Anyone actually able to justify line dragon breath?

[Eldrin]

I can easelly make a case for cone and comet but line just seem flat out inferior. What it can hit is so low next to the other two and the 2 damage boost it gests is pretty much nothing. Anyone had success with it where you felt like oh line is way better? By success i do not mean that 1 fight out of 100 where you had that PERFECT line set up to not also hit your own guys.

Personally i feel like a way to make the line worth something is by not only it having the damage increase but it should also get a major boost to inflicting its status effect. Then it would feel more like a concentrated breath weapon.

[Malaficus Shaikan]

Outside of roleplay?
Not really.

[Cindeerella]

I’d pick line over cone breath any way. Cone just sucks ass of how close you have to be to enemies. And on higher difficulties it mostly means insta-death to your ruler. At lvl12 it’s kinda better but still meh. With line I can safely deal big chunk of damage, on 12 lvl it’s same AoE as Balor has just without that range. I still go comet 90% of the time. 10% for line . But I’d never pick a cone, lol no. I’m hitting 2-3 enemy units with standart line pretty much every fight. With 18x18 battles I can hit even more

If you want to hit a lot of enemies with line you need to relay on summons to force enemies in positions you need.

[Eldrin]

Originally posted by Bratty Doe:

I’d pick line over cone breath any way. Cone just sucks ass of how close you have to be to enemies. And on higher difficulties it mostly means insta-death to your ruler. At lvl12 it’s kinda better but still meh. With line I can safely deal big chunk of damage, on 12 lvl it’s same AoE as Balor has just without that range. I still go comet 90% of the time. 10% for line . But I’d never pick a cone, lol no. I’m hitting 2-3 enemy units with standart line pretty much every fight. With 18x18 battles I can hit even more

If you want to hit a lot of enemies with line you need to relay on summons to force enemies in positions you need.

I play brutal only and i never means death to the ruler, it will go in to melee sooner or later anyway. So i do not really agree with that argument at all.

I actually compared it to the balor aswell and the balor actually does more damage lol.

[Cindeerella]

Originally posted by Eldrin:

I play brutal only and i never means death to the ruler, it will go in to melee sooner or later anyway. So i do not really agree with that argument at all.

I actually compared it to the balor aswell and the balor actually does more damage lol.

Even t2 pikemen can delete as much as 20% hp with 2 attacks, especially flanking ones. In many Wonders there are t3-4 units that can delete full hp to Dragon Lord in one turn with flanking attack on early turns. And no Dragon Lord doesn’t need to go in melee, it’s the only ruler class that benefits magical build, so not going that route is pretty wasted opportunity as for me.

I meant for AoE shape. And if you want go with that comparison Dragon Lord can do much more damage than Balor (not even mentioning applying various debuffs/buffs to your units), unless you some very specific Chaos-Astral builds where Balor could be strong enough. Plus Dragon Ruler can be ascended with Dragonheart trait and buff own damage even more.

[Eldrin]

Originally posted by Bratty Doe:

Originally posted by Eldrin:

I play brutal only and i never means death to the ruler, it will go in to melee sooner or later anyway. So i do not really agree with that argument at all.

I actually compared it to the balor aswell and the balor actually does more damage lol.

Even t2 pikemen can delete as much as 20% hp with 2 attacks, especially flanking ones. In many Wonders there are t3-4 units that can delete full hp to Dragon Lord in one turn with flanking attack on early turns. And no Dragon Lord doesn’t need to go in melee, it’s the only ruler class that benefits magical build, so not going that route is pretty wasted opportunity as for me.

I meant for AoE shape. And if you want go with that comparison Dragon Lord can do much more damage than Balor (not even mentioning applying various debuffs/buffs to your units), unless you some very specific Chaos-Astral builds where Balor could be strong enough. Plus Dragon Ruler can be ascended with Dragonheart trait and buff own damage even more.

I am not sure if we are playing the same game but nobody ever deletes my dragon lord like that. You would actually have to send it to the center of enemies ALONE. Maybe in MP it is different with better focus with player vs player but not vs AI.

You did mention going into mage tree, where i go more into dragon, support/Warfare. (The aspect you choose also can give a major boost to your defense/resistance)

[Underscorecow]

isnt line the best one to use with the mage tree since it lets you do the 50% damage buff , cast line, reset cooldowns, cast line again to delete something from range? meanwhile comet uses up your turn and breath is shorter range while the two mage abilities cant be used in melee

On paper line seems like the best option for bursting something down in a single turn. Cone is best for hitting the most enemies, and comet is good for just staying back and casting.

[Eldrin]

Originally posted by Underscorecow:

isnt line the best one to use with the mage tree since it lets you do the 50% damage buff , cast line, reset cooldowns, cast line again to delete something from range? meanwhile comet uses up your turn and breath is shorter range while the two mage abilities cant be used in melee

On paper line seems like the best option for bursting something down in a single turn. Cone is best for hitting the most enemies, and comet is good for just staying back and casting.

In a single turn cast twice? How does that work what ability allows that? if what you say is true then that could be an argument for line.

[Underscorecow]

Originally posted by Eldrin:

Originally posted by Underscorecow:

isnt line the best one to use with the mage tree since it lets you do the 50% damage buff , cast line, reset cooldowns, cast line again to delete something from range? meanwhile comet uses up your turn and breath is shorter range while the two mage abilities cant be used in melee

On paper line seems like the best option for bursting something down in a single turn. Cone is best for hitting the most enemies, and comet is good for just staying back and casting.

In a single turn cast twice? How does that work what ability allows that? if what you say is true then that could be an argument for line.

Weaver, refresh ability cooldowns once per combat, cannot be used in enemy zone of control, uses a single action point

Channel Power, free action, increases magic damage by 50%, cant be used in enemy zone of control

Channel power (free), line breath (2 action points left), weaver (1 action point left), line breath (0 action points left)

for a total of
1.5*2 = 300% breath damage from range in a single turn + 2* whatever debuff youre gonna give them, not to mention youll end up getting status resistance penetration and stuff to buff your breath from the mage traits anyway.

You cant do this with comet since comet takes 3 action points.

Cone breath can pull this off too but its shorter range so you basically need enemies to enter that sweet spot where they arnt in melee of you but they are within breath range.

[MattStriker]

Easier to avoid hitting allies, that's why I pick it.

[Eldrin]

Originally posted by Underscorecow:

Originally posted by Eldrin:

In a single turn cast twice? How does that work what ability allows that? if what you say is true then that could be an argument for line.

Weaver, refresh ability cooldowns once per combat, cannot be used in enemy zone of control, uses a single action point

Channel Power, free action, increases magic damage by 50%, cant be used in enemy zone of control

Channel power (free), line breath (2 action points left), weaver (1 action point left), line breath (0 action points left)

for a total of
1.5*2 = 300% breath damage from range in a single turn + 2* whatever debuff youre gonna give them, not to mention youll end up getting status resistance penetration and stuff to buff your breath from the mage traits anyway.

You cant do this with comet since comet takes 3 action points.

Cone breath can pull this off too but its shorter range so you basically need enemies to enter that sweet spot where they arnt in melee of you but they are within breath range.

I don't think that is how it works. The moment you use your breath weapon your turn ends. All attacks ends the turn. Another hero would have to give them an extra turn.

[Underscorecow]

Originally posted by Eldrin:

I don't think that is how it works. The moment you use your breath weapon your turn ends. All attacks ends the turn. Another hero would have to give them an extra turn.

Oh right I wish the action point system would clarify those exceptions and have abilities that end your turn say so despite the low action cost, in that case you can pull it off in the span of two turns for 1.5* damage on the first and 1x damage on the second for a total of 250% and since you are back to 3 action points on the 2nd turn you could move then recharge then cast breath....basically making it back to the same as cone breath but longer range

Its still a pretty big deal because empowered buffs, crits, and other damage bonuses could easily tip that back over 300% with such a strong base that your leader has to inherently work with, and the range in combination with being able to move before the second breath guarantees youll still get the second breath off on the same target from long range on the second turn.

[Midas]

Line hits harder and you can usually position to hit the same number of targets anyways. It's rare to be able to hit more than 3-4 targets without clipping your own units, and line does that just fine. It's also really easy to force the enemy into a row anyways.

[ethorin101]

Originally posted by Underscorecow:

Originally posted by Eldrin:

I don't think that is how it works. The moment you use your breath weapon your turn ends. All attacks ends the turn. Another hero would have to give them an extra turn.

Oh right I wish the action point system would clarify those exceptions and have abilities that end your turn say so despite the low action cost, in that case you can pull it off in the span of two turns for 1.5* damage on the first and 1x damage on the second for a total of 250% and since you are back to 3 action points on the 2nd turn you could move then recharge then cast breath....basically making it back to the same as cone breath but longer range

Its still a pretty big deal because empowered buffs, crits, and other damage bonuses could easily tip that back over 300% with such a strong base that your leader has to inherently work with, and the range in combination with being able to move before the second breath guarantees youll still get the second breath off on the same target from long range on the second turn.

Every action with a point cost ends your turn unless it says otherwise.

[ChaosKhan]

Originally posted by ethorin101:

Originally posted by Underscorecow:

Oh right I wish the action point system would clarify those exceptions and have abilities that end your turn say so despite the low action cost, in that case you can pull it off in the span of two turns for 1.5* damage on the first and 1x damage on the second for a total of 250% and since you are back to 3 action points on the 2nd turn you could move then recharge then cast breath....basically making it back to the same as cone breath but longer range

Its still a pretty big deal because empowered buffs, crits, and other damage bonuses could easily tip that back over 300% with such a strong base that your leader has to inherently work with, and the range in combination with being able to move before the second breath guarantees youll still get the second breath off on the same target from long range on the second turn.

Every action with a point cost ends your turn unless it says otherwise.

Yes. For further clarification:
When there is a clear white circle and 2 greyed out, it means, that the action takes 1 AP, but still ends the turn after using it. Even if you have some AP remaining, they simply disappear. If the white circle has grey lines toning it down, it means, that the action takes place and leaves with 1 AP, but does NOT end the turn.

Those peculiarities are important to understand and judging from the information dumped here, it appears to be a little unclear.

[Eldrin]

Originally posted by Underscorecow:

Originally posted by Eldrin:

I don't think that is how it works. The moment you use your breath weapon your turn ends. All attacks ends the turn. Another hero would have to give them an extra turn.

Oh right I wish the action point system would clarify those exceptions and have abilities that end your turn say so despite the low action cost, in that case you can pull it off in the span of two turns for 1.5* damage on the first and 1x damage on the second for a total of 250% and since you are back to 3 action points on the 2nd turn you could move then recharge then cast breath....basically making it back to the same as cone breath but longer range

Its still a pretty big deal because empowered buffs, crits, and other damage bonuses could easily tip that back over 300% with such a strong base that your leader has to inherently work with, and the range in combination with being able to move before the second breath guarantees youll still get the second breath off on the same target from long range on the second turn.

It actually does that. If the actions circle is made striped/seethrough (for example unicorn phase or earth elemental teleport) then the ability leave it with ONE action point left and does NOT end the turn.

Any action where any circle is fully filled means it ends your turn.