gameplay

Every time you throw out an unsafe on block launcher or an unsafe counter hit looking for that big combo, you are playing the 50/50 game

Every fighting game is guess work heavy. Why all of a sudden are people talking like T8 is the first fighter with 50/50 guesswork when Tekken 7 was filled with it too, it’s really obnoxious and tone deaf

That's not what I mean.

Lemme put it like this. Blocking a heat dash from Alisa has like no risk, I'm at minus frames, what's she gonna do? Poke me? But the same can't be said for other characters, Steve has a huge guard break that you have to guess or you eat a solid bunch of damage, the Mishimas 50-50 is a thing, Azucena is put in a huge 50-50 between her hellsweep and a mid launcher, etc.

Yes, all games had 50-50s, but the amount of situations where you're forced to simply guess mid-low is way over the top in Tekken 8 right now than it was in Tekken 7.

2D fighters are pretty much focused on guesswork because what are ya gonna do? React to that 3f jab jab?

The issue isn't that you have to guess, but that a lot of situations put you in a forced 50-50 situation where you are forced to guess and those situations can outright end the match on the spot if you guess wrong.

[=\[P]/=]

Originally posted by kiteless 凧無し:

Every Tekken has 50/50 gameplay

Every time you throw out an unsafe on block launcher or an unsafe counter hit looking for that big combo, you are playing the 50/50 game

Every fighting game is guess work heavy. Why all of a sudden are people talking like T8 is the first fighter with 50/50 guesswork when Tekken 7 was filled with it too, it’s really obnoxious and tone deaf

in Tekken7, there are many ways to prevent opponent from forcing 50/50 on you, make it setting up a 50/50 require some work

now, majority of characters can stun lock you and force you to play 50/50
or apply 50/50 just by doing easy string or pressing heat

and more than that, the defender has to work much much more than previous Tekken

[Forza Piadina]

Originally posted by =\P/=:

Originally posted by kiteless 凧無し:

Every Tekken has 50/50 gameplay

Every time you throw out an unsafe on block launcher or an unsafe counter hit looking for that big combo, you are playing the 50/50 game

Every fighting game is guess work heavy. Why all of a sudden are people talking like T8 is the first fighter with 50/50 guesswork when Tekken 7 was filled with it too, it’s really obnoxious and tone deaf

in Tekken7, there are many ways to prevent opponent from forcing 50/50 on you, make it setting up a 50/50 require some work

now, majority of characters can stun lock you and force you to play 50/50
or apply 50/50 just by doing easy string or pressing heat

and more than that, the defender has to work much much more than previous Tekken

Tekken 8 is more mixup oriented, tekken 7 was more counter game oriented, without heat most of the characters don't have any real or dangerous mixup and or counters. The solution has been given many times, developers need just to make heat bar not available from the beginning but filling it during the match, it's pretty straightforward and the rage arts make no sense to exist in this game at all.
Some characters have too much powerful moves during heat , the balancing of the game will probably will be a mess and it will require years to reach a decent state.
Tekken 7 was broken as well because some characters had a stupid back dash avoiding mixups most of the time, they wanted just to avoid that kind of situations.

[SEATEK The_LEFTY]

The issue is they made a "AGGRESSIVE" game.

A game so stacked towards offense and so aggressive in fact that Namco never realized the implications of removing defensive options it seems.

- that 50% of the time- the person being aggressive is also sometimes the person on defense as well.

You can't have a fighting game designed like this and not be polarizing.

[Necropants]

Originally posted by Lord Pendragon:

Originally posted by Cheez3:

I have no idea, never played sf6 before

Street fighter is a game with 4 frame jabs tekken is a game with 10frame jabs. Street fighter is mechanically faster then tekken but tekken is so aggro with all these plus frames and heat gauge nonsense SF6 players come in here and there like HOLD ON SLOW DOWN. And there moves on average come out 2x faster then ours.

When 2d guys come to your 3d game and say its way fast And said 2d game is mechanically 2x faster we have gone to crazy land.

It's cause in SF there are no lows basically everyone blocks low and looks for the overhead. Whats the fastest overhead in sf6? Also Throw techs are way simpler defensively Sf is way more straightforward so the fact it's mechanically faster is less of a factor.

[kiteless 凧無し]

There are defensive tools

Power crushes can shut down spam

You still have the low counter

Rage arts must be respected as they can easily punish people who want to press buttons 24/7

Activating your own heat can shut down your opponent’s aggression and force them to respect the heat smash that they could eat if their offence is sloppy and predictable

People talk as if the heat mechanic is pure offence, it’s not, it’s a great defensive tool also