What is the value of this game being full 3D: terribly done narrative.

[Clown Reemus]

As it reads, what was the point of making the game into a 3D with incredibly clunky and un-directed cutscenes, low-effort (or not effort?) voice acting as well as weak dialogues which do not fit the time-period and don't try to mimic the manner of speech at least of the British of that period?

This is an honest question, because, if we take the aforementioned away, the game is just a card game/battler. There is no reason to transfer it into a demanding and complex 3D environment if everything else except the battles (which work the same even if they were 2D). Is this the first studio's game? I do not see any other reason for why they would go for 3D environment when they have no skill to match, to really reveal the potential of it.

What's worse, the disclaimer/trigger warning at the start just betrays how little confidence and, probably, authenticity developers have in their narrative. There is nothing to be ashamed of in truth, but is everything presented here really "the truth", as in historical facts of the period? Or is it just another loosely based in the European past American game with very little effort done into depicting it authentically, truthfully, with the help of historians and documents? I don't know yet, I've just seen the first few cutscenes... but my inner thaumaturgy is telling me my time is better spent elsewhere.

[Clown Reemus]

A Russian soldier talks to the protagonist a says... "gimme a sec" - whoever wrote this game cannot call themselves a "writer", it would be incorrect in any and all semantic senses. Bonus content: https://imgur.com/a/4FqswXH



When asked whether the boots the protagonist wears are warm, the player can say "yes, they are". Five seconds later, this escalates into a fight without asking the player if they want to actually confront the opponents - the choices are written arbitrarily, cheaply and without any regard to some sort of literary and logical coherence.

I'm doing everyone a favour, and also doing one for myself and closing the youtube tab. Enough damage done to my sense of taste in art.

[Geruhn]

Originally posted by Clown:

A Russian soldier talks to the protagonist a says... "gimme a sec" - whoever wrote this game cannot call themselves a "writer", it would be incorrect in any and all semantic senses.

When asked whether the boots the protagonist wears are warm, the player can say "yes, they are". Five seconds later, this escalates into a fight without asking the player if they want to actually confront the opponents - the choices are written arbitrarily, cheaply and without any regard to some sort of literary and logical coherence.

I'm doing everyone a favour, and also doing one for myself and closing the youtube tab. Enough damage done to my sense of taste in art.

The guy wants your boots so obviously there will be a fight or do you want your protagonist to walk around in his socks? What options do you expect? Talk him down to just walk a mile in your boots so they can really appreciate how warm they really are? Or did you take it as a random compliment from a guy friend instead as a not-very-subtle threat to part with your shoes?

[Clown Reemus]

Originally posted by Geruhn:

Originally posted by Clown:

A Russian soldier talks to the protagonist a says... "gimme a sec" - whoever wrote this game cannot call themselves a "writer", it would be incorrect in any and all semantic senses.

When asked whether the boots the protagonist wears are warm, the player can say "yes, they are". Five seconds later, this escalates into a fight without asking the player if they want to actually confront the opponents - the choices are written arbitrarily, cheaply and without any regard to some sort of literary and logical coherence.

I'm doing everyone a favour, and also doing one for myself and closing the youtube tab. Enough damage done to my sense of taste in art.

The guy wants your boots so obviously there will be a fight or do you want your protagonist to walk around in his socks? What options do you expect? Talk him down to just walk a mile in your boots so they can really appreciate how warm they really are? Or did you take it as a random compliment from a guy friend instead as a not-very-subtle threat to part with your shoes?

It was not written well and explicit to be taken as a clear sign of hostility, especially since the protagonist didn't say anything to promote hostility between the parties. It was done by a third party, and, somehow (for the sake of convenience, and convenience is a poor writing, always) was also dragged into the fight.

Regardless, this is just one example, but was more than enough for me to see what kind of "choices" and winding-up for them this game has.

[Hecks]

If this is the developer's first game then it's a commendable effort. I find it more enjoyable than the latest AAA offerings...

[Clown Reemus]

Originally posted by Hecks:

If this is the developer's first game then it's a commendable effort. I find it more enjoyable than the latest AAA offerings...

Most AAA games have just as weak of a narrative, it's indie titles that try really hard to have a believable, accurate and authentic story and time periods.

[Geruhn]

Originally posted by Clown:

Originally posted by Geruhn:

The guy wants your boots so obviously there will be a fight or do you want your protagonist to walk around in his socks? What options do you expect? Talk him down to just walk a mile in your boots so they can really appreciate how warm they really are? Or did you take it as a random compliment from a guy friend instead as a not-very-subtle threat to part with your shoes?

It was not written well and explicit to be taken as a clear sign of hostility, especially since the protagonist didn't say anything to promote hostility between the parties. It was done by a third party, and, somehow (for the sake of convenience, and convenience is a poor writing, always) was also dragged into the fight.

Regardless, this is just one example, but was more than enough for me to see what kind of "choices" and winding-up for them this game has.

What else could the guy have meant when he stared at you and said "Nice boots, bet they are warm!"?

[Clown Reemus]

The actual meaning of it? This is a moot argument which doesn't address the larger issues at hand, anyhow.

[Geruhn]

Originally posted by Clown:

The actual meaning of it? This is a moot argument which doesn't address the larger issues at hand, anyhow.

Well, you're arguing it's bad writing and that you should have options and that it's a weird way to rectify them fighting a second afterwards, so I was assuming you had another interpretation of his remark in mind. Like "Oh, I thought he was just telling me that I have nice boots and that he would ask me to tell him the shop that I got them from." cause how else could you argue it's bad writing if there's no other way of interpreting it?

[Clown Reemus]

Originally posted by Geruhn:

Originally posted by Clown:

The actual meaning of it? This is a moot argument which doesn't address the larger issues at hand, anyhow.

Well, you're arguing it's bad writing and that you should have options and that it's a weird way to rectify them fighting a second afterwards, so I was assuming you had another interpretation of his remark in mind. Like "Oh, I thought he was just telling me that I have nice boots and that he would ask me to tell him the shop that I got them from." cause how else could you argue it's bad writing if there's no other way of interpreting it?

There are at least two ways to interper it - directly, literally, and as an insult. But it's semantically impossible to structure what they tell each other as an insult, because it's just a simple answer that says "yes my boots are warm, thank you". This could be seen as normal courtesy in any other situation EXCEPT that, where it was, somehow, by the game, interpreted as a sign the player wants to fight. It's contextually a bad writing, not even bad in-game writing but just a terrible way to let the player know they are about to insult someone by literally answering their question honestly.

[Clown Reemus]

https://imgur.com/a/4FqswXH

[White sun]

Originally posted by Clown:

The actual meaning of it? This is a moot argument which doesn't address the larger issues at hand, anyhow.

My guy, if you think that a deserter, freezing and broke is asking about your boots out of curiosity, I dunno what to tell you. It's very obious that if you remark that "they are indeed warm", you are teasing and goading the deserter.

People killed for good boots back in the day. Literally.

[Clown Reemus]

Originally posted by White sun:

Originally posted by Clown:

The actual meaning of it? This is a moot argument which doesn't address the larger issues at hand, anyhow.

My guy, if you think that a deserter, freezing and broke is asking about your boots out of curiosity, I dunno what to tell you. It's very obious that if you remark that "they are indeed warm", you are teasing and goading the deserter.

People killed for good boots back in the day. Literally.

This is a nice argument, except the game is supposed to provide all that context to us. We know all of this meta-contextually, because we understand the historical and social reality that the game is set in. But it does next to nothing to establish ANYTHING, except the in-your-face "Pride" choice, that these people would be anrgy and rash enough to attack you over... no wait a second, none of this matters because they attacked you BECAUSE ANOTHER GUY said something to them, and you were just there, watching.

It's just terribly done, terribly convenient writing which has next to zero expertise in it. I cannot make a sound argument in defense of whatever happened just in the first scene of this game.

[Xeawn ~Rafa~]

I mean, I guess that comes down to your personal experiences somewhat? Where I’m from, if I’m out walking and someone approaches me and goes “hey my man lemme see that watch for a minute” or “that’s a nice coat, looks real warm” with the tone of voice these guys were using, I know I need de-escalate the situation or lose my property.

For me, the moment the scene started I was like “Really though? You good?”, I knew these men were looking to rob Wiktor right away and that this was going to serve as a tutorial fight.

To each their own, the writing doesn’t suit your personal tastes, but to me it’s been perfectly clear and an interesting narrative to watch unfold. It’s worth giving the game another shot and some time; I find it particularly charming and refreshing in a way most recent offerings haven’t been.

I love this indie sphere of game development; give me a small team doing their best over a triple A studio churning out another copy of everything else out there any day.

But again, to each their own.

[Clown Reemus]

Originally posted by Xeawn ~Rafa~:

I mean, I guess that comes down to your personal experiences somewhat? Where I’m from, if I’m out walking and someone approaches me and goes “hey my man lemme see that watch for a minute” or “that’s a nice coat, looks real warm” with the tone of voice these guys were using, I know I need de-escalate the situation or lose my property.

For me, the moment the scene started I was like “Really though? You good?”, I knew these men were looking to rob Wiktor right away and that this was going to serve as a tutorial fight.

To each their own, the writing doesn’t suit your personal tastes, but to me it’s been perfectly clear and an interesting narrative to watch unfold. It’s worth giving the game another shot and some time; I find it particularly charming and refreshing in a way most recent offerings haven’t been.

I love this indie sphere of game development; give me a small team doing their best over a triple A studio churning out another copy of everything else out there any day.

But again, to each their own.

I am not talking about a subjective taste for writing, but about objective tools and methodology that have to go into quality writing. None of it is here, in Thaumaturge.

[Isseus]

It's truly astounding how they made an UE5 game look like Skyrim with a bad 3rd person mod.