Hermit kingdom + Vassals

[Nylocke Dragon of many miracles]

I figure that vassals arent "owned" so adjacency to them removes the bonuses from hermit kingdom correct?

[Balekai]

A really good place to test this is the Valley of Wonders story mission. Make a free city centril build with hermit kingdom societal trait to speed it up like taking Tome of Faith + Bannerlords or something. It's very common for the neighbouring Free City to be like 3 provinces away. Plus all the mission specific bonuses like added Imperium etc. at start.

Things I would be looking out for:

- Do you lose Hermit Kingdom from abutting a Free City in the first place. (Betting on it)
- Then when Vassalized do you regain the Hermit Kingdom condition on your capitol. (doubt it). :p

[Atrimidas]

I actually tested it in my last game, vassal cities is no problem. you'll keep your bonus.

side note, hermit kingdom is so OP it's the best trait in the game at this moment.
Knowledge is king and every player that dares to get near you you can have justified war against them. (too bad they changed the imperium bonus only coming from the most justified war, but a needed change. still the relation bonus is nice.)

[Balekai]

Originally posted by Atrimidas:

I actually tested it in my last game, vassal cities is no problem. you'll keep your bonus.

side note, hermit kingdom is so OP it's the best trait in the game at this moment.
Knowledge is king and every player that dares to get near you you can have justified war against them. (too bad they changed the imperium bonus only coming from the most justified war, but a needed change. still the relation bonus is nice.)

That's very unexpected to hear actually. My thought from the day before yesterday was a Hermit Kingdom starting underground and having a smaller footprint above around.

Underground there's usually no way for other players/free cities to abut your borders (because of cavern system unless/when your provinces go above ground). Knowing now that you don't have to worry about your free city vassals, makes it that we don't have to worry about this as much, but also that we can use this to allow a nearby starting Free City soon to be vassal, to expand more around your capitol from above and guarantee that your capitol never abuts another faction.

Then I guess for all those other instances when we could possibly abut another play, just build outposts w/ workcaps along the border with them to protect the Hermit bonus. :)

I'm going to go in game and change my next faction (Mystic/Nature caster faction abusing Alchemy Tome Miasma + Star Blades) to Hermit Kingdom instead of one of the other Societal picks I had planned. Not only it is OP, but it fits perfectly with the faction's theme (A whole bunch of "Halflings or "Gnomes" or less baddy "Red Caps," lead by a powerful Fey (Elven looking Nymph/Dryad-like) leader. Think a Nyryssa from Pathfinder Kingmaker or a not so watery tart Nimue :p ).

Thanks for the info! :)

[Butcher Pete]

Originally posted by Atrimidas:

I actually tested it in my last game, vassal cities is no problem. you'll keep your bonus.

side note, hermit kingdom is so OP it's the best trait in the game at this moment.
Knowledge is king and every player that dares to get near you you can have justified war against them. (too bad they changed the imperium bonus only coming from the most justified war, but a needed change. still the relation bonus is nice.)

I don't know if a recent slew of updates changed this... however, vassals do - in fact - disable Hermit Kingdom. At least... provided the vassals are of a race that you are not a Keeper of.

I am currently playing a game now, and I am surrounded by vassals but only 1 of my cities is benefiting from Hermit Kingdom. I got my vassals all the way to Supreme Vassalage and Hermit Kingdom is still disabled. 2 of my cities are completely isolated but of the two, one is of a non-starting race and so I don't get any of the bonuses.

So not only does Hermit Kingdom get disabled by foreign population cities, it also does not apply to cities you conquer that are not Hermit Kingdom.

Compare this with Talented Collectors - which not only applies its bonuses to all cities AND outposts all the time regardless of race while also providing ALL the other resources... but it also applies to created Magic Materials (such as from Transmutation Circle).

Comparing my current game with Hermit Kingdom, I was able to get 879 knowledge per turn by turn 45 (note the number is actually helped by buying knowledge from my vassals);

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3125475466

meanwhile a comparable game (no change of settings or mods or anything) I was able to get 935 knowledge per turn by turn 42 [the turn I won the game].

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3125475805

So Talented Collectors is definitely superior because it isn't even a knowledge-focused bonus. It gives a little bit of everything without any qualification... other than you need to kill stuff... which you should be doing anyway regardless of your ultimate victory condition.

[Blanch Warren]

I don't know what transmutation circle is, and I can't say I come across magic materials all that often on smaller maps, so I can't say I entirely follow.