Not sure about the gameplay, help me figure out my thoughts

[Germanic Tigress]

So I was recommended this game by a friend. We're both into Soulslike games and rpg's in general, though he warned me this may be a bit different and different is right. I do like exploring and finding secrets and lore in games and what I've been able to see in 80 minutes has been pretty interesting so far, though I'm admittedly a little worried and not sure how to feel about the gameplay, since combat feels very binary honestly, like vanilla Skyrim levels, if not more simple. The only things that have even hit me are the brains in the archives which oneshot me with lingering aoe effects lol (I assume I'm not supposed to be there). So I'm wondering what people think about the game, as someone that hasn't played dungeon crawlers that are like this, is it something I can get into solely on character development and worldbuilding/exploration? Do the pros carry the game well or am I likely to become bored? Reviews are kinda all over the place so I'm looking to see what people thought about the game and what kept them engaged and coming back to the game.

I should also mention I think I have a pretty decent attention span, if a bit obsessive sometimes, if attention span is needed. Just kinda on the fence about this one and am not sure about keeping it just yet. Was either this or Blacktail (Baba Yaga Archery game).

I will also say one positive thing for me is how much the game has given me Arx Fatalis memories/vibes.

[vile]

It's not a soulslike at all. It's just a dungeon crawler. This is what they're all like. If it's not something you're into, it's not going to change down the road.

[Deadweight]

imo no, the pros don't carry it. it's missing a lot of what made its inspirations good.

for worldbuilding, it's kind of lacking and they completely ruin it later on. if you can be a bit obsessive i'm assuming you'll want to gather and explore everything, which will make some areas a bit miserable since they're just massive empty rooms. combat is lacking since once you get speed everything is trivial, and elements were poorly thought out (it's mostly dark+fire and light, and light/fire are the only ones worth using).

if you haven't played king's field or shadow tower, should give those a shot. for new stuff, monomyth and neverlooted are more promising, esp since you mention arx. neither is out yet, but they've both got demos up so you can try them and see what you think

[Bankai9212]

Ignoring the post above, as vile mentioned it isn’t a souls like. You are rewarded with careful exploration, if you want ideas in terms of stats def isn’t worth it due to other stats and resistance short of going over 100.

[Kituss]

Worldbuilding is decent - you'll get almost no character development, though, and you'll only get a bit of worldbuilding if you read every book and item description, kind of like a Souls game. It's a cool world that they've crafted, but it's nothing too unique and I think it's kind of all over the place. Combat is fine if a bit lacking and unbalanced, with magic being miles above melee in terms of efficiency. What you've seen of the combat is what the whole game is like, with "high-tier" melee weapons being mostly high damage and some projectile ones. "High-tier" magic is multiple hits, area of effect, high damage and destroys about everything the game can throw at you.

IMO, what absolutely carries the game is atmosphere and exploration. It's very fun to just go around and explore, pumping your speed and dex stats to move faster and jump higher, using spells to dash in every direction... The areas all feel different and can be downright scary ; my first time exploring the Temple of Silence was very tense, and the ones added in 1.0 are great as well. What Deadweight said about them being "massive empty rooms" isn't really accurate since there's almost always stuff to find tucked away in some corner or another.

If you're into that, and if you liked Arx Fatalis, I think you should push it a bit further. Especially if you're choosing between this and Blacktail which I didn't really enjoy (although that seems to be an unpopular opinion)!

[Bankai9212]

^thing with arx is that outside of the immersive elements and magic melee is even worse in that game.

[Deadweight]

Originally posted by Bankai9212:

Ignoring the post above,

How about you let the OP decide, instead of you wanting to decide for them? Just because you don't like my opinion doesn't mean that it won't possibly be helpful for them. I looked at their questions and gave input, noted that they mention arx and suggested some other games that they might enjoy and can try for free since they're on the fence about keeping this.

It's not like it's false that this game loves it's oversized empty rooms (sanguine, battlefield, arena) or that there are systems that are a literal straight downgrade to a ps1 game (item use, compared to shadow tower), the elements, etc.

[Irantu]

I found the game good for a playthrough or two, but the lack of build variety and the simplicity of the combat can't really carry it all the way through. It takes way too long for magic to be even remotely viable and the enemies can't properly react to ranged combat at all.
Exploration is fine for the first round, but many of the late areas are unfinished and there's nothing to find outside of humping walls and searching for hidden doors.
I somewhat regret buying it for 14€, because it doesn't feel like the game has enough content or replayability to warrant the price-tag.

[Bankai9212]

Originally posted by Irantu:

I found the game good for a playthrough or two, but the lack of build variety and the simplicity of the combat can't really carry it all the way through. It takes way too long for magic to be even remotely viable and the enemies can't properly react to ranged combat at all.
Exploration is fine for the first round, but many of the late areas are unfinished and there's nothing to find outside of humping walls and searching for hidden doors.
I somewhat regret buying it for 14€, because it doesn't feel like the game has enough content or replayability to warrant the price-tag.

I somewhat agree with replayablity, I think if classes outside of vampire, undead had something unique to them would be great. But you can have random enemies placement and items by inputing a !random when making a character.

[Germanic Tigress]

Originally posted by Irantu:

I found the game good for a playthrough or two, but the lack of build variety and the simplicity of the combat can't really carry it all the way through. It takes way too long for magic to be even remotely viable and the enemies can't properly react to ranged combat at all.
Exploration is fine for the first round, but many of the late areas are unfinished and there's nothing to find outside of humping walls and searching for hidden doors.
I somewhat regret buying it for 14€, because it doesn't feel like the game has enough content or replayability to warrant the price-tag.

Sounds like a lot of the charm of the game is nostalgia for things that I never played/experienced.

[Germanic Tigress]

Originally posted by Deadweight:

imo no, the pros don't carry it. it's missing a lot of what made its inspirations good.

for worldbuilding, it's kind of lacking and they completely ruin it later on. if you can be a bit obsessive i'm assuming you'll want to gather and explore everything, which will make some areas a bit miserable since they're just massive empty rooms. combat is lacking since once you get speed everything is trivial, and elements were poorly thought out (it's mostly dark+fire and light, and light/fire are the only ones worth using).

if you haven't played king's field or shadow tower, should give those a shot. for new stuff, monomyth and neverlooted are more promising, esp since you mention arx. neither is out yet, but they've both got demos up so you can try them and see what you think

Dunno how I would play Kingsfield or Shadowtower, but the Monomyth suggestion looks pretty alright. The other one's artstyle was a bit offputting for me.

[Germanic Tigress]

Originally posted by Kituss:

Worldbuilding is decent - you'll get almost no character development, though, and you'll only get a bit of worldbuilding if you read every book and item description, kind of like a Souls game. It's a cool world that they've crafted, but it's nothing too unique and I think it's kind of all over the place. Combat is fine if a bit lacking and unbalanced, with magic being miles above melee in terms of efficiency. What you've seen of the combat is what the whole game is like, with "high-tier" melee weapons being mostly high damage and some projectile ones. "High-tier" magic is multiple hits, area of effect, high damage and destroys about everything the game can throw at you.

IMO, what absolutely carries the game is atmosphere and exploration. It's very fun to just go around and explore, pumping your speed and dex stats to move faster and jump higher, using spells to dash in every direction... The areas all feel different and can be downright scary ; my first time exploring the Temple of Silence was very tense, and the ones added in 1.0 are great as well. What Deadweight said about them being "massive empty rooms" isn't really accurate since there's almost always stuff to find tucked away in some corner or another.

If you're into that, and if you liked Arx Fatalis, I think you should push it a bit further. Especially if you're choosing between this and Blacktail which I didn't really enjoy (although that seems to be an unpopular opinion)!

Kinda depressing in a way, but perhaps viewing it as a walking simulator with light rpg elements will allow me to think about it differently, since that's what I'm getting out of all this. I do enjoy a nice walking sim sometimes.

[Deadweight]

Originally posted by Kituss:

What Deadweight said about them being "massive empty rooms" isn't really accurate since there's almost always stuff to find tucked away in some corner or another.

A few specific areas definitely like this
- Sanguine sea has very little hidden away and most of your time there will be spent walking with nothing to look at, def "giant empty room"
- Forlorn arena is 1/3 giant empty room, 1/3 mostly-empty hallways, and 1/3 okayish. The earth section didn't even have anything tucked away unless you find the fake walls, did it?
- Half of Fetid Mire is three oversized mostly-empty rooms and the other half is the underworks
- Holy Battlefield has literally one thing in it and zero reason to be as big as it is for that reason

Originally posted by Germanic Tigress:

The other one's artstyle was a bit offputting for me.

Yeah, pretty cartoony and has a few things that can feel out of place, assuming that's what you mean. Was still enjoyable though. Noticing and avoiding a trap that apparently got a bunch of other people felt pretty nice

[vile]

idk, the skeleton/abyssal demon corridor was pretty hidden in the blood sea, as was the dark rapier and the column potion.

and really, what's wrong with "big empty rooms"? it's a claustrophobic dungeon crawler, the endless room concept exists to shake it up and instill a completely different type of anxiety.

[Germanic Tigress]

Getting a lot of non-answers. I'm just going to play more of the game and see what it has to offer, having come to the conclusion that it's a glorified atmospheric walking sim (and that's okay, I like some walking sims).

[vile]

Originally posted by Germanic Tigress:

Getting a lot of non-answers. I'm just going to play more of the game and see what it has to offer, having come to the conclusion that it's a glorified atmospheric walking sim (and that's okay, I like some walking sims).

if what you're looking for is "what engaged you", it's pretty much just exploring and the references to other games I liked a lot. combat doesn't get much better- once you crank speed or dex you can dodge just about anything and that pretty much trivializes combat.

But it's fun. I like running around and finding new paths to new areas with new stuff. I like seeing strange stuff and trying to figure out what it is/how to engage with it.

i liked the first time i ran into the saguine sea and saw the elephant ticks. i liked the weird moon freaks and the creepy mummies. i liked the nasty bloody forest with princess mononoke references.

i just generally enjoy the game, but like almost every dungeon crawler it's about the journey, not the battles.