Experience from fighting Queens Guards

[dg55]

Do our characters receive experience from fighting the many Queens Guards periodic encounters? The latest two groups had 4 strong units and a troll with 162 hit points. I did not see any experience gain from these two tough battles.

[Army of Optimists]

Nope. It's a punishment, not a way to grind. You get no experience, no items, and no gold.

[Felky]

If you played FTL fighting those guys is pretty much the same as getting caught by the Rebels before reaching last sector. (minus the +1 fuel since legs don't run out of gas )

[BigSexy]

Originally posted by Army of Optimists:

Nope. It's a punishment, not a way to grind. You get no experience, no items, and no gold.

Understand this but it's actually insult to injury since I can't complete the 'Find the Husband' quest as the unit I need to get to is actually behind something else in the hex. I've been fighting these Queens Guards and explored all of the 1st part of the campaign before a dev told me they were aware of the bug. However, now I'm pretty much screwed because the next batch of Queen's Guard will probably finish me off since they keep getting stronger and my party weaker. Really too bad, I had a decent start if it had not been for the bug.

Maybe in a future patch they will allow players to toggle off this timer thingy so people can play at whatever pace they want.

[Felky]

Originally posted by BigSexy:

Originally posted by Army of Optimists:

Nope. It's a punishment, not a way to grind. You get no experience, no items, and no gold.

Understand this but it's actually insult to injury since I can't complete the 'Find the Husband' quest as the unit I need to get to is actually behind something else in the hex. I've been fighting these Queens Guards and explored all of the 1st part of the campaign before a dev told me they were aware of the bug. However, now I'm pretty much screwed because the next batch of Queen's Guard will probably finish me off since they keep getting stronger and my party weaker. Really too bad, I had a decent start if it had not been for the bug.

Maybe in a future patch they will allow players to toggle off this timer thingy so people can play at whatever pace they want.

That's unlucky with the bug yeah.
About the whole "punishment feature" though it's gonna be a 50/50 between the devs actually listening to the community's feedback and understanding that a lot of people would like to play this open-world game at the pace they want without feeling stressed/pressed to complete X Y Z quests.
Or if they're just gonna go with the easy/lazy answer that this is how the game is designed and they are sorry that you don't like it

[BigSexy]

Originally posted by Felky:

Originally posted by BigSexy:

Understand this but it's actually insult to injury since I can't complete the 'Find the Husband' quest as the unit I need to get to is actually behind something else in the hex. I've been fighting these Queens Guards and explored all of the 1st part of the campaign before a dev told me they were aware of the bug. However, now I'm pretty much screwed because the next batch of Queen's Guard will probably finish me off since they keep getting stronger and my party weaker. Really too bad, I had a decent start if it had not been for the bug.

Maybe in a future patch they will allow players to toggle off this timer thingy so people can play at whatever pace they want.

That's unlucky with the bug yeah.
About the whole "punishment feature" though it's gonna be a 50/50 between the devs actually listening to the community's feedback and understanding that a lot of people would like to play this open-world game at the pace they want without feeling stressed/pressed to complete X Y Z quests.
Or if they're just gonna go with the easy/lazy answer that this is how the game is designed and they are sorry that you don't like it :lookofdisapproval:

yeah agree 100%
Not sure about others, but I play these games for fun. The idea of a game 'punishing' me doesn't exactly sound like fun. Or at least have it optional to be punished, I know some might be into that sort of thing

[Army of Optimists]

The game isn't an open-world game, though. It's a digital boardgame. You have a very set objective and everything on the map serves to either help or hinder you in accomplishing it. The Queensguard timer is meant to spur you onward instead of combing every tile.

Don't read too much into the wording of "punishment" as some sort of torture feature. I meant it in the same way that, for example, an enemy with an unblockable attack is meant to punish players who turtle too hard. Every Chaos Timer variant is meant as a ticking clock to push the player towards completing the objective as soon as possible instead of dawdling.

Also, if you want to play the game at your own pace, there's already a slider when you start that allows you to adjust how fast the Chaos Timer ticks.

Not sure about others, but I play these games for fun. The idea of a game 'punishing' me doesn't exactly sound like fun. Or at least have it optional to be punished, I know some might be into that sort of thing

Every game has punishment features. If they don't, they aren't games. Even Minecraft has enemies that will kill you or Creepers that can blow up your base if you get careless. Those are punishments for not dealing with them.

[Loken Stoneheart]

Originally posted by Army of Optimists:

The Queensguard timer is meant to spur you onward instead of combing every tile.

The objective during that part is to comb almost every tile though.
I found my cart on the last tile searched in the zone, all while having my head caved in by trolls + their adds that give no items, experience, or loot.
I'd honestly say that part is extremely overtuned considering the objective you're tasked with-- First the prison break, then searching almost every tile of the whole zone.

[Cadmarcadlith the Hatless]

I need rewards from surviving guard attacks. It makes no sence that they have no money and stuff on them to loot. And no sence that party doesnt learn something from fighting strong enemires. It is bad concept. I want to explore the map. Even with rewards those guys would feel like punishment, but with no rewards they are a death sentence to adventuring and pleasure from playing the game.

[Butcher]

Originally posted by BigSexy:

Originally posted by Felky:

That's unlucky with the bug yeah.
About the whole "punishment feature" though it's gonna be a 50/50 between the devs actually listening to the community's feedback and understanding that a lot of people would like to play this open-world game at the pace they want without feeling stressed/pressed to complete X Y Z quests.
Or if they're just gonna go with the easy/lazy answer that this is how the game is designed and they are sorry that you don't like it :lookofdisapproval:

yeah agree 100%
Not sure about others, but I play these games for fun. The idea of a game 'punishing' me doesn't exactly sound like fun. Or at least have it optional to be punished, I know some might be into that sort of thing

Games are fun only for as long as you can lose. It is good to have some sort of losing state for doing badly.

What you are suggesting is no timer at all, let's imagine what would happen. Players will have literally endless time to grind, easily becoming overpowered ahead of difficulty curve. Therefore losing to combat state would be impossible. And what kind of other lose states would you have? None.

As we established, games where you can't lose are unfun and without timer pressing you into quick decisions balance breaks making encounters very easy. Is this explanation good enough for you why removing timer would be a horrible idea?

[Romanus]

I feel like this discussion stems from being done out of 2 different viewpoints:

1. Yes, games that give you time to explore can be good without "punishment". Gris has parts where you literally can't die in a scene where you are being hunted or something. It makes sense for games, where you would want to stay in a world for a prolonged time, where the characters are the focus and so on.

2. For the King is a challenging game that never wanted you to explore the multi merrits this world has to offer... since there aren't any. Everythign you find is meant to give you a small boost in reaching the finish line and the joy comes out of beating a game, that is meant to be hard. Failure always was a part in FtK 1 and it is normal to fail (though a bug shouldn't be the reason ofcourse).

While no one is wrong, I think it is important to listen to the second opinion. I gotta agree, that infinite time would brake FtK 2, even if you COULD fix it like with degressing XP-gain. The harsh time limit is meant to push you to your limits. If you don't like that, if you want to take your time, then FtK is probably not your cup of tea, which is ok.

This same discussion can be held with any soulslike, 4X-game and so on. There are games, that are meant to be punishing, hard, grindy. And there are games, that are meant to be chill. YOu jsut gotta find the right game dor your playstyle.

PS: One little thing: Yes, you have to search for Hildebrandt while the timer runs, but that doesnt mean that you SHOULD check every single tile. It is meant as a risk/reward thing, manage to open up the most parts of the map without wasting too many rounds and not loosing your party members. A thing that can help with that is the Vision-Scroll, which can, if well used, cover up a whole dead end for you not to explore.

[Lagrossebête]

Originally posted by Spirit of Madness:

I need rewards from surviving guard attacks. It makes no sence that they have no money and stuff on them to loot. And no sence that party doesnt learn something from fighting strong enemires. It is bad concept. I want to explore the map. Even with rewards those guys would feel like punishment, but with no rewards they are a death sentence to adventuring and pleasure from playing the game.

But you CAN explore the map :) Its just a risk / reward feature.
I agree with you that it is fustrating that the guard doesn't give loot or xp, it is not "logical" but, there is probably a good reason for that :D

You guys will go over this guard thing, you just need to fail a retry some more times... like i finally finished the chapter 1 after 4 tries, on novice.. so .. yeah ^^

[Felky]

Originally posted by Butcher:

Games are fun only for as long as you can lose. It is good to have some sort of losing state for doing badly.

As we established, games where you can't lose are unfun

Cookie Clicker wants to know your location.
I have never seen someone "establish" stuff like that and be so confident about it while being so wrong.
Fun is subjective and everyone finds it at his own door; and there is no "right way" of having fun.
Relax with your decrees.

[Butcher]

Originally posted by Felky:

Originally posted by Butcher:

Games are fun only for as long as you can lose. It is good to have some sort of losing state for doing badly.

As we established, games where you can't lose are unfun

Cookie Clicker wants to know your location.
I have never seen someone "establish" stuff like that and be so confident about it while being so wrong.
Fun is subjective and everyone finds it at his own door; and there is no "right way" of having fun.
Relax with your decrees. :bern:

I don't know what you wanted to achieve by bringing up cookie clicker, it is some kind of low effort ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ that can't be even called a game, literally worse than power point presentation visual novels that sometimes can have lose state.

I am baffled by all players who think that losing means game bad. No my dude, it means YOU are bad and should git gud. Your first reaction should be wondering "how can I win": either by getting better, by clever use of items or by finding bugs and glitches. You got that brain (hopefully), go ahead and use it.

[Felky]

Originally posted by Butcher:

Your exemple is invalid because it's invalid low effort wtf omg

Cool post.

Cookie Clicker and Clicker Heroes are two videogames that 15,497 players are currently enjoying while I'm typing this reply.
Those games cannot be lost which invalidates your point completely so I understand the frustration of being wrong but the "lol dude wtf are you on about" argument is really weak in a debate especially on text.

[Butcher]

Originally posted by Felky:

Originally posted by Butcher:

Your exemple is invalid because it's invalid low effort wtf omg

Cool post.

Cookie Clicker and Clicker Heroes are two videogames that 15,497 players are currently enjoying while I'm typing this reply.
Those games cannot be lost which invalidates your point completely so I understand the frustration of being wrong but the "lol dude wtf are you on about" argument is really weak in a debate especially on text. :leaSmug:

I pity them, I really do. Still, even if billions of flies will sit on a pile of crap they won't make it chocolate.