Cooking Minigame is Utter Garbage

[Loathing]

What is happening with this minigame?!

Nearly every character hates most foods except their specific food that they love.

I got Iugo who said, 'I'm in the mood for pickled plums' so I made the dish that has pickled plums. He gave it 5, the other judges were 0 1 0.

One character specifically said they love Raclette, so I made raclette. 0 5 1 0?! So I lost....

Almost every dish is like this. If I happen to have the dish that one judge is clearly specifically requesting with their dialog, almost everyone hates every other dish. There doesn't seem to be any logical connection connecting their preferred dish to other dishes. They like raclette, so maybe they like cheesy things? No, no they don't, you idiot.

It is so, so poorly balanced. I cannot even begin to imagine what the person in charge of balancing this was thinking. This goes for almost every system in this game, the fishing, the racing, the dialog, the RTS war battles. Everything seems super basic, lowest common denominator, and balanced on the fly with no time to spare.

I'm taking a break for now. I'm pretty sure I'm not coming back to this dumpster fire. Super disappointed on so many levels. Cheers ya'll.

[Raelic]

Some tips that I saw was to try it from a Japanese perspective.

And if that fails, there's some people who have figured out the couple of recipes that always seem to win you could google if you want to spoiler yourself.

At least it's similar to the OGs in this way. LOL

[chiyen]

Originally posted by Loathing:

What is happening with this minigame?!
I got Iugo who said, 'I'm in the mood for pickled plums' so I made the dish that has pickled plums. He gave it 5, the other judges were 0 1 0.

One character specifically said they love Raclette, so I made raclette. 0 5 1 0?! So I lost....

Remember, these guys / ladies / kids / non-humans are NOT trained to be judges for food.

So they (4 out of 4) may think a Miso Soup is equally qualified and scored as a "Dessert" as a cup of ice cream does; as long as they are edible and served after the main dish.

[Loathing]

I see what both of you are saying, but they completely lack any game design perspective. I have no information on this minigame except what the judges say in their dialog.

If I follow that, my success is a coin toss (actually seemingly worse than a coin toss).

That is objectively BAD game design. Like almost every other system in this game.

[Syselie]

If you want to please the whole judge panel, you'd have to go with basic dishes. Otherwise it's RNG on if two of judges generally like the same things (ie, spicy dishes, Eastern dishes, etc. Needs some fortune telling).

[Raelic]

We didn't argue with you about it though.

[fefnir3284]

Suikoden was teh same. Most choices didnt make sense. Like sweets? hate Ice cream Raggy???

[Loathing]

So... the feedback is that it is RNG from one person, and the other person just says Suikoden was just as bad.


Wtf is wrong with this game community? Is there a gas leak in here? Do you really just not want good games?

[Dynelf]

I don't guarantee an 100% win rate, but I haven't lost once while using:
Appetizer: Poached Egg
Main Course: Fried Egg
Dessert: Omelet
I personally hate eggs, but most people seem to like the Fried Egg and Omelets in the game. The Poached Egg can likely be replaced, but it hasn't failed me yet.

Story-wise I've yet to go into the castle at Hishahn, but I've unlocked every character available to me so far (I think), minus the one for completing all the cooking battles (I mention this to give an idea for what judges I've won against by cooking eggs). I've beaten one "assassin" so far after handing the Scroll of Heaven to Kurtz. And every cook up to and including that battle lost to the Egg dishes, lol.

[Syselie]

So because we're not as outraged, we suddenly don't want good games? I tolerate it. I never said it was great, simply what it is and how they seem to score.

This game has tons of mini games so to me, it makes sense they're all simple in addition to the main story. They can still improve upon it as time permits, but for now, if you want to complete it for achievements/to recruit/whatever, this is what you do.

[Stoibs]

Originally posted by Raelic:

it does start to make more sense if you think about it from a Japanese culture perspective more.

How are supposed to do that in a vacuum 😭
I uh.. figure they like rice.. and maybe sushi?

Sounds like the advice is to just use google, at which point I may as well just follow a guide (looks like there's already one in the guides section here)

[Loathing]

Originally posted by Syselie:

So because we're not as outraged, we suddenly don't want good games? I tolerate it. I never said it was great, simply what it is and how they seem to score.

This game has tons of mini games so to me, it makes sense they're all simple in addition to the main story. They can still improve upon it as time permits, but for now, if you want to complete it for achievements/to recruit/whatever, this is what you do.

I'm really not outraged. I'm disappointed in the game I kickstarted 5 years ago and annoyed at the response. It's okay, I'm trying to discuss game design here, and your next response actually responded to that! It makes me feel heard that you agree that it is simple and not great.

Overall, I think it is BAD game design and completely lacking any solution outside of trial and error.

In addition, I feel that almost every game system inside this game is similarly poorly designed. And that's just too bad, don't-cha think?

[Raelic]

Originally posted by Stoibs:

Originally posted by Raelic:

it does start to make more sense if you think about it from a Japanese culture perspective more.

How are supposed to do that in a vacuum 😭
I uh.. figure they like rice.. and maybe sushi?

Sounds like the advice is to just use google, at which point I may as well just follow a guide (looks like there's already one in the guides section here)

You're not in a vacuum. It's not a hard topic to educate yourself on a bit.

[Loathing]

Originally posted by Raelic:

Originally posted by Stoibs:

How are supposed to do that in a vacuum 😭
I uh.. figure they like rice.. and maybe sushi?

Sounds like the advice is to just use google, at which point I may as well just follow a guide (looks like there's already one in the guides section here)

You're not in a vacuum. It's not a hard topic to educate yourself on a bit.

I really don't think reading an article on Japanese food preferences is going to get me any closer to solving this mini game in a reliable way.

Wait... It sounds like you're advocating for a simple game solution method. What's it called?

That's right! Trial and error!

That's bad game design. So... why not just not respond anymore, and leave this comment section to people who want to discuss what good and bad game design is? Can you answer this specific question?

[Syselie]

Originally posted by Loathing:

Originally posted by Syselie:

So because we're not as outraged, we suddenly don't want good games? I tolerate it. I never said it was great, simply what it is and how they seem to score.

This game has tons of mini games so to me, it makes sense they're all simple in addition to the main story. They can still improve upon it as time permits, but for now, if you want to complete it for achievements/to recruit/whatever, this is what you do.

I'm really not outraged. I'm disappointed in the game I kickstarted 5 years ago and annoyed at the response. It's okay, I'm trying to discuss game design here, and your next response actually responded to that! It makes me feel heard that you agree that it is simple and not great.

Overall, I think it is BAD game design and completely lacking any solution outside of trial and error.

In addition, I feel that almost every game system inside this game is similarly poorly designed. And that's just too bad, don't-cha think?

The shblooey person divinates character bios. Some of them have hints to hero palates otherwise it's legit trying to use the heroes in battle, talking to them outside, to find out what they like. It's tedious, but makes sense to have to get to "know" them. And on top of that, it's RNG on which heroes will be on a panel. Each hero's tastes are different, so to put out one dish one might love risks offending someone else, so it's better to go with something basic to get "average" scores. To me, that all makes sense. What would you have designed differently?

[Loathing]

Originally posted by Syselie:

Originally posted by Loathing:

I'm really not outraged. I'm disappointed in the game I kickstarted 5 years ago and annoyed at the response. It's okay, I'm trying to discuss game design here, and your next response actually responded to that! It makes me feel heard that you agree that it is simple and not great.

Overall, I think it is BAD game design and completely lacking any solution outside of trial and error.

In addition, I feel that almost every game system inside this game is similarly poorly designed. And that's just too bad, don't-cha think?

The shblooey person divinates character bios. Some of them have hints to hero palates otherwise it's legit trying to use the heroes in battle, talking to them outside, to find out what they like. It's tedious, but makes sense to have to get to "know" them. And on top of that, it's RNG on which heroes will be on a panel. Each hero's tastes are different, so to put out one dish one might love risks offending someone else, so it's better to go with something basic to get "average" scores. To me, that all makes sense. What would you have designed differently?

Great response!

I hadn't thought of reading through the annoying diviner's bio on each character and trying to find hints on food likes and dislikes. Though, I have read through a few biographies and I also don't think this would be a reliable method. I read through a dozen and I can't think of any that would have helped me here. Maybe there are a few hints in there though. I would definitely include more, though, from a game design perspective, if I wanted the player to think about this.

I don't think I've really talked to any characters around the castle and had them discuss what food they like. I WOULD have more dialog options which discuss food preferences if I wanted the player to think about that.

What would I have done differently? I would have some amount of information given to the player to give them an idea of what to do that would give them an edge beyond RNG. That's all that matters. Player info > RNG. Currently, they have failed in that regard.