Machine Guns are insane

[Malecite]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wOJew4XEvo&t=1578

Go to the 26 min mark and watch what the MG42 does to 3 spaced squads....

I'm all for counter blobs, but I mean good God, not only did they add a ridiculous amount of suppression but the AOE is enormous.

I played a match as USF vs Wehr who spammed MGs and it was probably the most frustrating early game ever. Mortars with smoke work to a point, but the horizontal traverse speed is so fast, and the pin instantaneous. Once he had a reinforce point I mean trying to out micro multiple MGs that are constantly reinforced was just cancerous. The USF also has no real indirect fire so....

I can say for sure that blobs are not going to be as big of an issue going forward.

[Katitoff]

I guess its good that maps have shot and LOS blockers and are not one big flat pancakes, while all 4 factions have access to early smoke.

Oh, and you can NOT have blob control tools that will not be effective against single squads.

Decide what you like more, blob warfare or ability to stop them.

[Malecite]

Originally posted by Katitoff:

I guess its good that maps have shot and LOS blockers and are not one big flat pancakes, while all 4 factions have access to early smoke.

Oh, and you can NOT have blob control tools that will not be effective against single squads.

Decide what you like more, blob warfare or ability to stop them.

You don't think buffing the traverse speed, the suppression, and making it so it hits the entire screen was a bit too much? A 42% traverse speed increase means it's way more difficult to actually try and flank MGs now.

Also USF seems to struggle against this more than the Brits due to the fact that the mortar is the only indirect fire weapon.

The smokes got heavily nerfed and when you are talking multiple machine guns where 1 minor mistakes means the squad is effectively removed from play... Well my micro just isn't that good. Maybe yours is.

[birdhouse]

I think the MGs are over buffered. What they should do is just make it longer for the suppressed team get recovered, and add slight suppression ability to the infs, help MGs suppress infs. This would stop the blob mostly and avoid players to spam MGs.

[Growlanser]

Just go to show you people will never be pleased.

[Malecite]

Originally posted by Growlanser:

Just go to show you people will never be pleased.

I mean they could have done some of those "iterative changes" they talked about. Instead MGs got a health buff, traverse buff, suppression buff, area buff, and a smoke nerf with a cost and build time reduction for some factions.

It feels a bit over the top right now, the MG42 in particular, if it even sees the squad you are instantly suppressed, pinned 2s later, and the squad is dead unless it retreats. The issue is there is no counter play, you can't even get a smoke from a mortar in time to save the squad, it's done. The additional 3s to suppression recovery time is also... interesting.

In the video the time from entering the MG42s arc to pinned is 4-5seconds with the squad losing half its health.

[The Holy Ghost - Its Fight Night]

MG's are significantly over tuned. I am all for stopping blobs. But they went way too far with the MG's. And there are other ways to stop the blobbing... like making other options not SUCK. Like the Dingo... absolute trash unit, can't even kill snipers at point blank range.

[GenericUsername]

start using smokes. you get get usf smokes at 30 munitions. I appreciate these changes. it forces people to play out of their comfort zones. I would rather hard counters be exactly that otherwise that's the point. running into a hmg's cone of fire should be punishing.

for USF you can use the 4x4 jeep to get around the map pretty well. Its good at forcing team weapons to reposition.

It will shake up the early game when unit variety is limited. but smoke and reposition and try to use less common routes. Best of luck with the new meta. its an adjustment for sure.

[Bullied by Pigeon]

They are fine learn to smoke . Mg are supposed to stop multiple squads in thier arc.. u cant just blob a move into it without smoke.

[Mr.Earl]

I would say that mgs right now are closer to what they were in coh and coh2, and they're not a liability. They're supposed to be used for area denial, which they weren't doing before the patch.

[ShodaN]

Originally posted by Malecite:

You don't think buffing the traverse speed, the suppression, and making it so it hits the entire screen was a bit too much? A 42% traverse speed increase means it's way more difficult to actually try and flank MGs now.

How so? Traverse speed is just how quickly the MG is capable of switching targets within its already set up arc. A real flank against an MG would come from outside that arc. The time it takes to pack up and reposition remained the same.

Besides as the video also shows, switching targets means suppression wears off on the original target rather quickly now as opposed to CoH2 where you could apply bursts of suppression, then keep the target suppressed and out of the fight with regular small arms fire. I find that arguably even more powerful.

Originally posted by Malecite:

Also USF seems to struggle against this more than the Brits due to the fact that the mortar is the only indirect fire weapon.

You also have other options like snipers and abilities. The scout squad you start with gives you a way to spot and plan against MGs right away and it can be upgraded for smoke and flares for example. You can also opt for sprint on Rifles to help out.

Originally posted by Malecite:

The smokes got heavily nerfed and when you are talking multiple machine guns where 1 minor mistakes means the squad is effectively removed from play... Well my micro just isn't that good. Maybe yours is.

In that scenario, the 30 to 20 second duration nerf shouldn't play that much of a role as some well placed smoke should force an immediate reaction no matter what.

[(✺ω✺)chupacabra]

mg was over-buff

[The Holy Ghost - Its Fight Night]

Originally posted by __++__==:

Oh wow, an MG suppresses hard when units are in the open....

Originally posted by The Holy Ghost - Its Fight Night:

MG's are significantly over tuned. I am all for stopping blobs. But they went way too far with the MG's. And there are other ways to stop the blobbing... like making other options not SUCK. Like the Dingo... absolute trash unit, can't even kill snipers at point blank range.

Sounds like unlucky RNG to me.

There is no denying how over tuned it is lol. Especially in team games. I see top 300 rank players spamming them now. 4+ MG's each. Certain factions have no good way round that. Brits for example have only the mortar smoke as a counter. No sniper, no smoke grenades, no good light vehicles

Some tweaking is definitely needed. Maybe keep the suppression stats the same, but lower the killing power, and reverse the health buff. Coz right now, there are two issues.

1. if you only get 1 or 2 units behind the MG for a flank, you can't kill it most of the time. Both units could grenade it, and be shooting from optimal range, and the MG will still escape. Plus MG's can sit there and take far too many mortar shots now. Heck, even with the reinforcement nerfs, they can reinforce as fast as they lose models.

2. it has become viable to just spam MG's instead of infantry. Because they pin + kill. Are so cheap, and build so quickly.

[Bullied by Pigeon]

All weapon drops in game should be like in coh2.. decrewed.. and also should require los.. this will keep usf paradrop mg abuse in check.. its like they dont respect the old choices in previous games..

[Blick Winkel]

I think now they're pretty similar to how they were in coh2 and 1. What's the problem, you can't head-on with a blob anymore?

[JASON BOURNE]

Originally posted by Malecite:

Originally posted by Katitoff:

I guess its good that maps have shot and LOS blockers and are not one big flat pancakes, while all 4 factions have access to early smoke.

Oh, and you can NOT have blob control tools that will not be effective against single squads.

Decide what you like more, blob warfare or ability to stop them.

You don't think buffing the traverse speed, the suppression, and making it so it hits the entire screen was a bit too much? A 42% traverse speed increase means it's way more difficult to actually try and flank MGs now.

Also USF seems to struggle against this more than the Brits due to the fact that the mortar is the only indirect fire weapon.

The smokes got heavily nerfed and when you are talking multiple machine guns where 1 minor mistakes means the squad is effectively removed from play... Well my micro just isn't that good. Maybe yours is.

wow you dont know scout and pathfinders have smoke grenades while brits dont have anything as easy access as usf?