URGENT! Uncooked beans are poisonous

[Selieca]

Beware! Many beans are poisonous when raw. Beans need to be cooked at least at a simmer for at least 20 minutes to break down the toxins.

Depending on the type of bean a small amount of raw bean can be tolerated fine, or else will only make you ill. But for some types of bean a medium amount of the raw bean will make you ill enough to need urgent medical attention, and can even be enough to kill. Please can this be changed in game to make sure that raw beans are never eaten!

And before anyone grumbles that I'm being pedantic, I know that this is just a game. But this is one of those bits of real-life info that can literally physically harm people who aren't in the know.

[dissent]

I'm sure that Clanfolk not allowing raw beans to be eaten will help to counter the epidemic of people all around the globe who succumb to eating raw beans. I've been around for more than 60 years and have never heard of anybody getting ill from not cooking beans. I'm going to take a flier that it's not a very serious problem irl.

[TechRabbit]

Broad beans/ fava beans which are the ones in game are fine raw as long as they are in "food doses"

[Selieca]

@TechRabbit Green Beans that originate in the Americas? Or Fava Beans that were much beloved by the Romans and Egyptians and who's very name is Italian? In 1300 Scotland?

Well done

[TechRabbit]

Originally posted by Selieca:

@TechRabbit Green Beans that originate in the Americas? Or Fava Beans that were much beloved by the Romans and Egyptians and who's very name is Italian? In 1300 Scotland?

Well done

Fava beans are what a broad bean is. It was considered the poor man's food in medieval times and everyone consumed it.

[Selieca]

@dissent Stats on total food poisonings that I could find:

- In the US alone 28,000 people are hospitalised, and 3,000 die each year
- It was hard to find what proportion of that was from Beans but the percentage I did find put it at 4% (vs 48% caused by meat and fish). That gives 5120 hospitalised and 120 dead due to beans
- The stats didn't break down any further so exact causes of illness is unknown. So sure some of that could be from things like Salmonella, but bacteria like Salmonella are killed by the cooking *sooner* than the heat destroys the toxins. So if your raw beans have Salmonella on them then your body just gets a double-whammy.

Even if the number of cases due to the actual toxins is only 10% of the above number then that's still a dozen people dead a year and hundreds hospitalised, in the US alone.

https://www.cdc.gov/foodsafety/food-poisoning.html

Welcome to the 21st Century, where most people only come into contact with tinned beans, which are already cooked and sterilised as part of the tinning process. But for the few people who do decide to buy raw beans, those beans are genuinely dangerous until they are cooked.

Just because you personally haven't come across an issue doesn't mean that the issue doesn't exist.

[Selieca]

Originally posted by TechRabbit:

Fava beans are what a broad bean is. It was considered the poor man's food in medieval times and everyone consumed it.

Even in modern times they only really grow as far north as Fife. The 1300 were the start of the "little ice age" and were cooler than even a century ago. They did not grow Fava in Scotland in the 1300.

[dissent]

Originally posted by Selieca:

Even if the number of cases due to the actual toxins is only 10% of the above number then that's still a dozen people dead a year and hundreds hospitalised, in the US alone.

How many of those people play Clanfolk, or would be saved by Clanfolk not allowing the eating of raw beans? I'll even give you the answer: it's zero. It's a game. People do not generally take food preparation advice from video games.

I can guarantee you, a lot more Americans die from guns than from all food poisoning deaths combined. Should there be no guns in video games either?

[TechRabbit]

Originally posted by Selieca:

Originally posted by TechRabbit:

Fava beans are what a broad bean is. It was considered the poor man's food in medieval times and everyone consumed it.

Even in modern times they only really grow as far north as Fife. The 1300 were the start of the "little ice age" and were cooler than even a century ago. They did not grow Fava in Scotland in the 1300.

"What we produce. We produce beans in Scotland – field beans. Field beans are the same species as broad beans but they are a different variety producing smaller beans. They are more vigorous and reliable than broad beans and show better cold tolerance."

They are the same species as the broad bean and there is lots of evidence that they were grown all up the eastern coast of Scotland.

[Selieca]

Originally posted by TechRabbit:

"What we produce. We produce beans in Scotland – field beans. Field beans are the same species as broad beans but they are a different variety producing smaller beans. They are more vigorous and reliable than broad beans and show better cold tolerance."

They are the same species as the broad bean and there is lots of evidence that they were grown all up the eastern coast of Scotland.

You quote a regional educational charity talking a bout a new (IE about 50 years old) variety of bean that is only just hardy enough to grow in Scotland today, and you say that's evidence that the less hardy variety would have grown at a time when it was 3 degrees cooler than it is today? All so you can keep pushing the idea that eating raw beans is fine, because this particular variety can be whereas most would make you seriously sick?

And all this to push back at me asking for raw beans to be treated the same way as raw fish, IE not to be eaten unless the person is absolutely starving.

[Blorf]

Hi, these are Broad Beans, sometimes called Fava Beans as well. When I was doing the research for this update, these were the beans that came up as prevalent for 1300's Scotland.

These were listed as peasant food, and the peas on the other hand were for the higher ups.

I gave a quick review on raw fava beans as well and apparently it is fine to eat them pod and all when they are small. BUT, it looks like older ones can indeed be toxic if enough are eaten.

In game, eating them raw would also be mostly an emergency thing as the Cooking Pot takes care of them for Pottage for the most part, and later the Hearty Stew. I am going to add some notes to the description to make it clear to only eat small young beans.

I did some reading just now and it look like Broad Beans are quite hardy and will germinate as low as 2C. So I think definitely within artistic license to have these in Scotland and these are a pretty good bean choice. They were available at the time, historically what the poor fold ate, and quite hardy.

I appreciate the note. I did not know beans were toxic when raw, so I will add that to the description. Who knows, this may save someone someday.

[Blorf]

Originally posted by Selieca:

Originally posted by TechRabbit:

"What we produce. We produce beans in Scotland – field beans. Field beans are the same species as broad beans but they are a different variety producing smaller beans. They are more vigorous and reliable than broad beans and show better cold tolerance."

They are the same species as the broad bean and there is lots of evidence that they were grown all up the eastern coast of Scotland.

You quote a regional educational charity talking a bout a new (IE about 50 years old) variety of bean that is only just hardy enough to grow in Scotland today, and you say that's evidence that the less hardy variety would have grown at a time when it was 3 degrees cooler than it is today? All so you can keep pushing the idea that eating raw beans is fine, because this particular variety can be whereas most would make you seriously sick?

And all this to push back at me asking for raw beans to be treated the same way as raw fish, IE not to be eaten unless the person is absolutely starving.

Hi, I am late to the convo, but wanted to assure you that I am going to treat the raw beans like raw meat. I have a system in place for that and will add notes to the description

[Darmondmazual]

Originally posted by Selieca:

Originally posted by TechRabbit:

"What we produce. We produce beans in Scotland – field beans. Field beans are the same species as broad beans but they are a different variety producing smaller beans. They are more vigorous and reliable than broad beans and show better cold tolerance."

They are the same species as the broad bean and there is lots of evidence that they were grown all up the eastern coast of Scotland.

You quote a regional educational charity talking a bout a new (IE about 50 years old) variety of bean that is only just hardy enough to grow in Scotland today, and you say that's evidence that the less hardy variety would have grown at a time when it was 3 degrees cooler than it is today? All so you can keep pushing the idea that eating raw beans is fine, because this particular variety can be whereas most would make you seriously sick?

And all this to push back at me asking for raw beans to be treated the same way as raw fish, IE not to be eaten unless the person is absolutely starving.

gonna put in my two cents worth here, Selieca I am not against disccusion etc about the foods and what is or is not ok (I mean I did the other day about bread and got schooled) but same time I feel like you made a mountain out of a mole hill.
first I doubt anyone who plays this game is gonna be impressionable enough to go eat raw DRIED beans.
second many people pointed out that the bean that is in game is actually edible raw and you refused to listen and kept kicking up a fuss nobody was attacking you but you where refusing to listen in the name of maybe some sort of safety, next time you interact I might suggest a bit more humility instead of being so pushy this was not an end of world scenario and a quick google search is enough to figure that out I had to do it myself when I noticed beans in game and actually thats how I learned that beans even existed in Europe before the exchange (bloody teachers lied to me when I was young ... tax dollars at work there)
it is ok to be strong in your convictions but next time try to be a bit more flexible and listen to others you might learn something new that way and you will make more friends that way too

[Chai]

To think that I may have been poisoning myself because I've been eating raw green beans in cruditee because my doctor told me it was healthy ...
(tongue in cheek)

[Philtre]

Originally posted by Chai:

To think that I may have been poisoning myself because I've been eating raw green beans in cruditee because my doctor told me it was healthy ...

Green beans (string beans) should be fine. Fun fact: they are only distantly related to broad beans/fava beans, the species in the game.

Originally posted by Darmondmazual:

actually thats how I learned that beans even existed in Europe before the exchange (bloody teachers lied to me when I was young ... tax dollars at work there)

Your teachers weren't lying, they were oversimplifying. If you are in the US, when people say "beans" they are almost always thinking of one of the P. vulgaris cultivars (kidney beans, pinto beans, black beans, navy beans, green beans...), not of the various bean/pea species native to Eurasia/Africa.

[TechRabbit]

Originally posted by Philtre:

I highly disagree with this. There are large areas of America that is not as ignorant as those across the ocean seem to think. There is quite a large gardening movement in America and a lot outside of the city centers know more than you give us credit for.