Something should change regarding the Seal Victory Conditions

[Slashimus]

I had a long hard 8 player game against the AI on hard. I went for a seals victory. It was basically me and one other AI going for it with any seriousness.

I finally had victory in sight. He was at 146 and needed 4 points to win it. I was at 144. He had 2 seals and I had 3. So it was going to be a tie. So on the last turn he needed 2 seals to win and I needed 3. I had lost a seal so in a desperate move I found a lone AI guarding a seal and I pounced on it and got my 3 seals back. At the end of the turn...he won.

My question is why? At the end we would have both gotten the seals we needed to win. Why was his valid and mine not? I don't think it should work like that...if we both end up with the seals needed to win...there should be some other mechanism that determines the victor. Like a last war between our factions or...something...other than a cinematic of me falling over when I know I won.

In Age of Wonders 3 when that happened we would both be counted winners right?

[Blanch Warren]

It was probably originally made for multiplayer, it's not to say the AI might not be improved for it.

[Slashimus]

Originally posted by Blanch Warren:

It was probably originally made for multiplayer, it's not to say the AI might not be improved for it.

What do you mean exactly? What does multiplayer have to do with the situation I described? If it was 2 players...and the exact same thing happened...I would still be extremely disappointed.

[Kotori Asobi]

A tie is impossible. The progress is calculated at its currents players turn. Not after all players did their turn.

[Maal]

Originally posted by Kotori Asobi:

A tie is impossible. The progress is calculated at its currents players turn. Not after all players did their turn.

Mmh, what about simultanous turns then?

[Slashimus]

Originally posted by Kotori Asobi:

A tie is impossible. The progress is calculated at its currents players turn. Not after all players did their turn.

So you're saying that because he took his turn before mine...then he would win? The player's turn is last when using classic turns. That would kind of explain it...but it still sucks that I did all that work and pulled off a last minute save of a seal only to lose it to turn timing...Maybe I'll go back to simultaneous turns then.

[Terrkas]

Originally posted by Kotori Asobi:

A tie is impossible. The progress is calculated at its currents players turn. Not after all players did their turn.

In aow3 in pbem we had a game where 2 players won, because we reached the points in the same turn.

Though, mp in aow4 seems a bit weird. We had allied victory enabled, where i finished the last dragon in ashen war and 3 before that and only host got a victory screen. I didnt care for the points but its weird.

[Slashimus]

Originally posted by Terrkas:

In aow3 in pbem we had a game where 2 players won, because we reached the points in the same turn.

The same happened to me in AoW 3. I even remember talking to a dev about how cool it was to have it happen.

[Terrkas]

Originally posted by Slashimus:

Originally posted by Terrkas:

In aow3 in pbem we had a game where 2 players won, because we reached the points in the same turn.

The same happened to me in AoW 3. I even remember talking to a dev about how cool it was to have it happen.

From the ashen war scenario i guess it checks in playerorder. Maybe i should ask a dev about how its supposed to work.

Or maybe you should make a bugreport with your safe, it was sp, tight?

Not sure exactly how its supposed to work.

[Slashimus]

Yes I still have the saves from then...so I can do that. Just really disappointed because I worked so hard for that win.

[Kotori Asobi]

The game ends, if a player can finish the game in his turn.
Player is only first, if you choose him to be first. You can set player in the middle or even at the end of players list.

Es example, you can buff ally cities with the flower grow thing, the buff will change terrain at the buffed player turn, not at your turn.

[Slashimus]

Originally posted by Kotori Asobi:

The game ends, if a player can finish the game in his turn.
Player is only first, if you choose him to be first. You can set player in the middle or even at the end of players list.

Es example, you can buff ally cities with the flower grow thing, the buff will change terrain at the buffed player turn, not at your turn.

So are you saying that I could have set myself as the first player and won? How would I do that? Just drag and drop the order?

[Terrkas]

Originally posted by Slashimus:

Originally posted by Kotori Asobi:

The game ends, if a player can finish the game in his turn.
Player is only first, if you choose him to be first. You can set player in the middle or even at the end of players list.

Es example, you can buff ally cities with the flower grow thing, the buff will change terrain at the buffed player turn, not at your turn.

So are you saying that I could have set myself as the first player and won? How would I do that? Just drag and drop the order?

Usually you are player 1 by default. I think what is meant here is the ai was just faster, because when you in your turn saw they Win next turn, that next turn in classic is, before you collect your points at the start of your turn.

It was basically a "if no one steals a seal from the ai now, it will win in its turn"

[Slashimus]

Originally posted by Terrkas:

Usually you are player 1 by default. I think what is meant here is the ai was just faster, because when you in your turn saw they Win next turn, that next turn in classic is, before you collect your points at the start of your turn.

It was basically a "if no one steals a seal from the ai now, it will win in its turn"

I don't think that's how it worked. In the last turn before the win I needed 3 points and AI needed 2. We both held the required number of seals to win. So at the end of the next turn I should have won and the AI should have won. A shared victory...that's what happened in AoW 3.

By your logic...if I had no seals held and then pulled off enough wins to secure all the seals I needed to win that would not count. It looks like if the AI needed 2 seals to win and I needed 3 I lose because I needed more seals. I don't think that's right...because at the end of the turn I would still have enough seals. The race is to 150 seals...not who has more to get.

So it leaves no room to pull off a spectacular last minute "win" like I did. That is kind of depressing.

All they would need to change is when to calculate the seals counting. I think it should be at the end of the turn for everybody...not one by one as the players' turns are calculated.