Amazing graphics, instant motion sickness

[Truffles]

I'm fine for over an hour in games like MSFS, Elite:Dangerous, etc doing all sorts of acrobatic stuff. <5 minutes in this and I had to remove my headset.

Locking the camera to the horizon might help, but every paddle stroke was shaking my head around and it was just too much.

I wanted to like this so, so very much and you've really done something amazing with the visuals that I've not seen anywhere else. The chill vibe of this is exactly how I'd want to unwind at the end of the day. But I just couldn't do it.

[Stellar]

Originally posted by Truffles:

I'm fine for over an hour in games like MSFS, Elite:Dangerous, etc doing all sorts of acrobatic stuff. <5 minutes in this and I had to remove my headset.

Locking the camera to the horizon might help, but every paddle stroke was shaking my head around and it was just too much.

I wanted to like this so, so very much and you've really done something amazing with the visuals that I've not seen anywhere else. The chill vibe of this is exactly how I'd want to unwind at the end of the day. But I just couldn't do it.

That's unfortunate to hear, it'd been a while since anyone mentioned motion sickness but that doesn't mean it doesn't affect certain people. We do have a bunch of options listed in the accessibility settings in the menu, have you tried messing with those to see of any of them work for you?

[wrOngplanet]

Originally posted by Truffles:

I'm fine for over an hour in games like MSFS, Elite:Dangerous, etc doing all sorts of acrobatic stuff. <5 minutes in this and I had to remove my headset.

Locking the camera to the horizon might help, but every paddle stroke was shaking my head around and it was just too much.

Same here.

I noticed this only happens when the kayak is turning (and I with it). Thus I notice it with every paddle stroke as you do. But if I only turn my head left/right, it's completely fine. Same when just going straight forward, that's fine too.

I'm not exactly sure what it is, probably some very slight stutter when the kayak is turning. It's kinda subtle but also very noticeable as it's nauseating or headache-inducing in the longer run (longer than a few minutes. Btw I play Half-Life Alyx for an hour or a bit more at a time just fine. Continuous motion, hand direction, snap turns, shift teleport. Also Elite Dangerous, but I haven't played that for a long time).

Otherwise it's amazing!

Kinda similar to some games that stutter if you strafe in VR, except that is a worse stutter (physically moving side-ways, as in strafe). I can't off the top of my head name any games atm, but I've noticed it before, sometimes even in Steam VR. But not lately (maybe they fixed it? I haven't used VR for quite a while except lately).

My system is not the newest and a bit of a bastard, but basically:
Windows 10 Pro, 64-bit
Intel i7-4790
32 GB RAM
GTX 1080 Ti
Oculus Quest 1

It's the same whether I use Oculus Link via USB, or Virtual Desktop via WiFi (except that VD over WiFi has it's own issue with a periodical stutter every minute or so, unrelated to games).

I haven't messed with settings and forgot to check SteamVR settings. Will have to do that later.

[wrOngplanet]

So, I've been trying the demo a bit more lately. This isn't a comprehensive test btw, there's so many settings to try I get lost.

TL;DR: I tend to write a bit long-winded it seems, The OP put it very short and concisely;

every paddle stroke was shaking my head around and it was just too much.

And that's exactly it !

(The below is basically just some speculation)

But it's not really easy to pin point exactly why that is. I think I have a vague idea - I might be wrong of course:

There might be an ever-so-slight de-sync between left and right eye when the kayak rotates, and in particularly during paddling on one side at a time (as you have to), thus also making the kayak rotate a little bit.

This is different from when you sit still and just turn your head btw, that works fine! Problem is when you rotate with the kayak. Just gliding forward is also fine.

With Oculus Air Link, I also noticed a similar thing even when not paddling but only had the kayak gliding and turning left or right (holding one paddle down on one side of the kayak). Similar but not exactly the same, more like a stutter now and then.

in VD that was basically (almost?) gone, except for when I paddled. Much better but not ideal in the long run.

Maybe the issue is not with the game, but the VR system somehow? Like with how it calculates rotation in particular and then left / right displays. Idk, just an idea.

Btw not really physical rotation of the HMD, it's only if the HMD rotates in-game and not physically. Maybe that's somehow an issue? (which may be game related again).

I don't play other vehicle VR games atm, so can't compare from fresh memory. Pretty sure I've seen similar things before with regards to turning, so it's not just this game.

In-game graphics options didn't make much difference. Except maybe the highest on some settings, but generally from Epic to Low was the same. I did not try the in-game pixel density setting btw, just kept it at default.

Afaik I don't have framerate issues at 72 Hz (I have to really confirm that later, so this might be a little bit premature post. But it looks fine to me). I also have not meddled with Air Link or VD's encode bitrate etc.

The game otherwise is absolutely great and looks amazing! With some nice touches, like the kayak tilting when you move your body (head) from side to side etc.

[grzegorz77]

Originally posted by wrOngplanet:

So, I've been trying the demo....

Quest 1 and quest 2 do not send an image like normal goggles, you can think of it as too thin a cable (the image is compressed). Therefore, your feelings with the graphics may be different than those who use goggles that normally send the image (without loss of quality).

Tracking is enough too, but nothing more. What you can see in many games.

edit:
Turn a blind eye and don't bother with it. The value for money is excellent.

[wrOngplanet]

Originally posted by grzegorz77:

Originally posted by wrOngplanet:

So, I've been trying the demo....

Quest 1 and quest 2 do not send an image like normal goggles, you can think of it as too thin a cable (the image is compressed). Therefore, your feelings with the graphics may be different than those who use goggles that normally send the image (without loss of quality).

Tracking is enough too, but nothing more. What you can see in many games.

edit:
Turn a blind eye and don't bother with it. The value for money is excellent.

No, that's not it. Has to be something else. I play Half Life Alyx for an hour or more at a time, and I played Elite Dangerous also for hours with no such issue, and others (Vector 36, DiRT Rally, Raw Data, Euro Truck Simulator 2, just to name a few). HL:A is current, the others are a while ago.

As it is now I can play it for maybe 30 minutes? Haven't really timed it, actually I think that's stretching it. At the cost of getting woozy for the rest of the day. Just think of it like somebody put a sandpaper machine to your head every time you paddle. Just without the sandpaper, just powerfully vibrating the head. Value for money :P

(I agree the game looks gorgeous, it's almost great. Except for that).

[grzegorz77]

Originally posted by wrOngplanet:

Originally posted by grzegorz77:

.....

No, that's not it. Has to be something else. I play Half Life Alyx for an hour or more at a time, and I played Elite Dangerous also for hours with no such issue, and others (Vector 36, DiRT Rally, Raw Data, Euro Truck Simulator 2, just to name a few). HL:A is current, the others are a while ago.

As it is now I can play it for maybe 30 minutes? Haven't really timed it, actually I think that's stretching it. At the cost of getting woozy for the rest of the day. Just think of it like somebody put a sandpaper machine to your head every time you paddle. Just without the sandpaper, just powerfully vibrating the head. Value for money :P

(I agree the game looks gorgeous, it's almost great. Except for that).

I did not notice this effect on rift(cv1) and q2.
But I already have very strong vr legs.

This could be a tracking issue.

I thought my tracking was excellent with 2 tracking sensors.
Until I played the game, where in the car I changed gears (not the front rear and similar, but a total manual transmission). It turned out that I could not change gears smoothly. When I bought a third sensor and directed it lower, everything started to work.

The same problem arises, for example, with a hip holster on the back in boneworks. For people using weaker than perfect tracking. It was the same in the first goggles when you reached for the arrows to the bow.

That's why I think that the problem is to be with tracking.
Maybe try to keep your hands more forward, higher, and closer to each other. I don't remember where your goggles have better tracking.


This can also be a performance problem.

Try lowering the resolution in the oculus settings (in a computer program). There was a possibility of lowering to 80% or something similar. Sudden dynamic head movements can make the graphics card and other components breathless.

[wrOngplanet]

Interesting. That's a possibility I guess. Usually I can play a session (an hour or so) with no problem, but I have lost tracking sometimes. I guess I could try to brighten the room up a bit and see if that helps (inside-out tracking).

I often have to adjust the guardian as well btw, it seems to shift some 10-20 cm some times.

Boneworks, I don't think I have a powerful enough system to really run it. I always end up quitting in the tutorial area somewhere. That one is worse than this title (I tried it a few days ago, but I have to hold that off. Maybe until I upgrade my computer some time).

I think I have kinda good VR legs? I have noticed it's been a bit worse than it used to be but it's getting better again now (I think). That might be because I didn't really play VR for quite some time. I only begun enjoying it again a couple of months ago, and have been playing through HL:A twice in a row (and begun a 3rd). That was after ~1/2 year off VR, and in the time before that I only used it very seldom for a long time.

Then again there's stuff even in 2D gaming I hate and turn off, otherwise I get nausea as well. Like head bobbing or screen shakes. The game Outer Worlds have this very subtle head bobbing that I actually can tolerate, but it's better to turn it off anyway. A couple of other games I absolutely can't is "Chaser" (You can turn off head bobbing IIRC, but not the screen shakes), or the boost screen shake for the Mako in Mass Effect 1 LE (at least there's a mod for that). Just a couple of games that came to mind atm.

Could also be a performance problem as you say. I'll try your suggestions next time, thanks!

[grzegorz77]

Originally posted by wrOngplanet:

Interesting. That's a possibility I guess. Usually I can play a session (an hour or so) with no problem, but I have lost tracking sometimes. I guess I could try to brighten the room up a bit and see if that helps (inside-out tracking).

I often have to adjust the guardian as well btw, it seems to shift some 10-20 cm some times.

Boneworks, I don't think I have a powerful enough system to really run it. I always end up quitting in the tutorial area somewhere. That one is worse than this title (I tried it a few days ago, but I have to hold that off. Maybe until I upgrade my computer some time).

I think I have kinda good VR legs? I have noticed it's been a bit worse than it used to be but it's getting better again now (I think). That might be because I didn't really play VR for quite some time. I only begun enjoying it again a couple of months ago, and have been playing through HL:A twice in a row (and begun a 3rd). That was after ~1/2 year off VR, and in the time before that I only used it very seldom for a long time.

Then again there's stuff even in 2D gaming I hate and turn off, otherwise I get nausea as well. Like head bobbing or screen shakes. The game Outer Worlds have this very subtle head bobbing that I actually can tolerate, but it's better to turn it off anyway. A couple of other games I absolutely can't is "Chaser" (You can turn off head bobbing IIRC, but not the screen shakes), or the boost screen shake for the Mako in Mass Effect 1 LE (at least there's a mod for that). Just a couple of games that came to mind atm.

Could also be a performance problem as you say. I'll try your suggestions next time, thanks!

I think boneworks should work for you. 1080 in connection q1 should not have any problems.
Intel i7-4790 should be sufficient, especially if you do not have problems with cooling and it works well in turbo mode.

You can also consider putting on a huge cooling, maybe some used from an old workstation like the m450 fujitsu, such a huge cooling can cause operation in turbo mode all the time. But don't take my word for it because it worked with 4590 not 4790. (Paying for some huge noctua cooling or something like that is too much in my opinion.)

The museum is in some strange way tiring more than the next stages. Perhaps it is wortht, somehow to finish by force.
The next level: the streets are very demanding for the cpu and ram. But in the next ones it should be much better.


Index has inside-out tracking it has nothing to do with it, I do not remember the details, but it's probably about the cameras, probably quest 2 and quest 1 have the usual cameras like ps3 move (There, too, the type and direction of light was very important).

My goggles have ir cameras, with special filters. Index probably too, I do not know how it is in wmr never considered their purchase, because for me the most important thing has always been the quality of tracking.

But I write it more as a curiosity.

[Tombstone]

I'm actually in exactly the same boat (pardon the pun) , I regularly play entire 4 or 5 hour long sessions in Asgards Wrath, Lone Echo, Saints and Sinners etc without feeling any nausea at all but when I play the demo of this I get terrible nausea within minutes. I havent yet managed to nail down why.

The game does look absolutely stunning though and performance is superb.

[Nytra 👾]

Try sitting!

[derSanitoeter]

I played it since first test release until now and have no motion sickness.

this game is ment to be played SITTING.

standing in this game is a big NOPE for me. my legs woulds try to fight against the kayaks movement and everything goes mad in my ears and brain. no stability, motion sickness.

used a quest 1 (now sold), quest 2 and reverb g2 with it.

[Tombstone]

For those saying to try sitting, I was sitting when I got the nausea. In fact the only difference I can think of between Kayak and all the dozens of hours of VR I've done and not had nausea is that I was standing in all the other VR games. 100+ hours of standing with VR and no nausea, truth be told, it might actually BE the sitting which is giving me the nausea.

[grzegorz77]

Originally posted by Tombstone:

For those saying to try sitting, I was sitting when I got the nausea. In fact the only difference I can think of between Kayak and all the dozens of hours of VR I've done and not had nausea is that I was standing in all the other VR games. 100+ hours of standing with VR and no nausea, truth be told, it might actually BE the sitting which is giving me the nausea.

No.

edit:
("it might actually BE the sitting which is giving me the nausea.")

[Tombstone]

Originally posted by grzegorz77:

Originally posted by Tombstone:

For those saying to try sitting, I was sitting when I got the nausea. In fact the only difference I can think of between Kayak and all the dozens of hours of VR I've done and not had nausea is that I was standing in all the other VR games. 100+ hours of standing with VR and no nausea, truth be told, it might actually BE the sitting which is giving me the nausea.

No.

edit:
("it might actually BE the sitting which is giving me the nausea.")

No it isnt the sitting giving me the nausea? Or no to something else?

[andi9x17]

Same. The graphics are really cool. But game gives me really bad motion sickness. I was sitting. Played about 8min and felt, I am about to vomit ASAP. Was really hyped for this game. But due to the clipping graphics it adds additional sickness to the game.

My PC is quite powerful:
i7 10700K @5.1GHz
32GB RAM
2070 Super