What weapon types are best in this game?

[Lampros]

Still trying to get a feel for what each weapon types do...

[Butcher]

Royal/chaos weapons/shields giving bonus to exp gains are the best and worth every coin.

Weapon types with least amount of rolls are the best. Among them, shocking and armor penetrating ones get the preference (shock on everything, AP mostly on ranged).

[Gilmoy]

I log every weapon I see!
Anyways, most heroes will be stuck with the weapon of their best stat.
Within that subset of weapons, the one with highest base damage usually wins.

1. Weapon damage scales with "level", which is roughly the enemy level you had to kill for it.
Equivalently, it's the minimum level of monsters in the town's region where you bought it.

+ Starter town with L0 monsters = L0 weapons, with 6-9 max damage
+ L2-ish weapons (as loot from L2 monsters) = 10-12 damage
+ L4-ish weapons = 16-18 damage
+ L6-ish weapons = 20-30 damage
Towns and regions seem to cap out at L6 (in Chapter I and II).

Then scale that by the number of skill pips.
For a 1-skill weapon like a Dagger, divide damage by about 2, so 13 or so.
For a 5-skill weapon like a Greataxe, add +25% or so, which gets you to high-30s.
For a breakable weapon, add +40% or so, up to low-40s. They're good while they last.

Any large weapon can have a Heavy option, with up to +50% of normal max damage.

2. Different primary stats have weapons with different typical sets of abilities.

2.a) Strength = mostly Single Target attacks, no gimmick
1H swords = edge { Slash (basic damage), Slice (Bleed) }, point { Stab (Ignore Armor) }
axes = { Chop (basic), Armor Smash (Down Armor = -10 or so) }
2H swords = { Slash, Heavy, Cleave (Slice) }, no stabbing

2.b) Vitality = blunt weapons, Single Target, no gimmick
Stool, Club, Mace, Hammer, Morning Star = { Bash (Daze), Stun }
2H Greathammer, Troll Club = { Bash, Heavy, Pound (T-splash + Daze) }

2.c) Intelligence = T-splash, Area, and elemental ailments
wand = { Zap (Ignore Resist*), friendly buff/Cure/Rush }
staff = { Blast (T-splash + element), sometimes Ray/Bolt (Single) }
tome, spellbook = { Blast (see above), Storm (Area + Corrupts the tiles) }

Your big AoE Shock or other groovy ailments will be the INT Tomes.

2.d) Awareness = Column, Area, some Cleave
bows = { Pierce (Ignore Armor), Penetrating (Column), Volley (Area + Ignore Armor) }
handbow = { Knock Back/Recoil (Push 1 + Daze) }
spears = { Poke (basic), Stab (Ignore Armor), Cleave (Slice), rarely Thrust (Column) }
poles = { Interrupt, Push (Push 1 + Daze), Cleave (Slice) }

Awareness specializes in Column attacks to sack some QBs fast.
Keep a spare Spear with a Cleave attack, in case that's more useful 1 time in 30.

2.e) Talent = gimmick ranged weapons
rangs = 2-skill { Row }, so even an off-Talent guy can use them well
guns = 1-skill whatever
bombs = 1-skill T-splash with a Secondary Action, so you can still attack with a Primary
No lutes yet.

Reload is now a Secondary Action, so guns shoot 1 per round, yours and theirs.

2.f) Speed = assassin-type weapons
dagger = { Shank (Ignore Armor), Cut (Bleed), Evade Up } = Goblin Scrapper

2.g) Luck = toys
Toy Warhammer = { Ignore Resist: Bop (20 + Daze), Bonk (22 + Stun), Biff (24 + Confuse) }

As amusing as this weapon is, it's actually quite terrifyingly OP.
Almost no other weapon combines very good damage, Ignore Resist, and Stun-lock.
If you see it in Night Market, buy it! That's why you keep those +Luck items!

~~~~

The single biggest weapon I have so far is a Pearl Staff with all 5-Intelligence attacks:
+ Water Storm (-5% Accuracy), Area 0-20 Magical + Corrupts tiles with Wet(ness)
+ Protect All (-5% Accuracy) -- but you're not rolling a 5-Int perfect, boo
+ Heavy Water Bolt (-20% Accuracy), Single 0-60 Magical + (Your Corpse Is) Wet

With all of my Scholar's +Magic Damage, it does 0-80.
At 80 Int -20% = 60%, he averages 3 out of 5 successes, for "only" 48 Magic Damage.
That nicely one-shots healthy L4 Giant Spiders with 45 HP each.

He also carries spare Lightning AoE, Freeze AoE, Rush Group,
and even an Imp Wand with a 1-Int Zap to shoot down Evasives such as Bats.

[Lampros]

Originally posted by Butcher:

Royal/chaos weapons/shields giving bonus to exp gains are the best and worth every coin.

Weapon types with least amount of rolls are the best. Among them, shocking and armor penetrating ones get the preference (shock on everything, AP mostly on ranged).

So what weapons have the least amount of rolls? Obviously cannons but anything else? And is shock the best elemental type?

Originally posted by Gilmoy:

I

2. Different primary stats have weapons with different typical sets of abilities.

2.a) Strength = mostly Single Target attacks, no gimmick
1H swords = edge { Slash (basic damage), Slice (Bleed) }, point { Stab (Ignore Armor) }
axes = { Chop (basic), Armor Smash (Down Armor = -10 or so) }
2H swords = { Slash, Heavy, Cleave (Slice) }, no stabbing

2.b) Vitality = blunt weapons, Single Target, no gimmick
Stool, Club, Mace, Hammer, Morning Star = { Bash (Daze), Stun }
2H Greathammer, Troll Club = { Bash, Heavy, Pound (T-splash + Daze) }

2.c) Intelligence = T-splash, Area, and elemental ailments
wand = { Zap (Ignore Resist*), friendly buff/Cure/Rush }
staff = { Blast (T-splash + element), sometimes Ray/Bolt (Single) }
tome, spellbook = { Blast (see above), Storm (Area + Corrupts the tiles) }

Your big AoE Shock or other groovy ailments will be the INT Tomes.

2.d) Awareness = Column, Area, some Cleave
bows = { Pierce (Ignore Armor), Penetrating (Column), Volley (Area + Ignore Armor) }
handbow = { Knock Back/Recoil (Push 1 + Daze) }
spears = { Poke (basic), Stab (Ignore Armor), Cleave (Slice), rarely Thrust (Column) }
poles = { Interrupt, Push (Push 1 + Daze), Cleave (Slice) }

Awareness specializes in Column attacks to sack some QBs fast.
Keep a spare Spear with a Cleave attack, in case that's more useful 1 time in 30.

2.e) Talent = gimmick ranged weapons
rangs = 2-skill { Row }, so even an off-Talent guy can use them well
guns = 1-skill whatever
bombs = 1-skill T-splash with a Secondary Action, so you can still attack with a Primary
No lutes yet.

Reload is now a Secondary Action, so guns shoot 1 per round, yours and theirs.

2.f) Speed = assassin-type weapons
dagger = { Shank (Ignore Armor), Cut (Bleed), Evade Up } = Goblin Scrapper

2.g) Luck = toys
Toy Warhammer = { Ignore Resist: Bop (20 + Daze), Bonk (22 + Stun), Biff (24 + Confuse) }

As amusing as this weapon is, it's actually quite terrifyingly OP.
Almost no other weapon combines very good damage, Ignore Resist, and Stun-lock.
If you see it in Night Market, buy it! That's why you keep those +Luck items!

~~~~

The single biggest weapon I have so far is a Pearl Staff with all 5-Intelligence attacks:
+ Water Storm (-5% Accuracy), Area 0-20 Magical + Corrupts tiles with Wet(ness)
+ Protect All (-5% Accuracy) -- but you're not rolling a 5-Int perfect, boo
+ Heavy Water Bolt (-20% Accuracy), Single 0-60 Magical + (Your Corpse Is) Wet

With all of my Scholar's +Magic Damage, it does 0-80.
At 80 Int -20% = 60%, he averages 3 out of 5 successes, for "only" 48 Magic Damage.
That nicely one-shots healthy L4 Giant Spiders with 45 HP each.

He also carries spare Lightning AoE, Freeze AoE, Rush Group,
and even an Imp Wand with a 1-Int Zap to shoot down Evasives such as Bats.

Thanks for the comprehensive list!

A couple of follow-up questions:

1. In general, is a 1H/shield or 2H set-up better for front-line?

2. Is it more advantageous for casters to go single-target or AoE set-up?

3. Also, are 4-5 stat weapons worth it, given that you won't hit with them without a superabundant supply of Focus?

[Butcher]

Originally posted by Lampros:

Originally posted by Butcher:

Royal/chaos weapons/shields giving bonus to exp gains are the best and worth every coin.

Weapon types with least amount of rolls are the best. Among them, shocking and armor penetrating ones get the preference (shock on everything, AP mostly on ranged).

So what weapons have the least amount of rolls? Obviously cannons but anything else? And is shock the best elemental type?

Shortswords for str can have 2 rolls and armor penetration. Maces for vig sometimes have 2 aswell, glass ones can have 1 but risky and need saving up for final boss. 1 handed wands for int are excellent having 2 or even only 1 roll. 1 handed crossbows have 1 roll and can even have shock element.

1 handed weapons have large advantage of shield, making backline untargettable.

[Lampros]

Originally posted by Butcher:

Originally posted by Lampros:

So what weapons have the least amount of rolls? Obviously cannons but anything else? And is shock the best elemental type?

Shortswords for str can have 2 rolls and armor penetration. Maces for vig sometimes have 2 aswell, glass ones can have 1 but risky and need saving up for final boss. 1 handed wands for int are excellent having 2 or even only 1 roll. 1 handed crossbows have 1 roll and can even have shock element.

1 handed weapons have large advantage of shield, making backline untargettable.

Thanks! You are actually leading me to the next question with your final sentence! ;) Would you say overall 1H/shield is a better set-up than 2H due to the ability to protect the squishies? Or does the damage boost of 2H trump the protection?

[Butcher]

Originally posted by Lampros:

Originally posted by Butcher:

Shortswords for str can have 2 rolls and armor penetration. Maces for vig sometimes have 2 aswell, glass ones can have 1 but risky and need saving up for final boss. 1 handed wands for int are excellent having 2 or even only 1 roll. 1 handed crossbows have 1 roll and can even have shock element.

1 handed weapons have large advantage of shield, making backline untargettable.

Thanks! You are actually leading me to the next question with your final sentence! ;) Would you say overall 1H/shield is a better set-up than 2H due to the ability to protect the squishies? Or does the damage boost of 2H trump the protection?

IMHO 2h mostly suck, both on front and backline, they have more rolls and therefore much less chance to get full damage. Maybe I got no good 2h though, they are somewhat randomly generated. The only good 2h weapons I found are starting mage tome (stacking mage candy and damage items you can get legit good damage in T pattern), necromancer tome (REALLY REALLY OP, the best weapon in the game, summon fat skeleton with fat damage every turn for a single roll) and some royal spear (penetrates to backline and exp bonus made it tolerable).

[Lampros]

Originally posted by Butcher:

Originally posted by Lampros:

Thanks! You are actually leading me to the next question with your final sentence! ;) Would you say overall 1H/shield is a better set-up than 2H due to the ability to protect the squishies? Or does the damage boost of 2H trump the protection?

IMHO 2h mostly suck, both on front and backline, they have more rolls and therefore much less chance to get full damage. Maybe I got no good 2h though, they are somewhat randomly generated. The only good 2h weapons I found are starting mage tome (stacking mage candy and damage items you can get legit good damage in T pattern), necromancer tome (REALLY REALLY OP, the best weapon in the game, summon fat skeleton with fat damage every turn for a single roll) and some royal spear (penetrates to backline and exp bonus made it tolerable).

I thought most caster weapons are 2H? There are actually 1H caster weapons?

Also, are spears 1H or 2H? I threw them away generally as soon as I got them, so no idea.

[Butcher]

Originally posted by Lampros:

Originally posted by Butcher:

IMHO 2h mostly suck, both on front and backline, they have more rolls and therefore much less chance to get full damage. Maybe I got no good 2h though, they are somewhat randomly generated. The only good 2h weapons I found are starting mage tome (stacking mage candy and damage items you can get legit good damage in T pattern), necromancer tome (REALLY REALLY OP, the best weapon in the game, summon fat skeleton with fat damage every turn for a single roll) and some royal spear (penetrates to backline and exp bonus made it tolerable).

I thought most caster weapons are 2H? There are actually 1H caster weapons?

Also, are spears 1H or 2H? I threw them away generally as soon as I got them, so no idea.

Wands are 1h, you can use shield with them. Some shields use attributes other than vigor too. Books and staves are 2h though.

Spears are mostly 2h, but I think I saw 1h spear once. If there is an icon with 2 hands holding sword it means weapon is 2h.

[Lampros]

Originally posted by Butcher:

Originally posted by Lampros:

I thought most caster weapons are 2H? There are actually 1H caster weapons?

Also, are spears 1H or 2H? I threw them away generally as soon as I got them, so no idea.

Wands are 1h, you can use shield with them. Some shields use attributes other than vigor too. Books and staves are 2h though.

Spears are mostly 2h, but I think I saw 1h spear once. If there is an icon with 2 hands holding sword it means weapon is 2h.

Ah, okay. I just saw low damage and sold them all. Since you are protected to some degree on the back-line, isn't 2H better anyways for casters?

[Butcher]

Originally posted by Lampros:

Originally posted by Butcher:

Wands are 1h, you can use shield with them. Some shields use attributes other than vigor too. Books and staves are 2h though.

Spears are mostly 2h, but I think I saw 1h spear once. If there is an icon with 2 hands holding sword it means weapon is 2h.

Ah, okay. I just saw low damage and sold them all. Since you are protected to some degree on the back-line, isn't 2H better anyways for casters?

For me having 4-5 rolls is the dealbreaker, most 2h caster weapons have 4 rolls.
Plus, 1h wands have excellent debuff effects that only work with full rolls (in particular shock wand forcing enemies to always fail 1 roll)
Plus, some shields add more evasion instead of armor or resists. Royal shields also help with leveling.

[Lampros]

Originally posted by Butcher:

Originally posted by Lampros:

Ah, okay. I just saw low damage and sold them all. Since you are protected to some degree on the back-line, isn't 2H better anyways for casters?

For me having 4-5 rolls is the dealbreaker, most 2h caster weapons have 4 rolls.
Plus, 1h wands have excellent debuff effects that only work with full rolls (in particular shock wand forcing enemies to always fail 1 roll)
Plus, some shields add more evasion instead of armor or resists. Royal shields also help with leveling.

I see. I will have to look more carefully at wands the next run then!

Also, isn't getting too much XP too soon not ideal, since enemies scale to your level and the rest of your gear won't likely catch up to your levels anyways?

[Butcher]

Originally posted by Lampros:

Originally posted by Butcher:

For me having 4-5 rolls is the dealbreaker, most 2h caster weapons have 4 rolls.
Plus, 1h wands have excellent debuff effects that only work with full rolls (in particular shock wand forcing enemies to always fail 1 roll)
Plus, some shields add more evasion instead of armor or resists. Royal shields also help with leveling.

I see. I will have to look more carefully at wands the next run then!

Also, isn't getting too much XP too soon not ideal, since enemies scale to your level and the rest of your gear won't likely catch up to your levels anyways?

I think they either scale to the lowest level or scale with time. On master I had times when enemies got higher levels than entire party. But I also had some heroes reaching level 9 while 1 was still level 7, enemies were still level 7 without scaling to 8 or 9. In any case, XP is very valuable to get to boss level earlier.