Cabin maps

[HLRaven]

Why do people think cabin maps are the best? and dont get me started on thoose servers that give you perks and skins and ♥♥♥♥.

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Because they suck at this game.

[Wuffesan]

cabin maps are like a disease, it also kills the vision of how ZPS is meant to be played. (also 1 of the many reasons why ZPS just died)

[KaempeLaeske]

It's a combination of a lot of things,

For years, this game had no support whatsoever. No news, no communication, no updates. This has contributed to exhausting vanilla ZPS and maps that cater to the core gameplay of the game. This has caused players to seek out custom maps to keep the game fresh.

From this, a preference was born. Cabin maps are about barricading and defending them, as well as besieging said barricades. This is not foreign from ZPS at all. Way back when barricading was a huge deal, on vanilla servers and stock maps. Sadly, this preference is represented so horribly as the people who originally made the first editions of cabin did not think about properly adapting it to the game(I believe it was a port from another game). Now, I think mappers are scared to change cabin out of fear of players disregarding it.

This leads to the third point,

Players being introduced to ZPS through cabin maps. It's no surprise that his games most popular server is a cabin server. On top of this, a bunch of servers are dedicated to playing these maps. New players are introduced to ZPS through these servers and they end up thinking that is how the game is supposed to be played. The constant high count of players and the ease of the gameplay is enough to draw any new player in. When they then realize that all their progress and skills are to a degree "not legit" because they've missed out on crucial situations, tactics and experience, they are less likely to want to backtrack.

This leads into the final point,

Ego. It's what keeps experienced cabin players, besides the previous mentioned points, from taking on the challenge of playing vanilla content. Society breeds egocentrics like never before and this shows everywhere. On games, too. You see, noones able to live up to their own and society's ideal of how we should look/act/feel, but we are taught that we can before we are even able to walk. This leads to people compensating for what they feel they lack. What better way to do this than play easy maps, on easy servers, where top scores are the ideal and where this ideal is easy to obtain. It's all ego. It's the same thing that cause people to become obsessed with their steam personas. Bragging about your scores and "skills" is the perfect way to stimulate your inflated ego but sadly it distracts from what you really feel you're missing and it keeps you from developing as a person.

Ego isn't all bad, though. It's about balancing it and that has gotten incredibly tough.

[SkoSallad]

I get it, all you people hate cabin becuase it is not connecting to how zps was originally intended to be played.

Me however? In my opinion, the versions of cabin you can find on the SL and VG servers are the best ones.
The overal reason I love cabin is because that map has more or less become a minigame in it's own. The map pretty much speaks for the more "newbie" playerbase when it comes to survival.
Even tho the map is small i still find it to have a lot of replayability in it, and that's why some year ago, i could literally sit and play that map for 4 hours straight without getting bored at all.

It's not a map to be taken serious. It's as kaempe said, it's a "make you feel good" kind of map where you just can goof around and have fun, either with friends or alone.

Now i get it that all you hardcore zps players dislike it cause of how bad the teamwork on it is, and how unfair it is for the zombies. And yeah i can agree with you on the zombie part that it can be really unfair and s-hitty. But if zombies get just a good start, then humans is most likely to loose.
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Now to respond to the good old "to hell with the upgrade and skins servers" saying.
The reason I myself love these kind of "custom servers" (If they are good of course) is because the Vanilla zps is just plain boring in my eyes. And these custom servers with tons of plugins and content make the game more enjoyable for me, and for many others i believe.

[Reborn]

Speaking of Cabin maps, I personally have nothing aganist them because I was a "Cabin player" myself back in 2009 when I just started playing ZPS and didn't know anything about the game itself.. I played on one russian server "787Hardmod" (which is pretty dead these days) and there was a very nice edited version of original Cabin, "zps_cabin_787_b5_v3". If you haven't played this version, you should give it a try sometime. This is kinda the most enjoyable version of them all so far. (It has that oldschool ZPS feeling to it for some reason).
The rest are pure garbage and waste of resources put into them.

It has none of that mess the modern versions (Cabin Outbreak for example) have.
Cabin Outbreak is terrible compared to the original because it has many unfair design decisions such as unbreakable doors, unbreakable window barricades, unbrekable props, a way more exploits, more weapons and such..
Just a big mess, sure it looks decent and detailed, but is that worth it? I don't think so..

[SkoSallad]

Well that does sound interesting, i can't deny that the current popular version is indeedo desinged to be unfair for zombies with all the exploits and whatnot.

Anywhere one might be able to get their hands on said map you told about? :D

[Tabajara]

Cabin maps used to be good and fun years and years ago. Now they're just unbalanced and unfair weapon/Zpsawn system with the curren stages of ZPS.

I hope they get the same fate as the Lake, Redqueen and other maps that used to be popular back in 2010 and now they're pretty much abandoned or not played as much as before.

[Essyri]

Armory beter and mor fun


Tiny map, easy to learn, fast access to weapons, a simple single objective. I just don't see the appeal. It's just one of those map chains that severely lack variety, discriminate the zombie team and the map itself doesn't even look that appealing.

Not to mention how countless of clone maps were bred with the exact identical concept. Four buildings -> cade it -> sit on an overlooking balcony or similar having a jolly target practice -> zombies have no choice but to die loads of times attempting to break through, one tiny, seemingly unbreakable, piece at a time.

I don't honestly have anything against a concept like that, I've just yet to see a map do it -right-.

[76561198089096318]

Originally posted by Dendrite:

Not to mention how countless of clone maps were bred with the exact identical concept. Four buildings -> cade it -> sit on an overlooking balcony or similar having a jolly target practice -> zombies have no choice but to die loads of times attempting to break through, one tiny, seemingly unbreakable, piece at a time.

I don't honestly have anything against a concept like that, I've just yet to see a map do it -right-.

This. Obvoiusly, every "cancer map" this game has it's a "Safe defence" map.
Church, cabin, lakes. Those 3 has this in mind.
As survivor, you just camp open areas with revolvers.
As zombie (especially yt), you do dodgy ninja stuff.
When there's tonns of barricades and props on zed way, it's survivors fests of .44-ing their score.
When there's none of them, it's yt' fests of "Raging (Ninja) Beauty". Because Carrier is the only one capable to inflict massive damage to campers (if used right) and no survivor can escape this "Battle horse" (90% speed and lunge).

Those maps actually building themselves at the "core gameplay" if you re-think your past experience with 'em. The only thing is that you already get late-game items known asap.
The problem is that on every map you can do sourcery with props and pretty much block forever one way of "Joiiiin meee". And with abundance of ammo you can cover juke ways like machine gun. While zeds get their sexy unlimited lives and 1 player gets his unlimited carrier.
(some pleb said that zombies are "ammo" in their way, so why we just limit carriers to make end game a little easier for survivors? But that in exchange would need it's own rules and balance.)

So it all goes to moving down endless barricades (if they do it right, you can't) or unfairy ninjaing by using meta strats, while being under fire and dying to thousand cuts/revo huesos.

Originally posted by Reborn:

... many unfair design decisions such as unbreakable doors, unbreakable window barricades, unbrekable props, a way more exploits, more weapons and such...

Uuh. Yes? Cabin always been the one map where meta "rush 1 floor and do ninja to 2 while being constantly on fire" was always viable. Church is the "defend the closest to tower window in church/target practice on gen house/reeecade the hell outta crypt etc." map. Lakes... Well, I remember some really sh;tty clones of it, but it uses same "ninja" tactic.

TL;DR This kind of maps uses wonky gamebalance meaning that you CAN AND SHOULD use every cancer tactic you have, otherwise those maps will send you :
a) to 3/4 hits of lmb+w and you cant do anything to escape it (you actually can - backjumping like rabbit and shooting like freak- another cancer, I should say), because the one who leads the attack is carrier using other ones as meat shield.
b) to linear, open space target practice field, where the best revolver user gets his medal and scores for using it, and best barricadier gets his medal of living thru hundreds of undead by just lagging unbreakable props in the right way.

[KaempeLaeske]

Originally posted by »SoD« Zvac:

I get it, all you people hate cabin becuase it is not connecting to how zps was originally intended to be played.

Now i get it that all you hardcore zps players dislike it cause of how bad the teamwork on it is, and how unfair it is for the zombies. And yeah i can agree with you on the zombie part that it can be really unfair and s-hitty. But if zombies get just a good start, then humans is most likely to loose.

The thing is, there's no real way to play ZP!S. If you think about, ZPS, ZPO, ZPA and ZPH play vastly different from eachother, in my opinion, and they are all official gamemodes. My gripes with cabin-, lake- and church maps, are, as you said yourself, the horrible balance and disregard for the zombie team.

The only good zombie start that I can think of must be, from my own recollections of playing the map which granted is very limited compared to a lot of other players, when the zombies get lucky and manage to knock off the boards on the front- or backdoor to the big, white house. I say lucky, because that's what it is. You have to push the door, hope that there's noone on the other side blocking it or putting a prop infront of it, then tediously try and work with the tricky physics engine and hope that you are able to knock off the board. And even if you do, you're likely to experience said board dropping down infront of the door, blocking further entry. All of this while you're getting spawnkilled by people with a complete arsenal at their disposal.

That is not balanced. You, as well as a ton of other cabin players all agree that playing zombie on it sucks because it's so tipped in one teams favor. That's why I don't understand why communities such as SL haven't tried to make more drastic changes to make the map fun for both teams. To me, it just seems like a moneygrab, really. Not really interested in driving the vision of the game forward, but ensuring as many players as possible stop by the server. How Uncle Fred runs his server is none of my business, though, except for when he starts attacking other servers. I just think it's sad that the community is unwilling to try and really develop cabin.

Originally posted by »SoD« Zvac:

The overal reason I love cabin is because that map has more or less become a minigame in it's own. The map pretty much speaks for the more "newbie" playerbase when it comes to survival.

Originally posted by pyjimbo:

As many of you have described above in other words cabin style is pretty much its own game inside of ZPS. Which is impressive and even more so for a mod. I think there are some verterans that can no longer get the thrill they used to with ZPS and need faster action.

This is exactly my point. It's become its own game mode. So why aren't anyone trying to expand upon it and make it balanced?

Originally posted by pyjimbo:

the living room window in white house caded up while watching the bedroom window with the metal cades is intense. I wish more zombies would attack that window so I could manage them.

And they would if the map was actually balanced. It would provide you with the thrill you get from barricading and defending, while not making it tedious to be the one attacking said barricades. As I've said before, I think the community should look at what cabin/lake/church can be and not what they aren't :P

[HLRaven]

i played the cabin maps and they suck if your a zombie at the start. your ♥♥♥♥♥♥. prepare to die and dodge like in dark souls. or if your a survivor in a TERRIBLE position.

[76561198089096318]

Originally posted by KaempeLaeske@WORK:

The thing is, there's no real way to play ZP!S. If you think about, ZPS, ZPO, ZPA and ZPH play vastly different from eachother, in my opinion, and they are all official gamemodes. My gripes with cabin-, lake- and church maps, are, as you said yourself, the horrible balance and disregard for the zombie team.

+1 to this, actually.
ZPS_ maps are :
From survivor point of view:
1) Find weapons and ammo while dodging yt;
2) Get meta spot;
3) Kill to win;
From yt's :
1) Ambush those hoggers in the most trollest and best spots - you can't tank but you're pretty much instant killer in cqc;
2) Harass people on abused spots and chip 'em away, because you can do dmg, not tanking;
3) Finish the job.
ZPO_
From survivor point of view:
1) GET DAT FOKKEN REVO;
2) Dodge yt to win;
3) Do objectives asap in the most fastest way, like you lived there 3 years and you know every spot there;
From yt's :
1) Ambush those hoggers in the most trollest and best spots on the objective - you can't tank but you're pretty much instant killer in cqc, and they're coming by themselves in your hands;
2) Someone did the objective and is going back to his friends? Camp him with 1-3 zeds to win;
3) Finish the damn job.
ZPH_
From survivor point of view:
1) Bennyhill the hell to safe spot, dont waste time to kill yt's, so dont pick up any weapon;
2) Get ied+grens+revo combo if you can;
3) Drinage the hell outta zed heads while watching your back for infected survs;
From yt's :
1) Rush the damn safe spot from your spawn to ez win;
ZPA_
S:
1) Do target practice, because zeds have no abilities besides lunge to overcome you and they're not tanky;
2) Do every crate, so they get no yt;
3) See 1 point;
4) Die horribly, because every zpa_ map is bugged/unbalanced;
Z:
0) Try to not have much bullets in your head before attacking and lunge ready, hp regen sucks anyway, and if you're carrier, you won't lose yt (Zombies that dont lose their "ammo", lel balance).
1) Either rush main objective and do consecutive lmb+w (you're better at it anyways);
2) Or get carriers and rush main asap;
3) Win horribly, because survs cant get their weapons and ammo while there's ton of zeds on main point + round will not over till zeds win;

[Essyri]

Originally posted by KaempeLaeske@WORK:

This is exactly my point. It's become its own game mode. So why aren't anyone trying to expand upon it and make it balanced?

+1 This is the entire truth. While I, myself, haven't tried every single version of cabin or all of it's clones, they're all very much the same. My biggest issue is that there's only one single way to go about doing things. Survivors are confined to a box guarding an entry point, zombies have no choice but to assault that entry point directly. It's a tug of war at it's very basic level.

___


Thinking about it, zpo_haunted is pretty much an official version of cabin. Everyone's in a large house, you cade and defend it, zombies break through. But this one is a lot more appealing, why?

The building is a lot larger with too many entry points to keep in check meaning zombies will have an easier time actually breaching the house but they've still got to breach the basement which where most of the survivors will be holding up.

Thing is though the big difference is there's a lot more choices available for both teams. Survivors can patrol the upper floors (which the lobby has the best visibility of several entrances), fortify the basement right away or even go outside to try to scavenge things from the exterior areas which is also risky but has its rewards. Survivors even have the option of keeping a generator powered (which imo runs out of juice almost way too quickly).

Zombies have many entry points to choose from, even when it comes to the basement there are four ways to get down there. Even if they're unable to breach through the mass amount of cades survivors throw up they'll have one final chance when survivors at the end are forced to -leave- the house in the end, forced to cross zombie hell to victory. Zombies can position themselves in many places for a proper ambush on passing survivors.

[White Rabbit]

Why not make a official cabin and the other cancer maps, this way they could be made to be balanced and updated regular.