Tacking

[jrboyett]

I have tried multiple times to get my boat to tack and I can never get enough momentum to carry the bow around to the new heading. Every time when the bow comes into the wind, the sails luff and the ship stops headed dead into the wind and wont carry on over. I have studied sailing for years and know the procedure for tacking and jibing but how do I get enough speed to complete the tack?

[Odoty]

Which boat are you in, and how much weight is in it?

[Cyroch]

To me it seems tacking has gotten a lot harder with recent patches. I recently returned after a long absence and I for sure have a hard time tacking (cog, default rigging, around 650 lbs cargo). My guess is that it has to do with the increased rudder drag, and I'm guessing luffing sails also received increased drag at some point.

My tacking maneuvers now mostly involve stopping in irons, fully reversing the rudder and using the slight reverse speed you get from the wind in your face to slowly reverse turn out of irons. Takes a while, isn't pretty but gets the job done...

[ling.speed]

Yeah it seems its mostly on luffing and rudder drag, also extensive rigging could add up (i think furled sails contribute to drag now too).

At first it was hard but the more i experiment the easier it is to tack. By trying to turn more with sails than tudder, then furling instead of luffing. And furling everything thats not contributing to the tack. It definitely takes more effort and planning now, including shipyard side planning.

Also as a tip dont reverse rudder immediately, let the ship accelerate backwards a bit.
On gaffs/lateens one can grab a sail (smaller boats only) and turn it by hand for easy pushback too.

[Cyroch]

Originally posted by ling.speed:

Also as a tip dont reverse rudder immediately, let the ship accelerate backwards a bit.
On gaffs/lateens one can grab a sail (smaller boats only) and turn it by hand for easy pushback too.

Sorry, I omitted that step, yes, that's what I do, stop in irons, wait for slight backward acceleration, reverse rudder.

Wait, can you actually grab a sail and turn by hand in the game? if so, that would make a huge difference for me, cause I had not figured that out. only ever using the winches...

[ling.speed]

Yup only small ones thou, gotta be close enough to the boom (square probably can be turned too, just too high, and rigging can turn them anyways)

Also on topic of grabbing things, its a bit wonky with sails but player pushes by default toward the facing camera from the point of grab. This applies also for pushing boat from pier, beached or swimming. This means one can grab a boat by the side and push it forward or backward by turning the camera.

[Jesus☮Superstar]

I completely agree, I encountered this problem on my stock junk, although I had never had such a problem before. the desire to play disappears.

[sailbad the sinner]

I've been doing 'chicken' tacks where I do a 270° jibe instead of a 90° tack. This is mostly with the Brig in high wind

[FreeQuest]

I just do wearing now on the big ships and a few of the small ones.

You can still tack the big ones but you really need the speed the strong wind and you cant lock the rudder but even then its a chance you wont make the turn.

[boris.glevrk]

Originally posted by Jesus☮Superstar:

I completely agree, I encountered this problem on my stock junk, although I had never had such a problem before. the desire to play disappears.

The junk (either one) should be the easiest ship to tack...
They have the highest turning rate and near-lowest drag.

Currently 3MJ and Sanbuq are both capable of tacking in all but weakest wind unless you square-rig them. Brig is less capable of doing this due to the higher drag.

[Raven_Gaming]

Looking at tacking from a historical point of view, it may be worth keeping in mind that (square rigged) ships often went backwards while the bow was pushed through the wind. This was done by using the sails. The rudder only helped with this.
The fore mast yards would be brought round to the new tack before turning the rudder. As the ship came round and pushed through the wind, the ship may be brought to a stop and even reversed. Then the main and mizzen mast yards were brought round when these sails luffed.At this point the tack was completed.

Hope that helps.

[jrboyett]

Originally posted by Odoty:

Which boat are you in, and how much weight is in it?

I am using the dhow and even with just a couple hundred pounds of weight and have this issue. I haven't tried sailing empty to test the response yet. I might try that to see what the difference is. I have done the reverse rudder when pushed back to get out of the situation but that can take a while.

[ling.speed]

Dhow should be easy to tack still, just make sure the sail is pulled tight all the way, turn and wait long enough (it takes more time than in previous patches). If you have a jib you could try furling it to reduce drag. Maybe also dont start the tack from far away angle as rudder drag will slow you down, instead approach the irons slower and when you see the sail luffing and boat straightening up then turn hard.
In high seas picking a right moment can be important as well.

If it fails a trick you can do is to release the lateen, grab it and hold it perpendiculary for a bit so the boat quickly gains momentum backward, then turn the steering, and tighten the sail.

Initially i was having issue tacking as well, but after a while it stopped being a problem, cargo or not.



ps: This tacking changes feels a bit oppresive, but we have very overpowered sails upwind, so the difficulty of a tack i feel is increased by design to have more similar to life experiance in the broader sense.

[Jesus☮Superstar]

Originally posted by boris.glevrk:

Originally posted by Jesus☮Superstar:

I completely agree, I encountered this problem on my stock junk, although I had never had such a problem before. the desire to play disappears.

The junk (either one) should be the easiest ship to tack...
They have the highest turning rate and near-lowest drag.

Currently 3MJ and Sanbuq are both capable of tacking in all but weakest wind unless you square-rig them. Brig is less capable of doing this due to the higher drag.

re-read the message again, it says that I BEFORE had no such problem at all, but after the update this problem became obvious

[ling.speed]

Originally posted by Jesus☮Superstar:

Originally posted by boris.glevrk:

The junk (either one) should be the easiest ship to tack...
They have the highest turning rate and near-lowest drag.

Currently 3MJ and Sanbuq are both capable of tacking in all but weakest wind unless you square-rig them. Brig is less capable of doing this due to the higher drag.

re-read the message again, it says that I BEFORE had no such problem at all, but after the update this problem became obvious

I suspect you might be not using the sails efficiently (well, they are quite tricky). If you set them up well Junk still tacks on command. At worst in very weak wind or loaded with heavy cargo you might need to luff some sails (especially the middle one) during transition. I also like to luff front sail and tighten the mizzen before tack to reduce initial rudder drag... but in normal condition with well set sails it should be just turn the wheel and wait few seconds then straighten after it catches wind again.

The trick is to keep the sails tight but not too tight. Havent sailed Junk in a while but afair it was about 3/4th to 1 rotation on the sheet winch for every Junk sail.

[FreeQuest]

BTW this is how a Square rigged ship use to tack and wear.

https://youtu.be/BxCKGS_bLKI?si=TZGvq20x234ABJoi