When to Vassalize, Raze, Absorb, or Convert?

[Walrus Clan (Wally)]

When do you decide to vassalize, raze, absorb with current pop, or convert newly conquered territory?
I'm especially trying to think through my process for vassalizing this city that is on the border of my current vassals land. I'm wondering if I should vassalize them as well or if it would be better to Raise and then take over that land eventually with my current vassal.

[アンジェル]

Originally posted by Walrus Clan (Wally):

When to Vassalize, Raze, Absorb, or Convert?
When do you decide to vassalize, raze, absorb with current pop, or convert newly conquered territory?
I'm especially trying to think through my process for vassalizing this city that is on the border of my current vassals land. I'm wondering if I should vassalize them as well or if it would be better to Raise and then take over that land eventually with my current vassal.

For general questions you can get only general answers. For that specific question of yours I recommend you share details and a screenshot of the world map.

[Darkfireslide]

Absorb is best for capitols that have large pops

For good alignment vassalage gets more money long term than razing

For evil alignment vassalage is risky because your vassal will hate you so it's better to raze and just get the cash influx for your main cities

[アンジェル]

Originally posted by Paladin Dark:

For evil alignment vassalage is risky because your vassal will hate you so it's better to raze and just get the cash influx for your main cities

The mali only lasts around 8 turns. Then it is like any other vassal, as long as you sway their allegiance.

There is also the Imperium perk which gives +20 gold permanent income for razing, to be taken into consideration.

[Teutorix]

Originally posted by アンジェル:

Originally posted by Paladin Dark:

For evil alignment vassalage is risky because your vassal will hate you so it's better to raze and just get the cash influx for your main cities

The mali only lasts around 8 turns. Then it is like any other vassal, as long as you sway their allegiance.

Also synergises nicely with the shadow perk that gives research for having your whispering stone with a vassal

[Everynone]

Raze -> Rebuild -> Vassalize -> Rinse -> Repeat

[Malaficus Shaikan]

My way of thinking.
Am i going to use this city?
Yes: Absorb.
No: Vassalage.

[BLACKcOPstRIPPa]

Originally posted by Paladin Dark:

Absorb is best for capitols that have large pops

For good alignment vassalage gets more money long term than razing

For evil alignment vassalage is risky because your vassal will hate you so it's better to raze and just get the cash influx for your main cities

Depends how your playing...

I have 2 vassals and have pure evil, but my vassals are both my race and I don't except anyone into vassalage with good standing, they are evil just like me😊

Both of my vassals love and and are loyal so it depends if they share the same affinity with you and alignment, if they don't share that than yes they will hate you.

[BLACKcOPstRIPPa]

Originally posted by アンジェル:

Originally posted by Paladin Dark:

For evil alignment vassalage is risky because your vassal will hate you so it's better to raze and just get the cash influx for your main cities

The mali only lasts around 8 turns. Then it is like any other vassal, as long as you sway their allegiance.

There is also the Imperium perk which gives +20 gold permanent income for razing, to be taken into consideration.

This combined with what the other user said, raze rebuild rinse repeat works obviously extremely well.


But this has got to be a glitch that will eventually be patched.
The +20 for razing the first time is fine, but giving the player +20 for destroying the same city over and over is obviously an overlook on the devs part

[Wlerin]

Originally posted by BLACKcOPstRIPPa:

The +20 for razing the first time is fine, but giving the player +20 for destroying the same city over and over is obviously an overlook on the devs part

Why would they patch it? It hardly breaks anything. Keeping them as a vassal is stronger in the long run and while Gold is useful in the early game it quickly becomes irrelevant, especially if you are regularly razing large cities.

[BLACKcOPstRIPPa]

Originally posted by Wlerin:

Originally posted by BLACKcOPstRIPPa:

The +20 for razing the first time is fine, but giving the player +20 for destroying the same city over and over is obviously an overlook on the devs part

Why would they patch it? It hardly breaks anything. Keeping them as a vassal is stronger in the long run and while Gold is useful in the early game it quickly becomes irrelevant, especially if you are regularly razing large cities.

Unless they fixed it, and it's a one time reward, when the game first came out it was per turn.
So you raze it +20 a turn, couple turns later again, +40 per turn, couple turns later +60 per turn

It was WAY to OP, unless they fixed it and it's +20 everytime it's razed than it's just another perk at this point.

I didn't play this game back than but saw vids with people abusing it on twitch

[Wlerin]

Originally posted by BLACKcOPstRIPPa:

Originally posted by Wlerin:

Why would they patch it? It hardly breaks anything. Keeping them as a vassal is stronger in the long run and while Gold is useful in the early game it quickly becomes irrelevant, especially if you are regularly razing large cities.

Unless they fixed it, and it's a one time reward, when the game first came out it was per turn.
So you raze it +20 a turn, couple turns later again, +40 per turn, couple turns later +60 per turn

It was WAY to OP, unless they fixed it and it's +20 everytime it's razed than it's just another perk at this point.

I didn't play this game back than but saw vids with people abusing it on twitch

It still works the same way. My point is that was never "OP", it's strictly weaker than just taking them as a vassal and getting something like +40 Gold, +40 Research, +40 Mana, and +5 Imperium from them every turn. Likewise it's strictly weaker than making friends with other AIs and selling them all your trash gear.

It's also dwarfed by the 1-2k gold you get straight up for razing a developed city, especially since you can immediately use that gold to rush buildings, buy heroes, etc. whereas by the time you've made 1k from the +20/turn Gold won't matter anymore. There is absolutely no reason they need to change it, it's only decent in the first place. The other razing perks are much stronger.

[Aunty Herbert]

Originally posted by Walrus Clan (Wally):

When do you decide to vassalize, raze, absorb with current pop, or convert newly conquered territory?

I think the most important factor, whether to vassalize or to absorb, is your city cap. You can only have so many cities of your own, unless you invest oodles of imperium to raise the cap, so you want your cities to be good.
So, if the city is subpar positioned, it better not join your ranks, or gets kicked out once you have a better option.

The choice between vassalizing and razing is mostly the choice between getting a stack of gold (and evil alignment) now, or just harvesting the tithes from your vassals over time.

Converting is mostly what you do, if you already spent a lot on racial transformations, or the culture and race of the city you would like to have just doesn't fit your plans.

[~ Fabulous ~]

Raze: when I am evil and feels like defending the place bog me down

Vassalize: I do this as much as I can, because I do not want to babysit more than 3 city, plus they will give me more units for Rally of the Lieges.

Absorb/Convert: will never do this, why bother doing this when you can just build teleport outpost.

[Wlerin]

Originally posted by ~ Fabulous ~:

Absorb/Convert: will never do this, why bother doing this when you can just build teleport outpost.

Why: Because you unlocked Chrono Gates first and never took the Teleport perk because you thought it was inferior, and only realised several games later that it unlocked Teleporters on your Outposts.

[Aunty Herbert]

As I am too lazy to theorymath the "raze your own cities" strat all in my head, can someone who has done is list all the costs involved?
Which imperium perks do you need to or want to have to do it, which turn can you start doing it, how long does it take to complete one entire loop of razing and rebuilding, and how much imperium do you pay for that cycle?

Just from looking at my own unimpressive vassals, about 60 tithe of combined gold, mana, and research seems about average, so I would have to cycle one of them 3 times to get even by increasing the income of the capital by 60 gold. And unless there is a trick I missed, rebuilding bleeds imperium galore, right?