I want to fix this game so bad

[jellicoDace]

changing the Empire's building build speed from 4 seconds to normal build times, maybe a little less . . .

this game is borked, bad. and this fix is the beginning. fix this and the game becomes balanceable. with no one able to gain a real early advantage in resources we could start to balance this game. we can make it a fight rather than . . . allies are overpowered "but they need to be because empire can three refinery!"

ditch uprising, with the exception of the archer maiden. the archer maiden is necessary to "nerf" Empire infantry, and their ability to drop barracks behind enemy lines. splitting the anti-air and anti-armor infantry unit makes it more difficult to counter your opponents composition, making such a tactic harder to pull off. however ARCHER MAIDENS COST TOO MUCH TO BE EFFECTIVE. at 500 each THEY ARE NOT EXPENDABLE and still one-shot-able. hell 300 isn't expendable. what I'm getting at is the empire needs an anti air infantry unit to help with early anti air, and any infantry relies on being able to take casualties while still having someone next to them. 500 is too much. I'm not gonna claim to be good with numbers, I don't even know if they would need to be nerfed down to match the new cost. if their ability is too much then replace it with a "weapon swap" where they shoot arcing shots at a slower projectile speed with additional range.

I'm looking at you, whoever the ♥♥♥♥ raised the price on flak troopers

javelin laser lock is not ok. allowing them to be able to take out a base from a safe distance is not something that can be priced at 300, and as I mentioned before, a infantryman cant cost more than 300 without losing all ability to be infantry. I'm looking at the numbers XYHC gave me and I don't even want to start calculating the increase in DPS. laser lock can't add more than 1.5 times dps at that price. if you need to be doing more damage, get more javelin troopers.

reduce the price on all basic infantry (conscript, imperial warrior, peacekeeper) by 25. this give cost effectiveness to the conscript, while they are still the least effective use of barracks time. in addition this would make infantry more spam-able for all factions, and infantry need to be spammed. also makes peacekeepers the least cost effective and the most barracks time effective, meaning peacekeepers can be produced when needed. they could deal with the problem and an allies player wastes no money. this is a very good fix.

reduce the amount of damage basic infantry can do to vehicles and structures. lets NOT see ten peacekeepers slaughter three sickles, or tengus, ever. basic infantry are cheep for a reason.

reduce the cost of sickles to 800. they are not a tank, they are not as good as a tank. they should cost less than a tank. on the same note I would love to reduce the price of anti-infantry vehicles (including sickles) to 700 but I'm not sure about tengus costing 700, but I'm not sure how that would affect the air meta.


raise the price of riptides to 800 and guardian tanks to 1000, these units have no place having a discount. alternatively lower the price of tsunami tanks to 900. the lower tsunami price thing is a "not joke." don't lower the price on the tsunami tank, but what the ♥♥♥♥ allies.


I have some numbers for the empire nanocore construction. build time is 75% normal speed, and they construct at 50% normal build speed. base defences build at 50% build time and 50%. refineries might no longer need to cost more.

remove dolphins. riptides are either plenty, or ♥♥♥♥ allies.

while I am new to ra3 I know I'm pushing in the right direction.

this is a long ♥♥♥♥ing essay, and that speaks to how poorly balanced this game is. its as if some white house ♥♥♥♥ is spending money (or threatening) to make allies the only viable option. I can't believe a professional would allow their name to be in the technical section of the credits of this game.

I love this game's aesthetic, it looks, sounds, feels great. the acting is incredible and a honor to put these new cutscenes alongside the old cutscenes

still currently gets a 0/10 for being the most garbage ♥♥♥♥ ever shoveled onto store shelves. don't forget to kick EA's balls for being unable to make a good game, while demanding to make more games, that are also ♥♥♥♥.

PS: I have a random idea that I think is cool, swapping the engineers ability with a "create life raft" special ability. effectively turning all the engineers into production units, this life raft can carry one infantryman, is very slow on land, works like a garrison-able structure, and has less hp than a conscript. very oddball idea but it would give infantry the ability to assault out to sea, in a desperate way. also build a barracks on water to get infantry starting in rafts. odd, fun idea that would give players more flexibility in dealing with problems.

ragging kinda hard on allies, they might need some help if some of these changes happen. they are ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥s.

[Cat]

There's so many things wrong with the balance, I'll start with soviets:
-conscripts do next to 0 damage
-flak troopers are a joke
-sickle is worst at what it's good at
-bullfrog is just sad
-hammertank is ***king ugly
-apocalypse not having AA is unforgiveable
-tesla coil priced at $1500 is just silly compared to the spectrum tower
-sentry gun is just awful, can easily be destroyed before anyone noticed it exists
-kirov is too slow and the afterburners damage it, not really useful compared to other expensive aircraft
-MiGs could have been better than what they are
-their construction method, though the most realistic, is the worst among the 3, the enemy knows where and can attack it before it is complete.

[jellicoDace]

apocalypse tank not having AA is ok. kinda. it allows for easier balancing. with a clear counter the unit may be overwhelmingly powerful. the problem is, its not overwhelmingly powerful. apocalypse tanks should counter artillery, but instead it gets wrecked. and it costs 2k. the assault cruiser has no place costing so little.

[Tenshin51]

Originally posted by Cat:

There's so many things wrong with the balance, I'll start with soviets:
-conscripts do next to 0 damage
-flak troopers are a joke
-sickle is worst at what it's good at
-bullfrog is just sad
-hammertank is ***king ugly
-apocalypse not having AA is unforgiveable
-tesla coil priced at $1500 is just silly compared to the spectrum tower
-sentry gun is just awful, can easily be destroyed before anyone noticed it exists
-kirov is too slow and the afterburners damage it, not really useful compared to other expensive aircraft
-MiGs could have been better than what they are
-their construction method, though the most realistic, is the worst among the 3, the enemy knows where and can attack it before it is complete.

Conscripts/ Flak are well suited to be garrison to boast their range. Flak are quite decent against light tier 1 armor unit. Also Conscripts are the only known unit that can easily clear garrison building without sacrificing itself.

Sickle are good against infantry. Good for hit and run tactics against infantry.

Bullfrog best AA unit of the soviet but it is so expensive.

Hammertank agreed but it's gimmick is quite useful suited as a meatshield tank.

Apocalypse seems fine

Tesla somewhat agreed, honestly the price seems decent but build time is quite annoying. W/ sentry gun seems fine for it's job it got fast fire rate and can destroy tier 1 LV and infantry but need support w/ Engineer battle bunker and tesla coil.

3 Kirovs can pretty much destroy an entire base. It is better to build an outpost and airport near Ai base to make them effective.

MIGs are quite decent maybe the best AA jet

What?? Depending on build order Soviets have an edge in early game. Even with Empire chugging Nanocores also Nanocores are easily can be destroy. Soviet Crane is too useful. Even techwise and economy Soviet have an edge sadly their late game unit are so so. Soviet unit building aren't require to be upgraded. Sure I need to build 2 tech buildings to unlock specific units but even those unit building is destroy I really don't lose any investment unlike empire. Unlike allies unit building required a specific MCV to unlock those units

Main Problem in the game will be the economy is too damnn slow to get high economy.

3 mines is not enough to build a really crazy army in early game. Also fighting Ai is too dammn annoying keep investing on superweapons making them too broke so soon ending skirmish battle quickly. It will be nice Ai is investing on expanding their resources than rushing superweapons in the game. Only time Ai are effective in higher difficulties due to cheat but will end up broke in the late game.

Sadly Most support ability power are too dammn OP. Forcing me to rush the game.

Late game is a crawl due to depleted resources forcing me to rush the game again.

[|r.τ.α| Somm]

Imagine calling a game this old bad and unbalanced in 2020.

[jellicoDace]

Originally posted by Somm:

Imagine calling a game this old bad and unbalanced in 2020.

imagine having ten years to fix it.

[|r.τ.α| Somm]

Imagine updating a game for ten years when you have other games to make.

[jellicoDace]

conscripts are a literal waste of time, costing 4 seconds of barracks time for half the effectiveness of other infantry. alternatively reduce conscript creation time to 3 seconds, and imperial warrior to 4 seconds, instead of changing the cost.

anti infantry vehicles need to cost less, ideally your anti infantry vehicle will cost 600, but everyone has a bit more quality in their kit, so 700 feels right. and everyone (except allies who have riptides at 750, a real cheat of a price) have theirs above that. its disgusting.

bullfrog is defiantly too expensive. 800 is a reasonable price.

super heavy tanks like the apocalypse tank are countered by artillery, and you want artillery. you want a lot of artillery. artillery needs a counter and the super heavy tanks are right there, lets use them. the super heavy tanks are a unit designed to punch a hole in the enemy's lines.

as for construction, and upgrading tiers
soviets have an efficient tier 2, and the worst construction method. has the hardest time expanding. they are fine.

allies have an easy way to have tier advancements, and have an extremely easy time expanding.

empire. 7 second build time for generator/barracks, 5 second construction time. 15 second build time for refinery/mecha bay/naval yard, 10 second construction time. 45 second build time for a nanotech mainframe, 30 second construction time. 3 second build time for base defenses. full construction time. buff the king oni. have apoc tanks and king onis kill each other if a tractor beaming apoc tank is bull rushed. maybe an explosion.

[DasaKamov]

Originally posted by jellicoDace:

been continuing to work on this

Looking forward to the release of your mod.

[jellicoDace]

this is a draft

super reactor (250 energy gen) 1500 30 seconds
battle lab 3500 50 seconds
5000 tot cost, 80 seconds
cheap, efficient, and volatile

heightened clearance 1000 20 seconds
defense bureau 2000 25 seconds
max clearance 3000 40 seconds
6000 tot cost, 85 seconds
expensive, defendable, and versatile

production upgrade 750/500 20 seconds
nanotech mainframe 2500 20/30 seconds
production breakthrough 1250/1000 20 seconds
4500 tot cost, 6500 for two tier 3 buildings, 90 seconds
cheap, inefficient, and inflexible

empire. 7 second build time for generator/barracks, 7 second deployment time. 15 second build time for refinery/mecha bay/naval yard, 15 second deployment time. 5 second build time for base defenses, 20 second deployment time for Defender VX, Cannon, 30 second deployment time for Disapproving Face. 40 second deployment time for Wave Force Tower

sputnik deploy 5 seconds, build time 10 seconds, has repair drones
prospector deploy 11 seconds
ore collector and sputnik cost to 1100, hp to 450
MCV cost to 2500
generator cost to 700
mcv power generation +50
+1 build radius for Imperial structures
+2 build radius for soviet structures
Allied Construction Crane provides large build radius (total identical to soviet construction vehicle, maps use that to space starting ore), ANA provides normal building build radius, cost 1500

Tier 1, takes 15 power
Soviet Gun turret, deals gun damage, cost 600, takes 10 power
Soviet Cannon Turret, cost 800
Soviet Flak Turret, cost 700
Empire Defender VX, cost 700, deals gun damage
Empire Cannon Turret, cost 800, has tsunami tank ability (cant move sure but free repairs are nice)
Multigunner Turret, cost 700, is AA only while ungarrisoned, damage rework
Guardian Turret, cost 800

Tier 2, cost 1500, takes 25 power
Tesla Coil
Spectrum Tower
Disapproving Face, Tier 2 Empire Base Defense, hp congruent with Tesla or spectrum, armed with king oni eye lasers

Tier 3 base defense, hp congruent with Tier 1 base defence, cost 2500, 40 second build time, takes 50 power*
V4p stationary defense, two v4p launchers (damage as v4)
Athena's Tower
Wave Force Tower
range as weapon + Tier 3 minimum range of (tank range)

IFV to aa-only, cost 700 damage reworked (lowered) multigunner hp to 300
Riptide, cost to 800 hp to 400, torpedo damage to 100
Sickle cost to 800 hp to 400
Tengu unchanged
Stingray cost to 1000, deals 67 damage, twice independently. 3.5 RoF
Sudden transport cost to 600
bullfrog damage to 13 cost to 700
hydrofoil damage to 12 cost unchanged
Striker hp to 450
Chopper hp to 450
Twinblade cost to 1000, x1.5 the time on missle barrage, hp to 400
Cryocopter cost to 1400, hp to 500
Cryodamge change, infantry have 50% cryo armor, heavy infantry take 25%.
range back to 400

increase all cooldowns by 1.5
Air to Ground transformation has no cooldown, Ground to Air transformation time unchanged
Cryocopter shrink ray effect time reduced to 15 seconds

Ore collector cost to 900
MCV cost to 2500
Sputnik cost to 900

assault destroyer/ 1600 health
king oni/ 1800 health
apoc/ 2000 health
cost up, 2000 assault destroyer, 2500 for king oni and apoc
a King Oni's bullcharge ability is changed to of melee, the King Oni's bullcharge will destroy both a beaming apoc tank and a King Oni on impact
artillery
stat RoF DMG Cost DPS
Wave Force artillery 8 650 1700 81.2
Athena Cannon 7 600 1800 85.7
V4 9 400 1200 44.4

Wave force and Athena are tanks at 400 hp, V4 is a light vehicle at 250 hp
units needed
list needs things

* placed near odd choices, I'm planning to give dogs a little less against a charging Imperial Warrior, dealing 80 damage, Conscripts will deal 80 damage to melee attackers if they have molotovs equipped, and Peacekeepers have a melee attack and will move toward the foe insuring they take auto attack damage, and causing everything to die in a nice close range mess(o7 to the dojo core atop it). swords no longer protect against roars/barks, Peacekeeper shield does not protect against roars/barks Peacekeeper shield is a garrison, Peacekeepers cant hit bears without being exposed to counter attack, increase bear model size by 15%
Basic infantry creation time to 4
with no more bonus damage bear health becomes something . roar radius increased by 20%, and cost 250 for dogs creation time 4, 400 bears creation time 5

bribe cost increased to $1500
a scatter for when targeting the ground with more than one unit
____________________________
Conscript creation time to 5 seconds, molotovs deal 80 damage to garrisoned units, and counter attacks melee attackers for 80 damage. barracks cost to 300

Imperial Warrior creation time to 5 seconds, Swords becomes a weapon switch, the movement buff has a cooldown

Peacekeeper loses the aoe effect at long range, and the knockback at short range. creation time to 5 seconds. shields have a melee attack (a great animation would a a "cryoaxe," a clublike weapon with two nozzles vertically along the tip. purely visual, acts as a normal melee weapon)

Imperial Warrior and Peacekeeper clearance attack deals 1.5 people damage, dealing 80 damage to the second target, flack troopers survive with 1 health

flack trooper damage to 25, 1.2 attack speed. cost to 275. 4 flack troopers have 83.3 dps. creation time 4 seconds. hp to 75

tankbuster damage to 55, 1.75 attack speed. cost to 350. 3 tankbusters have 94.3 dps (and phenomenal burst damage). can attack structures while burrowed.

javelin trooper damage to 22, .666 attack speed. cost to 350. 3 javelin troopers have 100 dps. lock on damage halved. no longer de-locks from transforming targets.

archer maidens are to be available with a attack at 70 damage, 4.0 attack speed. deals gun damage. cost 350. halve ability's damage. archer maidens are a mystery to me as I haven't been able to find much information on them. help please.

with no more bonus damage bear health becomes something . roar radius increased by 20%, and cost 250 for dogs, 400 bears(with debuffing sheilds and swords)

Navy, Air

______________________
tank attack speed flattened to 2.1 seconds
hammer tank, 70 damage
tsunami tank, 100 damage, 420 hp
guardian tank, 80 damage (dealing 120 to a target painted opponent)

damage types
cannon (rocket, flak)
gun (autocannon)
explosive (tesla, spectrum, concussive, fire, cryo)

armor types
Infantry (20% damage from cannon)
light vehicle (40% damage from guns) Ore Collectors are light vehicles (soviet collectors are tanks while armored)
tank (10% damage from gun)
Structure (5% damage from gun)
Aircraft always take full damage, transformed air units are ground units while on the ground
heavy infantry and ore collectors take 50% explosive damage

terror drone tier 2, producible from naval yard, stasis ray damages [3 at .1] and stuns infantry (don't taze me bro !)*
Soviet Airfield to tier 1, twinblades to tier 1
Dolphins to Tier 2
Assault Destroyer to Tier 3, producible from an armor facility
Akula submarines to Tier 3
Naginata Cruiser to tier 3
Empire Airfield added

units to be added
Archer Maiden
Cryo Legionnaire
Mech Units (name comes from advanced wars, unit is old mamoth tank made heavie infantry, and they are mecha infantry with a "small" wave force cannon and shoulder mounted AA rocket launchers)
Desolator Tank
Steel Ronin
Giant Squids (for empire, tier 2)*
Badger Bomber
(Empire Bomber, create-able at tier 2)
(Empire Air superiority fighter, create-able at tier 3)

Top Secret Protocols removed,
Empire have Honorable Discharge
Soviets have terror drone
Allies have vindicator bombs (and not more from Advanced Aeronautics Upgrade)

Super Weapons.
with top secret protocols removed, everyone is getting a tier 1 superweapon.
cost, tier 1 2500, tier 2 3500, tier 3, 5000
Power 50, 75, 100
Empire
Tier 1: Point Defense Drones
Tier 2: Final Squadron 1, cost 1800, power 50
Tier 3: Psionic Decimator

Soviets
Tier 1: Iron Curtain
Tier 2: Satellite Drop 2, timing of one
Tier 3 Vacuum Imploder

Allies:
Tier 1: Cryoblast
Tier 2: Chronosphere
Tier 3: Proton Collider

Unit Super weapons
Aircraft Carrier, EMP missile
Desolator Tank, ability sprays Desolation around the tank
Final Squadron can load infantry, creating Tankbuster surprise and friends, will auto eject before impact, can eject early.

[[CW]Super Assassin]

Okay found it, As a red alert 3 pvp player I will have a lot to say here :D

I will add another reply hopefully tommorow if not then the day after :)

[[CW]Super Assassin]

Okay this is the crasiest stuff I have ever read by a community member.

Holy. Lets get started somewhere shall we.
Buildings / tech up

Super reactors cost 2000 for the reason that it provides Tier 2 to soviets, alot of energy of a value of 500 witch is cheeper than building 5 reactors.

It is really tanky, cranking out at 27 bombs from a vindicator.

Battle lab.

Dude?! WHAT reduce the build time by 10 seconds and increase the cost of 500?! a ore collector only collects 250 per 10 seconds, you need 2 ore collectors to make a addtional trip in a shorter period of time to make up for this.

AND NOT ONLY THAT you are reducing the cost of TIER 3 for allies?!
WHAT?! AND THE TIME.

WHYYYY

ALL FACTIONS in the game are strong and equally valuable to be played in all senarios.

I cant go through all of your changes and be able to post properly, since
1 your post is extremly long.
2 its so mutch things to go into details, i might aswell just explain why the game is more or less balanced. and well made.

So lets do that

Lets start with buildings.

10 seconds to build the quickest of buildings except the cores for empire.

this is just fine as it gives you some extra time to think about what you want to do.

infantry produces rather quickly, with dogs / bears coming out on 2 seconds and infantry at 10 / seconds / 4 seconds for conscripts. etc

allies might have some powerfull infantry of the kinds of javelin and peacekeeper but both empire and soviets counter the allies infantry.

for soviets, use bears and conscripts, when the bears get close you can stun the enemy infantry and then kill them, if the peackeepers use their sheild so they cant be killed by the bears, they can still be stunned and be 1 HIT KO by a molotove cocktail.

for empire, the imperial warriors has more DPS than the peacekeeper coutner part, and can 1 hit any infantry with their beem katana. not only that but they are 50 cash cheeper. so if the allies are to spam infantry then you will easily out number them.

When it comes to building stuff as empire.

You get a core after 4 seconds of consctruting. and then you gotta take into account, the travell time and the deploy time. Making empire one of the slowest builders in the game. How ever they have a mutch stronger side, While their buildings are moving around and deploying you can build multiple buildings.

for example the standard build order for empire is

Power plant
dojo
dojo
Dojo
ref
ref
mechabay
power plant

When the third dojo is done building the first power plant will have already finished deploying if you deployed it close to the mcv. letting you start at once building 2 refeinerys.

while the other factions with in the same time frame has just started to build their 1 refinery.

to combaten the easy sneaking refinery expations for empire their refinery cost 500 extra.

the over all power of all factions are actually well balanced.

all factions has different options of what to do.
that is why in the competative scene all factions stand a chance of winning.
Yeah, allot fo people are ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ or complaing about the blanace of the game, allies to op, empire to op, twin frog combo to op.

what ever the case may be, the game is actually rather balanced since all factions can counter each senario rather well.

Allies for example has to dominate air vs empire, since if not. empire can just spam tenugs.

tenugs are so versetile that, any other anti infantry unit beats the tengu both the sickle and the riptide acv.

I wont go into more details as its so mutch to go into details.

If you really wanna discuss the game balance you can feel free to hit me up on the c&c online discord.

or just add me on discord

Edvin#2274

I do not have the time to write allot, so discussing over voice is mutch easier.

Either way, Its nice to see that you belive somthing is wrong and you come with ideas on how to fix it instead of only complaing.

So good on you, but do check the pvp side first prehaps ;) (the side that actually balance the game)

and btw the online community is still around

Its know as C&C Online so join the discord there and I will help you rejoin the online community

https://discord.gg/UjTaVkhHgS

[jellicoDace]

First, THANK YOU ! (windwaker shopkeeper image)

going down the list
I'm trying to make tier 2 less expensive for all factions and tier 3 more, mostly for the sake of soviet players. not everyone can be dimon or ddf and macro that perfectly, and even they have trouble. with the reduction in power generation you are not getting as much money to power efficiency as you may think. someone should check the math tho

I tried to lower the cost on economic units as hard as I could. I probably went a bit overboard, but that's what a draft is for. removed the "8 second barracks/generator"

recent edits:
I reduced the cost of the Defense Bureau and increased the cost of Max Clearance. also moved 5 more seconds to max clearance to make scouting tier 3 easier. did the same with empire but I increased the cost of the mainframe instead of the breakthrough. again designed to maximize the possibility to scout a player going tier 3.

and a short list of changes that I think are most important

the massive amount of stuff about infantry might not be so necessary, but 300 for a soviet barracks is a valid buff. Sputnik build time reduced.

removing multigunner ground to ground is needed due to turret pushes and multigunner IFV rushes being to powerful (just don't forget to pack some infantry in your IFVs, or the sputniks will get you !)

primary problem with this is how do you get infantry on water. just thought of a solution. multigunner turrets have torpedoes. sounds like something the allies would do.

Bullfrogs are struggling way to hard for not enough benefit. either they need 400 health or a cost reduction. I vote for cost reduction. either way 13 damage per shot (from 15) resulting in 65 dps sounds like good balance.

reduce hydrofoil damage to 12, 90 dps
generally reduce AA damage a little. do be careful to not cut too much this one is a steep cliff.

reduce shrink duration to 15 seconds, add at least 5 seconds to the cooldown.

there is alot of crazy and stupid in this, I expect that I'll need to do alot of sorting though good and bad ideas. anything involving navy or air units is a work in progress

the factions are equipped well enough to fight each other, there are just a few minor damage values, abilities, and unit costs that cause big problems over the course of a match.


there are so many edits I want to make. I tried to aim everything toward the mostest game balenced game can be. the quickest fix I can think of is to have soviet barracks at $300 with a build time of seven seconds, remove the peace keeper long range AoE, the changes to rocket troopers is measured and the hp reduction for flack troopers fits tho you could just 400 javilin/300 flack trooper has 75 hp, halve javilin trooper lock on damage, add a AA Imperial Infantryman, mind the power of (thats the end of quickly)

vindicators, a vehical that gets one shot should cost the 700, I thought long about that one, AA gets a little nuts in this game. the flattening of tank attack was mostly an experiment, but if anyone (and I dont think anyone should) should get a price cut on tanks its soviets, all of their units are specialists, working together is the strength of communism ! and as such they need to be able to make many units, $900 bullfrogs is a huge detriment to this . . thats alot of math-age

[jellicoDace]

damage types
cannon (rocket, flak)
gun (autocannon)
explosive (tesla, spectrum, concussive, fire, cryo)

armor types
infantry (30% damage from cannon)
light vehicle (40% damage from guns) Ore Collectors are light vehicles
tank (15% damage from gun)
structure (10% damage from gun)
aircraft always take full damage, transformed air units are ground units while on the ground
walls have structure armor

no more bonus damage, this game is just balencable (vindicators you do 360 a shot stop complaining)

---Tech

super reactor (300 energy gen) 1500 20 seconds (requires refinery)
battle lab 3000 25 seconds (requires super reactor) -50 energy
4500 tot cost, 45 seconds
cheap, efficient, and volatile

heightened clearance 1000 10 seconds (requires refinery)
defense bureau 2000 20 seconds (requires hightened clearance) +50 energy
max clearance 1500 10 seconds (requires a defense bureau, all tier 3 units require max clearance)
4500 tot cost, 40 seconds
expensive, defendable, and versatile

tier 2 tech garden 1000 10 seconds (requires refinery) -0 energy
production upgrade 250/150 5 seconds
nanotech mainframe 2500 25 seconds (requires tier 2 tech garden) +50 energy
production breakthrough 750/350 5 seconds
4500 tot cost, 7000 for all tier 3 buildings, 35 seconds
paying for the expandability of the empire, inefficient, and inflexible

---Basics

without a tech building tier 3 units cannot be built and their production is refunded (a teir 2 mecha bay can still make teir 2 units, regardless of tech building)

passive regeneration from nutral structures takes into effect 20 seconds after taking damage

empire. a nanocore is built in normal build time, builds imidiatly.

heavy infantry survive destroyed transports (has parachute)

infantry production buildings cost no power
all aircraft production buildings can be built tier 1
vehicle, aircraft, and naval construction structures cost 1500
aircraft production structures have 7(soviet), 8(empire), 9(allies) hangers
soviet barracks cost 300, 7 second build time
structure hp 1500/3500

---Turrets

turrets have structure armor

Tier 1
cost 600, hp 400, AA range un-nerfed, energy -10
sentry gun 10 second build time, damage 10 rof .29
flak cannon 10 second build time, damage 12 rof .2
multigunner turret 10 second build time, 5 second deploy time, damage as multigunner IFV
defender VX 10 second build time 5 second deploy time, damage 4 rof .133 (ground), damage 75 rof 1.8

Tier 2
build time 20 seconds, deploy time (empire, allies) 10 seconds
cost 1200 hp 1000, energy -25


---Structures

MCV, 2500, 20 second build time
Crane, 1500, 10 second build time
Allied Construction Crane, provides large build radius (enough to cover starting ore)
ANA (auxilary nanocore assembly) provides as much as a crusher crane

ore collector, sputnik cost 700, hp 400, empire damage 5 rof .2, outpost/deployed sputnik is a small building, -0 energy
sputnik, deploy 5 seconds, build time 10 seconds, has two repair drones
prospector, deploy 15 seconds

structure production buildings no longer have a separate que for base defences, walls build instantly

---Infantry, Tier 1

remove peacekeeper aoe at range, sheild protects you from 30% of damage
conscript gains the ability to target moving peacekeepers with molotovs, molotov damage 8, build time 5 seconds

melee
Conscript
Bear
Terror Drone
Peacekeeper
Dog
Imperial Warrior

damage/rof
flack trooper, 25/1.13, mines deal 150 rof 1.5, hp 75, cost 275
javilin, 40/1.3, lock on damage 20 cost 350
tank buster, 55/1.8, can target structures while burrowed with a 50% range penalty, cost 350
archer maiden, 35/1.2 deals AA damage, ability reveals map (range as artillery, 60 seconds), cost 350

scouts, 5 second build time
roar, now only affects rocket troopers and engineers
bear, 150 hp, cost 150
dog, 75 hp, cost 100
bug, cost 200, damage 75

engineer cost 500 build 5 second, never refund on nutral cap
10 second non-nutral cap time
while garrisoned inside a civilian structure, repair structure.
replacing everyone's ability with "create landing boat" cost 250, hp 200 moves slow on land and normal boat speed at sea, transports 5

---Light Vehicles

Tier 1
riptide, cost to 700, hp to 350, damage 7 rof .18, torpedo damage 90 rof 3
sickle, cost to 700, hp to 400, damage 7 rof .2
tengu, cost to 700, hp to 300, damage 5 rof .111 (air and ground)
Stingray, cost to 700, hp to 350, damage 70 rof 2, ability deals 75 damage to all in area exept for self
Sudden transport, cost to 600, hp to 350
bullfrog, cost to 700, hp to 350, damage to 12
IFV, to aa-only, cost 600, hp to 300, deal 39 with three rockets every .9 seconds multigun-weapon system damage deals damage equivilent to the infantry, unless anti-infantry infantry (peacekeeper, damage 35/50 rof 1, conscript damage 7 rof .2, imperial warrior damage 5 rof .111)

sea wing, cost to 700, hp to 300, damage 5 rof .111, 8 rof .111 at sea, no missiles, never submerges, has normal transform time, air speed as fast as vindicator
twinblade, cost to 800, x3 the cooldown time on missle barrage, hp to 400 mg damage to 7 rof .2

yari mini-sub cost to 700, hp to 350, damage 35 rof 1, kamikaze deals 200
hydrofoil, cost to 700, hp to 350, damage to 9 rof .133, two required for weapon lockdown

Tier 2
Striker, cost to 1000, hp to 450, ground rof 1, air damage 75 rof 1, air speed as fast as twinblade/cryocopter
Cryocopter, cost to 1200, hp to 450, damage x0.9, shrink beam lasts 5 seconds, cooldown 35 seconds, shrunken large vehicles are small vehicle size

---Tanks. Tier 2

ROF 3.5
Hammer 105, ability switch time to 1.8 seconds
Guardian 120, ability switch time to 3
Tsunami 140, hp 420, ability deactivation time to 3

---Special Units, Tier 2

Crazy Ivan: plant mines on civilian structures that will silently detonate 10 seconds after occupied
Spy: bribe, cost $5000 (two heavy tanks is a value of $8000, $4000 enemy loss and $4000 unit gain)
Shinobi: smoke bomb, allows stealth for all shinobi in the radius for 7 seconds, lose stealth on attack, ninja star used only on dog/bear/bug CD 20 seconds (AA??)
dog/bear/bug sniffs out all stealth/disguise/bombs

infiltration targets and effects:
Construction yard and Tier 3 tech building: steal $3500 and disable enemy power for 40 seconds, if Crazy Ivan then destroy structure, if Spy then grant vision of all enemy units for 15 seconds, if shinobi then survive and live to run away
Super Reacter: can start a 20 detonation timer, agent will survive this, no special activation (120 second cooldown)
Superweapon: timer reset, no special activation, shinobi lost
Crusher Crane: donate $3500, agent dies, do not pas go (shinobi lost)

250 hp, 10 second build time
Tesla Trooper cost 700, damage 100 rof 3.3
Cryo Trooper cost 800, damage in cryobeam form dealing x0.45, tank range
Wave-Force Trooper cost 750, damage 75 rof 4, tier 1 turret range

cost 400 build time 5 seconds infantry armor
Terror Drone two required for lockdown, hp 75, built from war factory or naval shipyard
Dolphin hp 150 rof 1.5
Rocket Angel hp 200 damage 120, three required for lockdown

---Aircraft

apollo moves as fast as mig, AT3 moves as fast as the apollo did
Mig cost 1200, hp 400, damage 115 rof 1.3
Apollo cost 1000, hp 400, damage 20 rof .25
Dragon cost 1500, hp 650, damage 15 rof 0.133

Vindicator, one bomb, 360 damage, 10 second reload

all heavy bombers are now the speed of century bomber, hp 750, reload 15 seconds
will unload all bombs in one drop, patterns are circles touching, have ability return to base
Badger 16 bombs, 140 damage each (grid, aoe .9 hammertank) cost 2000
Century 4 bombs, 550 damage each (square, aoe 1 hammertank) cost 2000
HBT2 7 bombs, 200 damage each (a hexagon, aoe .7 hammertank) cost 1500 hp 650

---Elite Tanks, Tier 3

Desolator Tank damage 10 rof .11 (needs to be fast enough to close in on a mirage tank within 1 second) [just give a hammer tank tires and a new gun]
Mirage Tank damage 175 rof 2.5
Steel Ronin

---Artillery, Tier 3

300 hp
V4 damage 400, rof 7, cost 1200, 10 second build time, AoE deals full damage, ability deals 150 gun damage
Athena damage 600, rof 9, cost 2000, 20 second build time, AoE equal to V4
Wave-Force damage 550, rof 8, cost 1800, 20 second build time, always fire to full range, prevent the unit from auto-fireing through allies (strict up everyone's AoE ff)

---Heavy Vehicles, Tier 3

Apocolypse hp 2500 cost 2500
Destroyer hp 2300 cost 2500
King hp 2400 cost 2500

---Navy

Tier 2

Gunboat, hp 1200, cost 1500, utility unit do not mass, use them to force your opponent to water
damage cannon type, projectile speed [V4 speed x1.2], range [80% artillery], multi-projectile innacuracy
(old transport with a katyusha on it) damage 17 (16 shots) rof 7
(old small battleship with two turrets of two guns) damage 60 (4 shots, aoe .4ht, shot spread 1.5ht) rof 6
(frigate with grav-repulsion torpedos, cannot hit subs) 200 (1 shots) rof 5
should specify floating torpedo can hit land targets, will float over all turrain including sheer walls

Tier 3

Cruiser cost 2500

Dreadnought
Aircraft Carrier
Shogun Battleship

---Fastball
Kirov
Battle Fortress
Giant Squid

---------------------------------------
Top Secret Protocols removed

Super Weapons.
with top secret protocols removed, everyone is getting a tier 1 superweapon.
cost, tier 1 2500, tier 2 3500, tier 3, 5000
build time 20, 30, 40
Power 50, 75, 100
Cooldown 330, 360, 390 seconds
build time
Empire
Tier 1: Point Defense Drones (lasts 90 seconds)
Tier 2: Final Squadron 1, cost 2000, power 35
Tier 3: Psionic Decimator

Soviets
Tier 1: Iron Curtain (lasts 18+3 seconds)
Tier 2: Satellite Drop 2, timing of one
Tier 3 Vacuum Imploder

Allies:
Tier 1: Cryoblast
Tier 2: Chronosphere
Tier 3: Proton Collider

Unit Super weapons
Aircraft Carrier, EMP missile
Desolator Tank, ability sprays Desolation around the tank and sickles in the AoE are affected by toxic corrosion
(something)

[Qnemes]

Originally posted by Cat:

There's so many things wrong with the balance, I'll start with soviets:
-conscripts do next to 0 damage
-flak troopers are a joke
-sickle is worst at what it's good at
-bullfrog is just sad
-hammertank is ***king ugly
-apocalypse not having AA is unforgiveable
-tesla coil priced at $1500 is just silly compared to the spectrum tower
-sentry gun is just awful, can easily be destroyed before anyone noticed it exists
-kirov is too slow and the afterburners damage it, not really useful compared to other expensive aircraft
-MiGs could have been better than what they are
-their construction method, though the most realistic, is the worst among the 3, the enemy knows where and can attack it before it is complete.

A lot of newbish takes, jeez.

[Cat]

Originally posted by Qnemes:

Originally posted by Cat:

There's so many things wrong with the balance, I'll start with soviets:
-conscripts do next to 0 damage
-flak troopers are a joke
-sickle is worst at what it's good at
-bullfrog is just sad
-hammertank is ***king ugly
-apocalypse not having AA is unforgiveable
-tesla coil priced at $1500 is just silly compared to the spectrum tower
-sentry gun is just awful, can easily be destroyed before anyone noticed it exists
-kirov is too slow and the afterburners damage it, not really useful compared to other expensive aircraft
-MiGs could have been better than what they are
-their construction method, though the most realistic, is the worst among the 3, the enemy knows where and can attack it before it is complete.

A lot of newbish takes, jeez.

prove them wrong