Age of Wonders 4

Age of Wonders 4

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Flushing Mar 6, 2024 @ 8:58pm
What Primal Spirit, Primal Culture?
When you choose Primal Culture, what Spirit animal do you choose?

So far, I just make my decisions based on the economic benefits and the Affinity point that I want.

Is there anything else that factors into the decision?
Originally posted by Balekai:
Primal culture's advantage as a culture is massive versatility in specialization, its favoured terrain mechanics, and its reusable fairly powerful "spell-like" abilities via Animal Fury boon resource. Fury is kind of like combat casting points mixed in with High culture's awakened mechanics if that makes sense. An ultimate ability resource really.

It's great as a summoning faction or a faction using non cultural units, because when you research Primal communion they get the favoured terrain movement for quick armies and access to the Primal culture's "ultimate" mechanic (Fury) and the various synergies there. Regardless of unit focus, as long as you keep terraforming or start on a map of your favoured terrain, your armies will be fast on the world map without spending any racial traits on athletics/mounts/terraforming. you can also use terrain to your advantage vs. enemies inside and outside of combat.

Overall the culture becomes stronger in combat the longer it lasts, as more units build up Rising Fury, which will convert into 5 stacks of "Fury of the (insert animal here)" at 5 stacks.

What people seem to be mistaking is that "Rising Fury" isn't the proper fury needed to cast special summons or get special boon bonuses on attacks. It's only after they get to 5 stacks and convert into 5 stacks of the real boon does it work as a resource. I think many see Rising Fury x4 and think "hey I can use my Animist summon!" Nope! :P

It's hard to keep track of in combat especially if you use auto-pilot during manual combat.
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Showing 1-15 of 19 comments
Balekai Mar 6, 2024 @ 9:15pm 
Pretty much the same for me. I personally find myself always gravitating to Crow for the Mana, the Astral point, and the grassland favoured terrain so far. I tend to build around Primal culture's heavy lean in on summons, which again promotes more mana/astral affinity in a way. Lastly it feels the most versatile animal for various RP reasons. :p

I can also see myself taking advantage of various other animals for various niche builds too in the future. I'm just not there yet build wise. All in all, the Primal culture is a great for building all types of faction builds and interesting combos. :) :)
DragynDance Mar 6, 2024 @ 9:39pm 
The new storms book plays really well with crocodile. Croc honestly feels the most feature complete and balanced, and all the other animals feel kind of like they are an afterthought, which is a shame because the snake one is cool, but just really weak in comparison to the crocs.
My first impulse was to go ash sabertooth. I usually use barbarian and enjoy chaos affinity (even though I feel it's kinda weak, lol) and I thought that this time was good to try something slightly different. I went full t1 spam caveman: ash sabretooth, swarmers, adept settlers, tome of the horde, aiming at fast expansion and terraforming, heavily investing into t1 trash mobs, since a t1 shielder and archer is a decent composition. I gave them the 40 move points trait and the pass unit one (which I found out as not good for what I was aiming for), and made them all tigerlike felines. "Cinis Khan", their champion. The fantasy was that they would be a very agressive and expansive ppl but also very primitive and simpleminded. Then I discovered how awkwardly the primal terrafoming works and it kinda subtracted from the experience but I still managed to win so it was all in all ok.

...So tl;dr: Ash sabretooth for roleplay reasons.
Flushing Mar 6, 2024 @ 10:07pm 
I guess I am not alone. I went with the Spirit Wolf because I'm going with Nature and Order this play through, with a heavy emphasis on rally of lieges.

I'll definitely splash Astral, seems like I always do.

I guess I am most confused by the Primal Culture in general. I have a clear sense of direction with all the other cultures, which seem to lean heavily into certain mechanics in tactical combat right off the bat.

I feel like that's less so with Primal, even though I love their T1 Archers.

Is it that their Drudic and focus on summoning animals in combat?

That said, the Animalist has the ability to summon an animal, which is always block for me, it seems to have lots of preconditions that I don't understand. Can any of you explain it to me.

I think I could see Primal Culture working well with Tome of Evolution and Tome of Dragons.
The author of this thread has indicated that this post answers the original topic.
Balekai Mar 6, 2024 @ 11:01pm 
Primal culture's advantage as a culture is massive versatility in specialization, its favoured terrain mechanics, and its reusable fairly powerful "spell-like" abilities via Animal Fury boon resource. Fury is kind of like combat casting points mixed in with High culture's awakened mechanics if that makes sense. An ultimate ability resource really.

It's great as a summoning faction or a faction using non cultural units, because when you research Primal communion they get the favoured terrain movement for quick armies and access to the Primal culture's "ultimate" mechanic (Fury) and the various synergies there. Regardless of unit focus, as long as you keep terraforming or start on a map of your favoured terrain, your armies will be fast on the world map without spending any racial traits on athletics/mounts/terraforming. you can also use terrain to your advantage vs. enemies inside and outside of combat.

Overall the culture becomes stronger in combat the longer it lasts, as more units build up Rising Fury, which will convert into 5 stacks of "Fury of the (insert animal here)" at 5 stacks.

What people seem to be mistaking is that "Rising Fury" isn't the proper fury needed to cast special summons or get special boon bonuses on attacks. It's only after they get to 5 stacks and convert into 5 stacks of the real boon does it work as a resource. I think many see Rising Fury x4 and think "hey I can use my Animist summon!" Nope! :P

It's hard to keep track of in combat especially if you use auto-pilot during manual combat.
Flushing Mar 7, 2024 @ 12:03am 
Originally posted by Balekai:
Primal culture's advantage as a culture is massive versatility in specialization, its favoured terrain mechanics, and its reusable fairly powerful "spell-like" abilities via Animal Fury boon resource. Fury is kind of like combat casting points mixed in with High culture's awakened mechanics if that makes sense. An ultimate ability resource really.

It's great as a summoning faction or a faction using non cultural units, because when you research Primal communion they get the favoured terrain movement for quick armies and access to the Primal culture's "ultimate" mechanic (Fury) and the various synergies there. Regardless of unit focus, as long as you keep terraforming or start on a map of your favoured terrain, your armies will be fast on the world map without spending any racial traits on athletics/mounts/terraforming. you can also use terrain to your advantage vs. enemies inside and outside of combat.

Overall the culture becomes stronger in combat the longer it lasts, as more units build up Rising Fury, which will convert into 5 stacks of "Fury of the (insert animal here)" at 5 stacks.

What people seem to be mistaking is that "Rising Fury" isn't the proper fury needed to cast special summons or get special boon bonuses on attacks. It's only after they get to 5 stacks and convert into 5 stacks of the real boon does it work as a resource. I think many see Rising Fury x4 and think "hey I can use my Animist summon!" Nope! :P

It's hard to keep track of in combat especially if you use auto-pilot during manual combat.

How do you convert Rising Fury into Fury Fury?
SaurianDruid Mar 7, 2024 @ 2:03am 
I went crocodile on a nature/astral build focusing on summoning beasts and then buffing the heck out of them. So far it is working really well. As a side I also took a lot of enchantments to boost support units, so now my Animists and Wildspeakers are very strong and have powerful synergy together. Animist summons a spirit crocodile and Wildspeaker buffs it.

A quick tip; the heal on your animists can be cast turn 1 on themselves to give them 3 stacks of Rising Fury. Then they just need one round of shooting before they can summon the animal spirit. I've not played with all of them but crocodile is really strong. It can one-shot squishy tier 1 units.

The fact you can conjure the spell version of the spirit is even more devastating. Drop one behind enemy lines to eat their archers while another comes in from the front to body block for your mages.
I'm just hoping some of primal's variety gets mirrored in other cultures in a future patch. Nothing massive. Just a small change that makes the culture work slightly differently. Maybe dark's pikemen can be swapped for skirmishers, or mystic's soothers and spellbreakers can trade tier spots.
Balekai Mar 7, 2024 @ 4:55am 
Originally posted by Flushing:
Originally posted by Balekai:
/snip

How do you convert Rising Fury into Fury Fury?

It will happen automatically at 5 stacks of Rising Fury.

Once Rising Fury automatically converts, the unit gets 5 Fury of the whatever animal you have. These can either be used over 5 attacks to provoke the Fury attack bonus for your animal, or used to summon your spirit animal with Animist when they reach 5 stacks.

Summoning the animal with the Animist Support Unit will use all 5 stacks, but only requires one stack to use. You can use them right away as a spam summon strategy, or wait a few turns and "bank" the stacks while using some of the 5 stacks for attacking with your animist staff. Especially on Crow which will turns their single attack into an an AoE attack (well some AoE damage anyways).

Sources of Fury:

1. One stack of Rising Fury for landing multiple hit attacks (3 Max, obviously). Which means you need to hit and actually attack 3 times that turn, not move and use up 1-2 action points doing so with units with this attack type (most normal melee and range units). If you move up to your target and only attack once that's only 1 Fury. This is probably the other issue for many trying to reach 5 stacks.

That said, these units are best at converting 5 stacks of rising fury all by themselves within 2 turns to proper Fury of the Animal resource. No need for support to help them do that.

2. Two stacks of Rising Fury when you use a single or full attack on a unit. So things like staffs, two handed charge weapons and the likes. Skirmisher single attacks. Honestly these are the most dependable attacks for generating Rising Fury, because they can move and flank all they want while still generating their full stacks per turn. Taking Keen senses can be a good idea for both multi and single attacks. Then you combine this with source 3.

3. Spiritual Healing from the Animist healer unit and Leader picking it up.

SPIRITUAL HEALING
Target unit:
Heals for 20 Temporary Hit Points.
Gains 3 stacks of Rising Fury if it has a Primal Animal Boon.
Cooldown: 2

This heal by itself promotes the near exclusive use of Animists as your healers (plus your leader taking this as a support skill). So it helps that animists are also optional mounted units to keep up with any army build. Just make them better healers with Tomes that give "Staff of the x" and other free action ability heals/buffs from support enchantments. That way they can multi task during a fight either attacking to use up some Fury stack, summon, or use Spiritual Healing as a Rising Fury buff and not a heal, while still being able to heal that turn with stuff like Mending Touch or Fey Blessing.


Now one thing I haven't tested since i always play auto-pilot manual battles most of the time (lol lazy and it's kind of important to know), is whether or not Rising Fury only converts at the end of your combat turn after reaching 5 stacks and not during battle. If this is how it works then this is probably the number one factor as to why people are getting confused on what it takes to use Fury abilities and get the bonuses.

Edit: The conversion is automatic once you get 5 stacks on a unit regardless of turn ending. Which means you can take advantage of Fury by stacking spiritually healing twice on a unit that hasn't used any action points and they will get the full advantage of it in the same turn.
Last edited by Balekai; Mar 7, 2024 @ 12:06pm
The Former Mar 7, 2024 @ 5:00am 
I choose 100% on roleplaying concerns, so you probably don't wanna hear my answers.
Balekai Mar 7, 2024 @ 5:03am 
Originally posted by Ärlig, Paradoxriddaren:
I choose 100% on roleplaying concerns, so you probably don't wanna hear my answers.

Except choosing based off roleplaying usually leads to the most interesting builds! I know that's the case for me and now with the biography editing, I spend half my time making bios that fit the interesting RP combinations of mechanics. :)
Cindeerella Mar 7, 2024 @ 5:10am 
I love snek because materium is super strong. Plus on sand you can summon phoenixes with “Great Animal Summon” which is a no-brainee reason to play Primal-Nature-Materium style. I’ll dig other primal options aswell later on.
Last edited by Cindeerella; Mar 7, 2024 @ 5:11am
Azunai Mar 7, 2024 @ 7:56am 
I played 2 primals so far. The crow (nature/astral) was "ok", the Mammoth (nature/shadow) was really great. Has a charge attack that knocks the target back by 1 tile and a full (3) actions AoE attack that has a chance to freeze (i.e. essentially a 1 turn stun).

The trick to using animists for summoning is their healing spell. It adds 3 stacks of fury. So if you use it on the animist himself on turn 1 and then shoot a target on turn 2, you can summon on turn 3. Or a turn earlier if you have a support hero and use their ultimate "call to action" to reset the animists Action points.

Or if you have 2 animists or a hero with the spirit heal (primal culture heroes can get it as a support skill) you can also heal an animist twice on turn 1 and then they can summon the animsl directly on turn 2.
Blanch Warren Mar 7, 2024 @ 8:28am 
While underground is not the best place to play, the tunneling spider will bring your tome 1 research down to two turns when paired with runesmiths. So you could make a research hole lol.
Last edited by Blanch Warren; Mar 7, 2024 @ 8:29am
Fendelphi Mar 7, 2024 @ 9:02am 
Originally posted by DragynDance:
The new storms book plays really well with crocodile. Croc honestly feels the most feature complete and balanced, and all the other animals feel kind of like they are an afterthought, which is a shame because the snake one is cool, but just really weak in comparison to the crocs.
I dont really feel so at all. It all depends on what you are looking for.
You want to blind enemies constantly, giving you an advantage against retaliations and ranged attacks, then you can choose the Primal Dune Serpent.
Want lifesteal on your constructs or other non-racial units? Well, Primal Tunneling Spider got you covered.
Want to enhance your AoE capabilities? Primal Storm Crow or Primal Ash Sabertooth have that. And so on.
Or maybe you just want to increase a certain economy type or get the benefit of a certain favoured terrain.

Point is, I dont really see any "greater" benefit of the Primal Mire Crocodile over the other options. It mostly just depends on what fits your intended playstyle with the faction.
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Date Posted: Mar 6, 2024 @ 8:58pm
Posts: 19