Instale o Steam
iniciar sessão
|
idioma
简体中文 (Chinês simplificado)
繁體中文 (Chinês tradicional)
日本語 (Japonês)
한국어 (Coreano)
ไทย (Tailandês)
Български (Búlgaro)
Čeština (Tcheco)
Dansk (Dinamarquês)
Deutsch (Alemão)
English (Inglês)
Español-España (Espanhol — Espanha)
Español-Latinoamérica (Espanhol — América Latina)
Ελληνικά (Grego)
Français (Francês)
Italiano (Italiano)
Bahasa Indonesia (Indonésio)
Magyar (Húngaro)
Nederlands (Holandês)
Norsk (Norueguês)
Polski (Polonês)
Português (Portugal)
Română (Romeno)
Русский (Russo)
Suomi (Finlandês)
Svenska (Sueco)
Türkçe (Turco)
Tiếng Việt (Vietnamita)
Українська (Ucraniano)
Relatar um problema com a tradução
Regras e diretrizes para discussões
4 
Denunciar esta mensagem
Ha,ha me too. I ended up at like level 36 after the sea cave trips and the next boss at that sunken city could barely damage me and i beat it down in like 3 turns.
Just spend like 5 hours beating around 60 characters in the card game so i dont have to do it all at the end at once.
A big thx for the tip. Cause I didn't even know about that fishing spot. I was totally searching in a completely different aeria. I've found some other spots where sometimes a big fish spawns which I can't cap. So, I mistook it for my target.
One is the fishing spot east of your first city. Another one is on the islands of the Sand Ocean.
and...
Well,
I never said I'd dislike Eiyuden Chronicles and it's true that Eiyuden Chronicles has lots of cool features and mini-games and like I already mentioned... I especially love the city details. I really really love that.
But imho all these features are overshadowed by the annoying and partly pretty unfair combat system.
I'm for example atm at the Seign-chapter where his party has to break into the Dux' laboratory and I already thought that the previous combat was annoying. But this is just for to puke. The entire party sucks in pretty everything: HP, Def, M Def, Speed, Atk Power, Magic, they suck in everything! If they would at least qualify in survivability!?! But the average Def value lies around 120-157 (with Valentine with 180 Def as exception) and that on lvl 38-39.
And while you can equip Seign or that Cyberarm-Girl with Sun Stone Rings to extend their Armor Class to A-B... that has zero influence to the incoming damage. Valentine has zero Armor Class, Seign has an "A" in Armor Class, Valentine has 180 Def while Seign has 157... that's a difference of 23 pts in Def. And that has significant more influence to the incoming damage than upgrading your f'cking Armor Class!
And Defense... isn't really upgradeable! And M Defense is even more important later on and that has the same problem!
Just for that dungeon I had to get back to Nowa... just to buy... 10 packages of Healing Incense (heals 150 HP to the entire party, 2 charges per slot!><). And then I still just bought like 40-50 potent herbs, just so that I can heal between battles. And then I still have 2 Water Runes on Seign and Hildi + the Expert Earth Rune on Hildi (for the worst case!).
And still! It sucks! Fighting there is soooo f'cking annoying and I want to farm some Inferno Runes first, too! But that might be my problem...
Considering... I wouldn't have the char which opens an item shop in my HQ and that I've already unlocked his additional item-sortiment... I couldn't even buy Healing Incense for a small fortune. Even though I have... 800+k of what currency again? Guess it's not zenny anymore.
So, please! Don't get mad when I critize this as a bit toooo grindy for a game which wants to be like a Suikoden-successor! The people who buy Eiyuden Chronicles are doing that with the expectation that this game is more like Suikoden: not a roguelike, not a soulslike, not super unforgiving like some volumes of the SaGa-series (like: Saga Frontier II or Unlimited Saga), just like a nice and fair RPG.
Personally, I don't think that a good game is defined by a hard difficulty. Suikoden 1+2 have already proven that this isn't the case. Cause, if you define the normal ending of Suikoden 1 or 2 as a success and still as enjoyable, then they are easy.
In terms of Eiyuden Chronicles just reaching the end of this game is already a compareably tough grind, imho. And in terms of the storyline Eiyuden Chronicles is a more teenage-like version of Suikoden 2: there are lots of stupid comments and flashy anime-like jokes in this game. And when I see the bath-builder talking in a south-us "hill-billy" accent / -manner... then I just wished that some chars would've never been voiced within this game!
Then again...
I must grin every time when muscle mage says "My massle powa has incriest!" xD
Edit:
equipped now most of Seign's party with high M-Res Runes, cause most of the enemies deal magical damage - even though that doesn't make much sense. Works wonders...
Especially the end where you have to fight 4 bosses in a row without a save point inbetween.
I did get through that on my first try but it was tough.
And yes the combat sometimes feels weirdly unbalanced and sways between enemies dont do any damage at all and nearly one hitting your characters a lot.
Its still not very difficult on NORMAL just a bit annoying.
Overall i still enjoy the game a lot ( would not have played 40 hours in 5 days otherwise) but it has its flaws but honestly, so had Suikoden 2.
And i disagree that Suikoden 2 had a much better story, Suikoden 2 was great until the halfway point when you kill Luca Blight , after that the story completely falls apart and barely makes any sense but just keeps going.
Luca Blight really carried the story for suikoden 2. He is really a good villain.
Am not a fan of being forced to switched proitaganist a lot as well. Am glad Marisa and Seign's other story are optional but I loved markus' DLC story. Overall I actually like Eiyuden and planning to do a second fresh run. I just hate Reid's recruitment. So tedious but having all characters unlocked in the beginning breaks the immersion for me so going fresh run
Agreed, what speaks against Suikoden 2 maybe is, that Luca Blight isn't the end boss of that game and that the game has some loose ends like about the Empire of Harmonia and the mage with the true earth rune - which gets introduced too late. Such loose ends. But also, those loose ends are charming in their own way.
With a but!
But the Luca Blight Battle (with the special chasing theme) is just amazing, cause it simply feels like he's the true heir or embodiment of the Beast Rune. I like Luca Blight as arch enemy more than Sephiroth or similar characters, cause this enraged psycho feels more authentic...
In addition:
It depends on how you define what matters on a storyline:
what Suikoden 1+2 are making good is how the regions are political connected to another, without describing it too "bureaucratic". You have the Scarlet Moon Empire which goes down in a rebellion and grows into a republic. That's what you see later in Suikoden 2, when you make connections into the republic of Toran or how it was called.
And with those connections your own regional fight / rebellion against an invading empire, ruled by a Tyrant, turns the tide for the better.
And while Luca Blight may go down after 2/3 of the storyline, you see in the end the changes which Jowy Atreides accomplished there in weakening the influence of Harmonia (from where the true Beastrune came from --> as gift for a "daughter-empire" --> Highland) and the influence of the Beast Rune itself. Cause without Jowy Luca Blight wouldn't have gone down and without him going down, it would've been impossible to break the power and influence of the True Beastrune.
The rest is questionable like always: does Highland have the right to invade the City-State? No! But if there was one single territory / kingdom / empire / nation there would be no war between nations anymore, either.
That doesn't make Jowy's approach the correct one, but the thought is kinda understandable.
And when you say that the storyline ends with the final confrontation between the two protagonists: which is well staged... pretty much like a open-ender. It doesn't really feel like you must go to a certain point for this ending. You just go there... like having a hunch! At least, that's how it felt to me on my first time.
And this all comes pretty unawaited... especially how Jowy turns against you and you and / or the protagonist Riou doesn't really understand it and doesn't want it like this. So, what do you do in the end?
And even there Suikoden II gives you a wonderful option. At least that's how it felt to me back then.
And Btw:
Since then that is the original to me! Other games may copy such a confrontation like in Suikoden II, but for me that is the most authentic one and the original. What a Remaster doesn't tell you is, that it's a PS1-game. This game is almost as old as FF6 or 7.
And kinda... I must say, that I feel that some ppl are unworthy in playing this game, cause in the actual gaming-era, I doubt, they can cherish the real value of Suikoden 1-2.
Mainly, cause the audience is overstimulated by movies, series, video games & co. At a time... where you have on one side the triple A-title market... and on the other side... the indi-market, this Suikoden Remaster may only look like another indi-title.
But: in the PS1-era Suikoden was a triple-A title by itself... just that it was kinda part of the ending PS1-era and people concentrated themselves mainly on the release of the PS2... like the switch between PS4 to PS5 with the awaiting of the PS6 now next. And maybe with the difference, that the plattform-switch was still a greater deal than it is nowadays, cause there didn't exist that many plattform-releases aka -switches, yet.
The release of the PS2 was still a bigger celebration than that of the PS4 or PS5 or related consoles of the last few years. Due to the internet-revolution and due to distribution-plattforms like STEAM, GOG, the Epicgames Store, Microsoft App S and all the publisher stores.
Eiyuden mechanically is better, but just like suikoden, the balance is awful. Imo, the biggest issue with eiyuden is the lack of drama. Suikoden 2 had so many heartfelt moments, which made it more memorable than eiyuden
Sorry but this is just not true. Both Suikoden games on PS1 are notorious for their low budget and cut corners, especially the first one.
The first Suikoden was made in just 8 months for the launch of the PS 1 in Japan, its graphics do in no way show the capabilites of the PS1 and could have been done the same on SNES.
Its also super short and has reused assets everywhere.
While i love both Suikoden 1+2, especially Suikoden 1 was always a low budget game for me, even then.
The second game had a lot more time and effort put into it but even with that game they had to cut out a lot of stuff because of time and budget constraints in the end.
Suikoden was never near to a AAA RPG series on PSone, the only series that could claim that was Final Fantasy and MAYBE Dragon Quest.
I agree with that, it kinda lacks the personal stakes Suikoden had.
Its just " we want to stop that warmongering empire" but it never feels emotional for the characters, its all a bit too bright and cheery all the time. Even when bad stuff happens like the home village of the main character getting burned down it gets soften right away with "nobody died, everybody got away, look they are already rebuilding it, and its back 3 missions later!".
The cities occupied by the empire do not feel like that, its just a normal city with some soldiers standing around.
No death, no wartime destruction, no blood and so on.
It feels all very PG.
No my point was that graphics don't matter. Gameplay and story will always be more important.
You definitely never played Suikoden 3 if you think the war battles in Suikoden 2 were bad.
Yeah that was a screw up on their part. They should have blocked it off until much later in the game since it made the rest of the game way too easy until like the final 3 story dungeons.
Eiyuden was a step down from the combat system Suikoden 2 had. The simultaneous action mechanic which made S2's combat very pleasing was missing in EC:HH. SP are unreliable if you want to save them for the next combat, as sometimes they'll carry over, and sometimes they'll just reset to the default value. At least the runes that don't consume MP are consistent in Suikoden.
In other aspects Eiyuden's combat is just like in Suikoden, as this game's always tried to be Suikoden's spiritual successor.
I also disagree with Suikoden being simplistic. It's combat system has about the same amount of complexity as most jrpgs of the ps1 era. Most of those jrpg had attack, magic (or any other ability system), consumables plus at least one unique mechanic to make the title stand out. In Suikoden's case that unique mechanic was Unite Attacks which encouraged players to try out different team composition. The rune system also allowed you to customize your characters to a certain degree and also limited your strength by making you choose what you want to bring with you. I personally think that's better than characters having access to all powers at any time.
You can clear Suikoden without having to make any preparations or adjustments for your party members to face the challenges ahead. But the reason for that isn't because Suikoden has "bad combat", but because the game's difficulty is very easy.
Dont even get me to the spells. Suikoden offers almost zero cc and defensive spells. No strategic element in the combat, simply do dmg and heal when needed.
Eiyuden, despite its horrible balance (dmg/mp mainly), at least has a much much wider range of spells, from buffs, cc, and debuffs.
That's why despite the new difficulty setting, suikoden is still braindead easy. Heck... bosses in suikoden die in 2-3turns.
Like i said, the ppl who praise suikoden combat system prolly dont play a lot of rpg. Suikoden is really at the bottom of the list when it comes to combat system
What you're describing here is build optimisation, which is a common trait for other jrpg's as well, not only for Suikoden. As you progress through those games, most of the spells or equipment will become obsolete.
As for the Suikoden's rune affinity system, even if you equip a rune for a character that has a weaker rune affinity for it, you won't suffer any major drawback for it. You can play however you want and enjoy your time, even if the build isn't optimal.
Again, the issue comes from the Suikoden being very easy. While Earth, Water and Resurrection runes do offer some non-offensive magic (buffs, revives), you most likely won't ever need them anyway.
While the first half is true, the latter is a lie.
In case of Suikoden 1 at the early game bosses take a lot of time to kill, as at this point you're limited with forced characters filling up your entire party and also having access only to LV1/2 magic. Zombie Dragon takes about 10 turns iirc.
Even when facing the final boss, without any extensive grinding the battle should take at least 5/6 turns with good builds and luck.
Yeah sry, triple A was wrong. My point wasn't about the budget. I just described it wrong.
When I came to Suikoden 1+2... that was years later, when Final Fantasy X and other PS2-RPGs were already released. Back then I bought the PSX-copies of Suikoden 1+2 for ca. 70 Euro per game, cause even the second-hand copies were already pretty rare on the market. Considering... this was shortly after the euro had replaced the old currencies - that was like... paying almost 140 DM per Suikoden game. That was really much.
And Suikoden wasn't even a name at that time! I didn't even know what would await me there.
But I must say, it was the best bought I have ever made. Never regretted it. Don't regret it now, either. For me Suikoden still belongs to the Top 3 of JRPGs of all time, cause it is beautiful to replay and you don't even hate it when you don't trigger the perfect ending. From which game can you honestly say, that the Normal Ending is soooo good that you don't need to care about the Perfect Ending?
And... even though you might not remember every character... after 10 years or longer of absence... there are a lot of characters you will still remember, cause of the story and the form of experiencing this game.
TLDR:
"Triple A" didn't really describe it to begin with. Even with a low budget and many production issues they made a much more iconic game than most triple A developers did, imho.
Beast rune isn't in Suikoden 1. Read again my post.